Serious discussion about Proper Fleet/Squadron Mechanics

Vicktore Beskor

Vicktore Beskor
Hello Commanders

I would like to take this time to start the discussion about (PSM) Proper Fleet/Squadron Mechanics. Now i am not going to create a wall of text about " I TOLD YOU SO". What i want to do is to Thank Frontier Development for acknowledging those in the community who have been in favor of this type of gameplay.
Now down to business. What i hope to achieve with this thread is an open and honest conversation that will help the developers understand what the player base would like to see in the (PSM). So to start it off simply i am going to list a few things i would like to and a few questions i have.

Wish List...
1. Squadron mail
2. Squadron communication
3. Squadron HQ
4. Squadron Ranks
5. Squadron Storage
6. Squadron Bank

I have more on my wish list but i feel i want to start simple and work my way up.

Question List...

1. How will the (PSM) tie into or support our (PMF) Player Minor Faction
2. How many commanders can the Squadron have in it
3. How many fleet Carriers can the Squadron own
4. can a Squadron pledge to a super power

I will stop there i have many more questions but like i said. i want to leave room for the others to leave wish list and question list.

Thank you
Founder VIcktore Beskor (EDF)
Fly Strong 07
http://www.earthdefensefleet.net/
https://inara.cz/wing/486/
[video=youtube_share;EG_h8fe1_xg]https://youtu.be/EG_h8fe1_xg[/video]
[video=youtube_share;9nIlJL2ed3E]https://youtu.be/9nIlJL2ed3E[/video]
 
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MarcusKross

MarcusKross
187.gif



Here we go again :D

inb4 Elite is not Eve
inb4 goonswarm


Also, i told you guys so.
 
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yodajedifishmaster

yodajedifishmaster
not turning this into EVE is important. how will federation and empire and alliance react to private navies? in peace, go demand they surrender their ships. in war like now either just destroy them (less likely) or conscript them to save their own fleets some damage to fight thargoids.
 

PhanttoM

PhanttoM
The EvE discussion isn't relevant — the things listed, are indeed pretty bog-standard MMO group tools.

I ran very, very a small "real-life-friends-of-friends-and-acquaintances" in Planetside 2 and Elder Scrolls Online — both of which have most of the things on that list. (Whichever is relevant to each game)
 

Moritasgus

Moritasgus
My speculation: (from a different thread)
Squadrons will likely just be another 'friends' list, i get the feeling those who are expecting mega player factions and other such things will be disappointed.
It'll probably just have in game squadron broadcasts (chat) and maybe a tag but i doubt it'll have the staples like banks, pvp conflicts etc etc.
Just be a good way to manage a group of players inside the game but not game changing for the solo player.
Solo players assumedly will be able to form solo squadrons an get their own megaship but again i expect it to be in the hundreds of billions.
Carriers = Megaship with docking and refuel, lets not get carried away its anything else.
Speculation over...

I'm ok with this, the game seriously needed a 'friends list' update and hopefully they can do a nice job of it with squadron rosters and such. For me they don't need to take it any further than that and 'guild chat' to make in game comms easier.
I hope zero features are added that makes the solo player need to be in a guild, i play with like minded players and having a better way of associating with them in game is needed. Squadron specific content isn't.

An ability to tie yourself to any minor faction would be useful but not essential, simply being able to call your Squadron the same as your PMF or other chosen faction would be fine with me.
 

El Grillo

E
Yeah pretty much they just need to add the basic features of any other massively multiplayer game that's out there. i.e. comms & mail.
However what would also be really good would be location info - either the ability to see other squadron players' locations on galaxy map, or perhaps ability for squadron leadership to set a current hub system marker, or orders markers. Definitely need the location of the fleet carrier.
As for ranks, having different assigned roles with different powers is probably important. There are security considerations as well of course.

As you say though, it's important that it integrates in some way with existing mechanics, i.e. wings and minor factions. Having a fleet commander leadership position, where the assigned player is able to give orders to different squadron wings, would be awesome.
 

CMDR Dreamstate

CMDR Dreamstate
yodajedifishmaster said:
not turning this into EVE is important. how will federation and empire and alliance react to private navies? in peace, go demand they surrender their ships. in war like now either just destroy them (less likely) or conscript them to save their own fleets some damage to fight thargoids.
Click to expand...

Squadrons already exist in the game in all but name and aren't greatly supported, hence the need for officiality. I'm with Communism Interstaller Union (CIU) and a part of the Border Coalition, only one of which is a minor faction whom I'm a member of outside of the game. Above all, I hope player minor factions are tied into squadrons.

It won't turn into Eve because frontier are still keeping a leash on core mechanics (unfortunately), but at least the leash will roll out twenty more feet than it currently does.
 

frostypaw

frostypaw
Vicktore Beskor said:
Hello Commanders

I would like to take this time to start the discussion about (PSM) Proper Fleet/Squadron Mechanics. Now i am not going to create a wall of text about " I TOLD YOU SO". What i want to do is to Thank Frontier Development for acknowledging those in the community who have been in favor of this type of gameplay.
Now down to business. What i hope to achieve with this thread is an open and honest conversation that will help the developers understand what the player base would like to see in the (PSM). So to start it off simply i am going to list a few things i would like to and a few questions i have.

Wish List...
1. Squadron mail
2. Squadron communication
3. Squadron HQ
4. Squadron Ranks
5. Squadron Storage
6. Squadron Bank

I have more on my wish list but i feel i want to start simple and work my way up.

Question List...

1. How will the (PSM) tie into or support our (PMF) Player Minor Faction
2. How many commanders can the Squadron have in it
3. How many fleet Carriers can the Squadron own
4. can a Squadron pledge to a super power

I will stop there i have many more questions but like i said. i want to leave room for the others to leave wish list and question list.

Thank you
Founder VIcktore Beskor (EDF)
Fly Strong 07
Click to expand...

Can we have a wall of "I told you so" text about how this is going to open them up to yet more demands and drama demanding more gang-war features just like this OP? Goodbye storyline, we knew you just about
 

The Chairmaker

The Chairmaker
I dont mind squadrons provided it doesnt end up so overpowered that it becomes almost compulsory to join one if you want to do anything in the game.

I am concerned that once squadrons are in place. The community will be full of whining squadron Leaders demanding their squadron gets access to special gear, and that another squadron is being treated more favourably.

Key is to provide squadrons with social tools in game, but not to provide them with god powers. They need to ensure their influence on the background sim remains minimal, otherwise it will be "gamed".

For example it was mentioned that the crime and punishment system would be further beefed up. This will be essential with squadrons, as otherwise it will be a free for all, for goon like behaviour.
Hence it needs to have in place something so that if a Squadron fleet carrier decends on say a high security federal system, and starts trashing it in a reign of terror, that the response is a fleet of farraguts and corvettes that would take down the Fleet carrier. Either destroying it, or most likely force it to retreat to initiate expensive repairs, that the Squadron members would then have to fund themselves. It would be like a collective rebuy.
That Fleet carrier would then also be regarded as insta kill in any other federation system, so would be limited to were it could travel.

I like the idea of squadrons for long range exploration missions. Having a mothership for distant worlds type expeditions would open up potential new game play avenues like sharing of codex information, or perhaps even a materials market.

The 800 pound gorilla in the room is instancing. its improved tremendously since launch but still plenty of network issues getting people to operate together without issue. For example think of multicrew and wings then add on the additional layer of squadron management within presumably the same instance. I pity the coders getting that to work.
 
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M00ka

M00ka
And already the I want's have started .....

To be honest I don't really care about these mega-ship/squadon things. If it works, all good, if it doesn't, those that are smart will just go and play in Solo or Private and let the Squadrons play with themselves ;)

But to me it would be foolish to start building your mighty squadron until you find out a few facts from FDev, like:

How big are these ships? Will there be a size limit on what craft can dock on them (would be a hoot if the only pads available were small .... lol). If they are player controlled, who gets to control it? Would the rest of a squadron be happy to give a multi billion credit ship over to one individual? And if so, what would happen if he disagreed with something, he may, since he is the nominated commander, to just take off in it one day. Now that would be embarrassing wouldn't it.

And what is to stop a squadron blockading a port or a planet, it wouldn't be difficult, just park it next to the nav beacon for a system and interdict everyone who goes passed. Or denying entry to Sol unless they pay a contribution to your Squadron ....

I won't even get into the funding mechanism and what a can of worms that could become, just look at the problems some other MMO's that require combined funding have run into.

Maybe I am a cynic, and to be honest I really hope this new initiative by FDev works as advertised, I can just see people like the OP jumping on the bandwagon before the wheels have been attached.
 

frostypaw

frostypaw
M00ka said:
But to me it would be foolish to start building your mighty squadron until you find out a few facts from FDev, like:
Click to expand...

Too late. The gang fans have been building since the game came out and assembling their list of features from all the other games they've done it to for years now and judging FDev as lacking that whole time - all those things you mention as problems are things I've heard people long for, with player group squabbling and in-fighting as the whole 'story' as they do little but complain about the actual game plot/story
 

Goose4291

Banned
Goose4291
M00ka said:
And already the I want's have started .....
Click to expand...

And the Eve-fear has already started

To be honest I don't really care about these mega-ship/squadon things. If it works, all good, if it doesn't, those that are smart will just go and play in Solo or Private and let the Squadrons play with themselves ;)
Click to expand...

Theyre already here, in the guise of the Gnosis (megaship owned by a preferred player group)

But to me it would be foolish to start building your mighty squadron until you find out a few facts from FDev, like:

How big are these ships? Will there be a size limit on what craft can dock on them (would be a hoot if the only pads available were small .... lol). If they are player controlled, who gets to control it? Would the rest of a squadron be happy to give a multi billion credit ship over to one individual? And if so, what would happen if he disagreed with something, he may, since he is the nominated commander, to just take off in it one day. Now that would be embarrassing wouldn't it.
Click to expand...

The Gnosis is a static asset 'moved' around on behalf of Cannon by the devs, and not controlled by the players veyond that, so this is likely how it will play out.

And what is to stop a squadron blockading a port or a planet, it wouldn't be difficult, just park it next to the nav beacon for a system and interdict everyone who goes passed. Or denying entry to Sol unless they pay a contribution to your Squadron ....
Click to expand...

Well firstly, if i wanted to.do that I dont need a megaship.

Secondly, 3 modes and p2p matchmaking even in open preclude blockades being effective beyond an 'RP' reason.
 

Vorxian

Vorxian
I'm seeing the squadron & fleet mechanic, based around a mothership as a fantastic PvE thing. Imagine being out in the void, 3000 LY from home, exploring systems and regions from a central mothership location where you can refuel, restock, repair and dock up again, then move on to new places. That would be excellent, sweep large regions quickly with a good fleet. Mining ops with a carrier... A lot could happen! But can you pilot a carrier, how would it handle log in / log out.. say I owned a carrier, and i flew my mates into the unknown, what would happen when I log.. will they log? will the ship vanish? will everyone be stranded in space? Will the mothership turn into a static station? What happens if I log in and the fleet aren't? I move the carrier another 2000ly.. will they all have to catch up?

Quezzies quezzies! Questions galore :)
 
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Banana's_Are_Good_For_You

Banana's_Are_Good_For_You
Vorxian said:
I'm seeing the squadron & fleet mechanic, based around a mothership as a fantastic PvE thing. Imagine being out in the void, 3000 LY from home, exploring systems and regions from a central mothership location where you can refuel, restock, repair and dock up again, then move on to new places. That would be excellent, sweep large regions quickly with a good fleet. Mining ops with a carrier... A lot could happen! But can you pilot a carrier, how would it handle log in / log out.. say I owned a carrier, and i flew my mates into the unknown, what would happen when I log.. will they log? will the ship vanish? will everyone be stranded in space? Will the mothership turn into a static station? What happens if I log in and the fleet aren't? I move the carrier another 2000ly.. will they all have to catch up?

Quezzies quezzies! Questions galore :)
Click to expand...
And how does this carrier manage to move 2000lys?
 
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