Player Planet Bases - An Actual Purpose

GraXXoR

GraXXoR
CMDR Crank Larson said:
The base building in NMS convinced me that I don't want it in E: D. I spent hours building a base too, but in retrospect I don't know why I bothered. Especially as Hello Games then changed pretty much everything in the last update and I had to redo a whole load of stuff (which of course, required new resources that I didn't have, even though I'd stockpiled huge amounts previously).

E: D is about flying spaceships, not building bases. Admittedly, NMS isn't (the flight model is absolutely terrible, so if it is about flying spaceships then they missed that by a wide mark) - it is more about exploration, and base building does seem to fit in more with how they have implemented things.
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What Elite needs is a mighty, endless credit sink that rewards the players (not one that just means spending to stay alive) and I think bases / squadron ships will be splendid wastes of credits. If they manage to keep future credit exploits under control, eventually the whales will run out of cash funding their various squadrons' endeavours and the inflation economy might even normalise.

Imagine a base where you could keep all your space suits in a gallery. Build a mighty hangar to house for all your ships and display and keep trophies and trinkets from successfully completed missions and CGs. It would give your commander a sense of history and progression even after triple/quad elite.

Flying is fun but Elite has a similar issue to NMS. It is too wide, too shallow with not enough core gameplay. After NMS 1.3 update, the enjoyable story and missions sounded nice so I just reset my game and started again: I read too many horror stories about bugged materials and missions to want to try and hack it. Still, it's a complete to rebuild the base with the new, nasty crafting system that makes glass hideously tedious to fabricate. Oh, and the Atlas path missions have some game stopping bugs... Currently playing ED and Cities Skylines (to keep my building juices flowing) and giving NMS a rest.
 

Bran Tse Mallory

Bran Tse Mallory
While this would offer some interesting game-play systems for groups and individuals I can't help but feel this is not what Elite is about at it's heart - That said however does not mean it cannot evolve into something other than what it currently is. Personally I'm a one ship, one pilot living in space kind of guy but I can see why people would want something like this.

The time to develop is what concerns me - Elite has a lot that needs to be updated and then there is the announced premium content and what ever that holds. As long as this is at the top of the 'plan' then all is well and good. Bases are something that they would need to get right not just for groups but for everyone. I've walked away from very good games that have given a bonus to groups while neglecting the individual players while other games that offer everyone the same chances are available. Playing Ark single player is just as much fun (for me at least) as playing it with a group of friends.
 

IndigoWyrd

IndigoWyrd
GraXXoR said:
I think they'd be fine even if they were instanced, like POIs are.

I also think they don't need a reason other than being super fun.

This is my Glass farm and research base in NMS

https://i.imgur.com/9ZOOes8.jpg

I had a good hundred hours of fun building it up unit by unit. I just don't see how Elite would be worse off for it...

Other than requiring one of the two devs still working on ED to move over from programming microtransactions, obviously ;-)
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That's a pretty snazzy facility you've got there. I've yet to get quite so fanciful with my own base-building. I tend to go for compact and practical myself. Kind of surprised not to see any Geodomes though - with 16 spots for planting, and no additional demand for resources, Biodomes are tough to beat.
 

[VR] Deggial

[VR] Deggial
I don't think, the actual purpose of player bases were disputed ... ever.

A safe haven for our fleeets, storage of (small) amounts of commodities/engineer related cargo, repair- and restock-capability - or simply the opportunity to create and individualize a place to call "home (base)". Indeed many, many threads revolve around desires like this. It definitely isn't the lack of ideas what to do with those bases that makes FDev reluctant to comment on these suggestions.

I still believe that one reason FDev is that they want us to be mobile and travel around, which is opposed by the idea of fixed bases.
But this probably not even the main issue.

Far more problematic is the question, how to implement interaction with other player's bases. Flavourles mentioned it already.
- Can they be attacked and destroyed? This would be a bad game mechanic, as absent players can't do something against the assault. (I don't fency ship-stealing with space-legs for the same reason, by the way.)
- Any player built defence system can be overcome with enough effort eventually.
- Making the bases and defence systems indestructible would obviously solve this issue. But it would arouse the question, why they are so tough ... (I could definitely live with this minor logical flaw, though.)

The second, even more serious problem is network load.
- Currently, the procedurally generated universe is really light on the storrage & loading side due to its very nature. There may be some handcrafted systems/planets, but that's it. Players in their ships increase the load already notably.
- Player bases would need to be stored and loaded as well. This increases the necessary server data capacity (I have no idea how much, though), but also the time to load all these bases into an instance. The universe may be big and bases might be scattered around, as 777Driver predicts. On the other hand - this is not guaranteed and there might very well be hotspots, where everybody and their dog wants to have a personal estate. It might not be likely, but the devs would have to plan for it!
- "Invisible" bases (loaded only for the owner and her/his firends/wing) might be the solution here and I could live with it, too. But wouldn't it be a little bit of a shame, if we can't see those player bases built at fency locations? They are - like paint jobs, ship kits and ship names an expression of ourselves and we want others to see those evidence of our existence.

So, there are way more severe issues with player bases than the lack of ideas about their use ...
 
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grumpsalot

G
Flavourless said:
Its the same as all the other player ownership madness.
Your assets are in my galaxy (its shared), I don't want them there for reasons, I destroy them, you cry.
Could only work if the galaxy wasn't persistent and shared, but thankfully it is.
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A permit-only system instanced to each player would sort that right out.
 

Crank Larson

Crank Larson
GraXXoR said:
What Elite needs is a mighty, endless credit sink that rewards the players (not one that just means spending to stay alive) and I think bases / squadron ships will be splendid wastes of credits. If they manage to keep future credit exploits under control, eventually the whales will run out of cash funding their various squadrons' endeavours and the inflation economy might even normalise.

Imagine a base where you could keep all your space suits in a gallery. Build a mighty hangar to house for all your ships and display and keep trophies and trinkets from successfully completed missions and CGs. It would give your commander a sense of history and progression even after triple/quad elite.
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I don't agree. :) These things would add nothing to my enjoyment of the game. Why would I want to look at ships in a hangar when I can simply jump in one and fly it somewhere? But of course, this is simply my view - it's obvious from all the threads that crop up that a lot of people don't actually like flying spaceships (though that always makes me wonder why they bought E: D!).

I stopped playing NMS simply because there was nothing for me to do in it (I'd completed the storylines). Went back after the update to find all stories reset and things changed... So, I started the Atlas Path again, realised that it was exactly the same, and gave up. I reinstalled my machine a few weeks ago due to faulty motherboard. I haven't put NMS back on there, and I'm not sure I ever will. It did give me an enjoyable couple of hundred hours of entertainment, though. By comparison, I've played E: D for well over two months.
 

[VR] Deggial

[VR] Deggial
grumpsalot said:
I guess one way would be to have no interaction, with each player base accessible only to that player and/or NPC's.
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As I wrote: I could live with this solution (and actually prefer it).

But as I also wrote: It is probably not the main issue. It's Instancing and a reasonable time to shovel around all the related data. As long as this isn't solved, we can find as many solutions for minor problems as we want.
 

CMDR Yates

C
Personally, I think if they were persistent, but unmarked to other players, and the only protection was the sheer vastness of the galaxy, that would be super cool. I mean, even if every player in the game had a planetary or gas-giant-ring base, and you set out looking for one without any clues, it would probably take years just to stumble on a random one. (Just to be clear, I don't think they should just hand these out to everyone, but even if they did...)

If they were made destructible, and unscrupulous players could steal your stuff, that would be amazing. Think of the gameplay opportunities: following players to remote systems and surveilling them, watching where they drop out of SC, then flying in once they're gone to rob them. Facing whatever defenses are set up and possibly the return of the rich guy in his heavily-armed Cutter That's a whole other avenue of gameplay for pirates. And having to watch your back and cover your tracks every time you head back to your base, watching for SC contacts; again, another .layer of gameplay and engagement.

So while it would convey some benefit to those rich enough to afford it, it also adds a layer of paranoia, difficulty and adversity, making them targets, in effect. Just like the wealthy in real life.

I get that a lot of people might not be happy about losing 1000 cargo while logged off and unable to do anything about it, but if that's an issue then don't store the stuff at your base. That's part of the trade-off: convenience vs risk. However, you would have some control over the outcome by carefully managing your approach to the base so dodgy people can't work out where it is, and possibly installing defences. Maybe there could be a "lockdown" mechanic whereby the base has the ability to lower itself down into the bedrock with a big blast door over it, but it takes time to power up. I dunno. The sense of helplessness could be mitigated a bit, while retaining some of the risk.
 
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[VR] Deggial

[VR] Deggial
How would this work with the shared galaxy for open and solo players?

The later have a reason and every right not to play with others. Why should their bases be prone to other player's interference?
 

Alec Turner

Alec Turner
Andovar said:
Personally, I'd prefer the 'less impact' approach of player bases being in asteroid fields, and keeping them instanced. Only the player, and any invited friends or wing mates can even see the beacon for them. That way they're not even accessible to the rest of the player base.
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How about simply being able to eject an entire cargo bay and tether it to an asteroid (or down on a planet somewhere) for later retrieval? That'd be pretty cool. And if another player stumbles upon it, or finds it by accident? So be it, they can simply steal it.
 

CMDR Yates

C
Deggial said:
How would this work with the shared galaxy for open and solo players?

The later have a reason and every right not to play with others. Why should their bases be prone to other player's interference?
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The question is essentially: should Solo players' desire to be left alone be a limiting factor for the development of the whole game? It's actually a good question. I'm really not sure of the answer to that, but part of me thinks it probably shouldn't be. I feel as though a game like Elite Dangerous shouldn't have its boundaries set by the most "timid" (for want of a better word) players. And I say that as someone who spends a lot of time in Solo.

The strictest of Solo players could still continue to play as normal without storing stuff in a base.

In some respects though, a Solo player would have it a lot easier, as no one would be able to follow them to find the unmarked base.
 
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Suvi Anwar

Suvi Anwar
Player base building a-la Fallout 4 settlement style would be AWESOME!
Besides, player housing (in this case a base) in large games like this (like most MMOs) would give us players a place or piece of the game world we can call home, for real. I will happily admit that in the 2000 hours I have played FO4, a significant number of them are in building my settlements by hand.
 
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