Engineers Laser Weapons and their ridiculous power demands...

[znôrt]

Fixed beams have no counter and the highest laser DPS.

Chaff, Target lock breaker, Dispersal field, Silent running/Heat sinks. The beams are still effective.

The perpetual beam makes aiming when lock is broken very easy. It's a giant laser pointer analogous to those used on modern assault rifles.

They do require a lot of capacitor energy to cool but as Morbad says they are well balanced given their damage output.

pretty much sums beams up, and why i love them!

however op is about pve farming, npc use very little countermeasures, and he wants to fire non stop, so there are more 'efficient' alternatives. (i would still go with some fixed beam anyway, just because ... beamtastic!)

 

[Devari]

Hi Nero,
Thanks for the comprehensive comments and I agree with much that you have said. Obviously, I'm not looking for the same DPS from a 402 vs 204 cap config. As you rightly say, that's just not possible and is simply ridiculous to suggest it is possible - that is not what I was trying to get to!

What I was trying to obtain was a half-decent laser based loadout to remove the ammo rearm requirements but still keep 4 pips to shields so that it's possible to just farm HazRes and CZs without the shields going down like a blown lightbulb. I'll have a look at the Fully Pulse weapons only build options but my hunch is that they simply will not deliver anything like the DPS of the huge MC/Large Burst/Med-Sml Pulse configuration I have been using (which is a half-way house I guess).

If you're looking at the most efficient damage setup that doesn't require ammo then long-range modded pulse lasers tend to be the most efficient. The downsides are that they lack the sustained damage of multicannons and the burst damage of beams but with a long-range mod they can deliver consistent damage to decent ranges. I actually find beams and multicannons are also much more satisfying to use, there's something about the sound of sustained beam fire and the impact of the multicannon rounds that makes them more fun and that's one of the main reasons I don't use pulse lasers any more in my builds.

I was just shocked at how much more power beams require to run even for a short period! I'm not a PvP player so extreme (ly skewed) offensive builds are not my thing. I'm just not Nerdy enough to compete on that level where you have to do a lot of micro-Engineering with the numbers to balance the build like a car mechanic on a F1 racing car to stand half a chance in PvP... let alone know in detail the subtleties of every module modification and weapon experimental effect and that's without considering getting God-Rolls on the RNGensis! For those that want to take it to the limits - knock yourselves out! I simply don't have the hours to put into the game that all of that above demands. The Engineers has pretty much closed that door to ever even considering trying PvP now, simply because the ship build requirements have now become locked behind 100's of hours of RNGineering before you can even start on that road! It has split the game into two very distinct flavours for me (PvE and PvP) imo, which is a real shame.

I think the main issues that fragmented the game into PvE and PvP "builds" were mostly due to the massively imbalanced grefing, the lack of any proper crime and punishment system and the widespread use of the Engineering exploit by "PvP" groups. There is actually some good PvP that you can find now during CGs where players on opposite sides of a CZ fight each other with what are essentially PvE builds. I haven't actually been interdicted or griefed by anyone with the "extreme" PvP builds since FD removed the Engineering exploit so I suspect that much of that imbalance was from the large number of exploit rolls the PvP groups relied upon rather than any true "skill" in either their loadout choice or piloting abilities. I suspect the balance between PvP and PvE is now much closer than many players expect and once FD puts a proper crime and punishment system in place it will go a long way towards closing the PvE/PvP gap even further.

I usually stock up on the basic Synth materials before heading into a HazRes so that I can restock my huge MCs. I'll try the 303 MC/Beam config with the SCBs and see how that fairs once I have these modded.

I currently use a pair of efficient class 4 beams along with a class 3 corrosive multi and class 2 corrosive multi turrets and I tend to go back and forth between a 4/0/2 setup and a 2/0/4 setup to recharge the capacitor. In practice however I can actually keep 4 pips to shield much of the time which I prefer to a static 3/0/3 setup. The main issue with my build is that the effective range of the beams due to the damage drop off is much shorter than for multicannons so you need to use much closer engagement ranges around 600 m but it's actually a rather effective loadout for sustained RES or CZ combat.

 

[HeavyGroovez]

If you're looking at the most efficient damage setup that doesn't require ammo then long-range modded pulse lasers tend to be the most efficient. The downsides are that they lack the sustained damage of multicannons and the burst damage of beams but with a long-range mod they can deliver consistent damage to decent ranges. I actually find beams and multicannons are also much more satisfying to use, there's something about sound of the sustained beam fire and the impact of the multicannon rounds that makes them more fun and that's one of the main reasons I don't use pulse lasers any more in my builds.



I think the main issues that fragmented the game into PvE and PvP "builds" were mostly due to the massively imbalanced grefing, the lack of any proper crime and punishment system and the widespread use of the Engineering exploit by "PvP" groups. There is actually some good PvP that you can find now during CGs where players on opposite sides of a CZ fight each other with what are essentially PvE builds. I haven't actually been interdicted or griefed by anyone with the "extreme" PvP builds since FD removed the Engineering exploit so I suspect that much of that imbalance was from the large number of exploit rolls the PvP groups relied upon rather than any true "skill" in either their loadout choice or piloting abilities. I suspect the balance between PvP and PvE is now much closer than many players expect and once they get a proper crime and punishment system in place it will go a long way towards closing the PvE/PvP gap even further.



I currently use a pair of efficient class 4 beams along with a class 3 corrosive multi and class 2 corrosive multi turrets and I tend to go back and forth between a 4/0/2 setup and a 2/0/4 setup to recharge the capacitor. In practice however I can actually keep 4 pips to shield much of the time which I prefer to a static 3/0/3 setup. The main issue with my build is that the effective range of the beams due to the damage drop off is much shorter than for multicannons so you need to use much closer engagement ranges around 600 m but it's actually a rather effective loadout for sustained RES or CZ combat.

Repped, solid assessment

 

[betc]

Switched from MCs to beams prior to the weekend. MAN they Chew power fast, but they dun run out. I spend much less time flying to restock and way more time frying ships. I've now got 10*4a scb as they don't over heat. Cashing in around 12m bounties before my rail guns wear out.
2*huge beam
1*large beam all efficient
2*med rails, so much fun
2*sm Canon - looking for suggestions

Similar to 5 MC's , 2 sm pulse. Usually take shields down on the first volley.

I missed the fry sound of the beams.
Running 2-0-4 all the time rather than 4-0-2.

That's why I have so many scb

Lots of fun, and by no means worse than MCs. Recommend u guys try both setups on the Vette.

Helps if u have red laser and jet cone colours as that adds way more dps!!!

 

[HeavyGroovez]

Switched from MCs to beams prior to the weekend. MAN they Chew power fast, but they dun run out. I spend much less time flying to restock and way more time frying ships. I've now got 10*4a scb as they don't over heat. Cashing in around 12m bounties before my rail guns wear out.
2*huge beam
1*large beam all efficient
2*med rails, so much fun
2*sm Canon - looking for suggestions

Similar to 5 MC's , 2 sm pulse. Usually take shields down on the first volley.

I missed the fry sound of the beams.
Running 2-0-4 all the time rather than 4-0-2.

That's why I have so many scb

Lots of fun, and by no means worse than MCs. Recommend u guys try both setups on the Vette.

Helps if u have red laser and jet cone colours as that adds way more dps!!!

I'm guilty of red weapons !

 

[betc]

im 40/50/60
Shd 4196.0 (6998.7KI/8456.4TH/10134.5EX)
i just added a 3 sec KWS which took my thermal under 10000mjs but man its worth it... so much extra cash from bounties

build is below, now its time to make the rail guns sturdy which will help a bit with power draw

http://www.edshipyard.com/#/L=A0z0,...Rgy1IkfeT7go87go87go852207go87go07go87go87fE8

 

[rrobes]

I've tried any number of combos in my Corvette's weaponry. Started w/ an all MC HICAP magazine load-out which gave no heat issues and was good on all kind of NPC's.

W/ the HICAP option, it could stay in a CZ forever w/ ammo synthesis. The only limiting factor was the number of shield cell re-loads or if you get tired of farming.

I then tried a combo of 4C MC's and pulse lasers, it worked, just took longer time to kill. Not as satisfying.

I've settled on my last build, 2 4C HICAP MC gimballed, 2 2F HICAP MC turrets, 1 3B PA and 2 1D rails.

This last build is not as effective on smaller targets as an all MC build, but good enough, but it is murder on the big ships.

The small rails really hit much harder that any other weapon I've used there and in combo w/ the 3B PA, they eat up a ship after shields come down.

There are some quirks, the rails and PA are fixed so they have to be assigned to a secondary trigger. The PA fires off first, then there is a delay and the rails go off, they also have different trajectories.

The Corvette is heat tolerant but w/ rails you can't hold down the trigger after firing, you'll heat up fast if you do.

It takes some getting used to but I enjoy it. The different weapons also add some colors and effects that other builds didn't so there is visual excitement.

Once one has run the Corvette for a while and gotten the top mods, one can take on high rated NPC wings of Anacondas, Vultures and they don't stand a chance.

One last point, I fly in Open 99% of the time and my rig gives me a chance one on one and in a wing as support can put out significant damage.

 

[betc]

Maybe I could try turrets in the class one slots..hmm. it's my first time using rails... Omgz good fun

 

[StiTch]

No, they are not balanced. Lazors do have one practical advantage - they are hitscan.

While some figures look a little squiffy, the sentiment expressed in OP is correct: MCs are almost entirely advantageous outside of the above.

 

[Xious]

I like 2 Huge Eff Beams w/vents and the rest OC MC's.

 

[Ddraig]

Right now I am using 2 Huge efficient thermal vent fixed beams. A pair of Overcharged high yield medium cannons, a pair of Short range blaster corrosive and incendiary small multicannons and a large long range thermal shock pulse laser.
The beams take the shields, the multis decrease armor rating and the cannons rip modules like paper. The large laser deals with running enemies and when I need to (role play) defend a poor miner from afar while get there.

Overall it has worked rather good, if not excellent for me.

 

[Susanna]

Today I tried fitting two G5 Long Range turreted medium size beams with thermal vent special effect. This was instead of the turreted rapid fire Pulse weapons I had on these slots. I was simply blown away!

INARA suggests that the range benefit is 100%, which I took to mean that the min range and max range would be doubled.

Pulse and Burst lasers have a min range of 500m (100% of DPS) [600m for beam weapons] and then falls off to a max range of 3000m. I was expecting this to change to 1000m min and 6000m max. But this isn't what happens. The min and max are increased to be the same max value. So I was getting about 5.5km range with NO DPS drop off! The min range was 5.5km! Same as the max range.

Hence, the effective DPS at a typical 1.5km away target is about 40% more, and beyond that it is obviously a lot more. What was awesome was that these two beams would fire at a range of 5.5km with no jitter! Picking off targets as they approached within firing range.

The thermal vent also does an amazing job of keeping the ship cool. Even when firing everything, the Corvette max heat was 60%! Even when the target ship was chaffing and the beams were missing!

this was with:
2 small rapid fire pulse turrets
2 medium long range turreted beams with thermal vent 1 large efficient burst gymbaled
1 huge efficient beam with thermal vent gymbaled
1 huge rapid fire MC with corrosive gymbaled

I'm now switching all my laser weapons to long range beams with thermal vent and see how things go. I'll start with the Burst laser. The turrets just fire away at the target. The gymbaled weapons only come into play when the target is within 1.5km. The MC was only needed to quickly kill condas. Everything else the lasers were enough (even FDLs). I clocked 3.5mil in a haz res and still had loads of ammo in the huge MC.

Edit this was with a 303 capacitor configuration.

 

[Ozram]

Fixed beams have no counter and the highest laser DPS.

Chaff, Target lock breaker, Dispersal field, Silent running/Heat sinks. The beams are still effective.

The perpetual beam makes aiming when lock is broken very easy. It's a giant laser pointer analogous to those used on modern assault rifles.

They do require a lot of capacitor energy to cool but as Morbad says they are well balanced given their damage output.

Thermal resistant shields are the general counter, no?

 

[Ozram]

Right now I am using 2 Huge efficient thermal vent fixed beams. A pair of Overcharged high yield medium cannons, a pair of Short range blaster corrosive and incendiary small multicannons and a large long range thermal shock pulse laser.
The beams take the shields, the multis decrease armor rating and the cannons rip modules like paper. The large laser deals with running enemies and when I need to (role play) defend a poor miner from afar while get there.

Overall it has worked rather good, if not excellent for me.

Sounds pretty dangerous. You know the thermal shock takes away a massive amount of direct damage though right?

 

[Susanna]

Sounds pretty dangerous. You know the thermal shock takes away a massive amount of direct damage though right?

Not sure what you mean here... What are you implying? I'm using thermal vent, not thermal shock. Can you explain what you mean please.

 

[Ozram]

Not sure what you mean here... What are you implying? I'm using thermal vent, not thermal shock. Can you explain what you mean please.

I was replying to Ddraig's build. He has one large thermal shock pulse laser. Thermal shock increases heat at a massive loss to direct damage potential. It also requires two to reach maximum effectiveness (suppressive effect bringing opponents heat level to the edge of damage). Personally I'd have gone with scramble Spectrum.