Possible to have HARD elite NPCs at CNBs/HazRez/HighCZ/piratelords?
- Thread starter sb413197
- Start date
Alligator death roll manuever, because the NPCs clearly think that Star Fox tactics will save them!
It blows my mind how dense some people are about the argument for proper AI. Difficulty aside when AI is bad even if it could be more difficult with smaller ships it isn't rewarding to players who like an honest challenge. An honest challenge is different from an inflated challenge.(using smaller ships, which believe it or not dials down AI)
I normally fly smaller ships for the fun of not having an answer for every situation. But it still doesn't scratch the itch that having AI doing proper maneuvers and doesn't 'act like a target' instead of trying to try and avoid being shot.
I normally fly smaller ships for the fun of not having an answer for every situation. But it still doesn't scratch the itch that having AI doing proper maneuvers and doesn't 'act like a target' instead of trying to try and avoid being shot.
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Doesn't make a difference bad AI is bad AI. Doesn't matter if you gold in your hull or not.
FD has good AI just sitting on the shelf. It would be nice for people who want to face good AI to have places to fight them. Make system security forces have it, make a higher difficulty instances for those that want it, and make top tier mission NPCs like pirate lords and assassin targets have the AI.
Troy_McClure
Banned
Is that vid not exactly how an engagement between a small, well flown fighter & a big ship with NO turrets should go down?
Tbf on Frontier's AI, not all NPCs are that ineffective; I fought a Conda with four turrets in my part-engineered m/c DBS recently & had to run away before I could kill it...this is ofc the exception rather than the rule! So while I agree we need a significant NPC buff &/or new engineered AI zones - especially for players who engineer their Corvettes, FDLs & Cutters - it is not purely a black & white issue.
For me, their piloting skills are generally pretty good (maybe a little more variation in tactics is needed) but their firepower & thrusters tend to be pathetic in comparison to a players' ships, thus enabling a cmdr to out-tank & outrun equivalent ships every time - this is where changes are definitely needed.
Should? Maybe, if the pilot of the Anaconda was suicidally determined.
Would? Not at all.
In practice, an Anaconda with no turrets can still put it's weapons on a well piloted Viper (assuming neither have modded drives) often enough to drive off the Viper almost all the time...assuming the pilot is moderately competent (a Deadly pilot should qualify).
Even if the Anaconda pilot is utterly outmatched in skill and cannot bring his or her weapons to bear on the Viper, the sensible option is to disengage, not maneuver ineffectually until destroyed.
There are players who want everything nerfed and players who want everything to be as risky as possible, to the detriment of anyone on the opposite end of the skill scale. It's just noise the game will always cater to the average player because it's an MMO so no difficulty selection beyond ship and outfitting, better to accept that and tweak the game yourself so you enjoy it.
The problem with your reasoning is that most of the people asking for harder AI in this thread aren't asking for a buff across the board, they are asking for tougher AI in certain areas. Doesn't seem like a terrible thing to ask for.
I don't think there is any disagreement on the OP's request other than the detail of what type of scenario it should be. The conversation has moved on to being more about general risk.
I'd like to see a bug free AI so we all get a baseline, & go from there. Personally I think if it comes to you it needs to cater to (almost) the lowest ability, if you go to it (and can therefore avoid it) it can scale to impossible.
Which is a non-starter as it will result in masses of whining from people who enter anyway then can't survive in those certain area's.
Look at it from the opposite angle how would you feel about a downgrade in AI ability. Thats how less capable players react to requests like this.
I have put the Corvette into storage for now.
With its fully engineered huge MCs and turreted beams, it was too easy to pick off targets and melt them in seconds.
So now I'm in a FdL with fixed PAs and rails, trying to learn to fly Isinona-style. Now there's a challenge!
Small ships become much harder to kill and Elites are now more difficult to take down.
With its fully engineered huge MCs and turreted beams, it was too easy to pick off targets and melt them in seconds.
So now I'm in a FdL with fixed PAs and rails, trying to learn to fly Isinona-style. Now there's a challenge!
Small ships become much harder to kill and Elites are now more difficult to take down.
This guy gets it.
Though I imagine Stigbob is correct in his prognostication that people are going to complain about advanced NPC challenge even if they are sequestered to certain systems/zones/scenarios, I still yearn for a proper NPC challenger and dearly wish Fdev would consider this instead of just throwing up their collective hands and catering to the lowest common denominator.
This attitude is why the Thargoids are going to suck sweaty trucker , despite the years' long ominous build-up.
@Dogeh--same, but with PvP
This attitude is why the Thargoids are going to suck sweaty trucker , despite the years' long ominous build-up.
@Dogeh--same, but with PvP
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Deadly Thargoids twatting half the bubble and ravaging the fleeing survivors all of whose stored ships were destroyed in the the first wave would be phenomenal (for some like me). But realistically they'll be seperated from the bubble and you'll have to seek them out and there will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth by some of those who do, both that they are over and under powered.
I'll go have a dabble decide on a ship/loadout thats reasonably effective but challenging fun then have at them with my mining beam adder or whatever.
Sure, it's completely too much to ask for, but imagine how much a controlled alien invasion could add to all the professions of the game.
Leave the bubble intact but fractured, so that traders and explorers had to navigate the long around blacked out regions filled with Thargoid hostiles. CG's designed to repair damaged/destroyed bases & stations, etc.
Have the fractures radiate like spokes on a wheel, or zigzag like cracks on a mirror, and leave huge sections of the bubble unblemished. There are always going to be people who bitterly complain, but that's a poor basis to just go "Meh, let's just make Thargoid CZ's and call it good." If that's what happens, I'm probably out for good. I'm already more or less worn out on the PvE aspect of the game, and with the constant war waged against PvP, the Thargoid invasion is the only thing left to get my interest back up.
If the AI was downgraded in certain areas I wouldn't care because I just wouldn't go there. That's the problem. The participation award brigade feel they are entitled to everything to the detriment of every one. It's the same problem with open and solo. PvE numpty feels he is entitled to fly in open with a shieldless d rated hunk of junk and then complains when he gets destroyed.
This is why I promote the idea of removing all warning labels so the low end of the curve cull themselves instead of ruining things for every one.
You make a good point but I think it's worth a try. I imagine 2.4 will attempt to address this anyway, it could be a good way to test the new AI without giving any storyline away.
Yep and by calling everyone who approaches the game differently to yourself names the only thing you prove is that you are no better than the worst of the nerf everything campaigners.
Fly a smaller ship? Don't engineer your ship? Whining because a certain area is clearly marked as dangerous and you still go in on your own and die? For the love of Talos people. Lethal AI, in a controlled environment, that is completely optional, is still a no no? Yeah, let's completely remove all engineer mods and the big three and make me fly a ship that I flew in beta instead of raising the bar in certain area's. Downgrade low res by all means, put a bunch of npc's in haulers with unengineered modules all over the galaxy but reward those who have played the game we have been given with a challenge.
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