Do Elite NPC Crew members still take half your combat experience?

[V'larr]

UPDATE: See this post: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threa...lf-your-combat-experience.385740/post-6179692

TL/DR: Yes, and so do Wing members & their crew members, and no the split does not cease after they reach Elite. I'm quitting for now to play other games and give Fdev time to update and consider fixing issues like this one.

2022 update: This is still how this works. And still why most players are advised to ignore the feature.


Question in title. Does anyone know? (Yet another tidbit of rather vitally-important information that seems impossible to find...sigh.)

I've been using SLFs for the first time and been enjoying having a 'buddy' with me in my Corvette, but to my dismay I recently learned these pilots also 'steal' half your combat experience.

So with my next 'big goal' being to reach Combat Elite - I need to know: if I get my NPC's rank up to Elite, will it continue to steal half my experience after that point, or will I start getting full experience per kill once they hit that threshold? (edit: still waiting on the answer to this!)

 

[V'larr]

Bump for justice in the hope someone out there *cough cough Fdevs* has the answer....

 

[Shanaeri]

Their rate of ranking up is increased compared to you. They also take a % of everything you earn whether you use them or not.

See https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/6c5pfj/confirmed_using_npcs_hinder_combat_rank/

 

[V'larr]

t their rate of ranking up is increased compared to you. They also take a % of everything you earn whether you use them or not.

See https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/6c5pfj/confirmed_using_npcs_hinder_combat_rank/

Funnily enough it was reddit where I saw that they take half your experience and that someone had proof of it via keeping track of the kills they got with and without a SLF pilot...trying to dig that link up now....
edit: Found the quote but not the direct link:

In addition, I have been out with just my NPC SLF pilot and have found it is a 50/50 split between the two of you for combat XP, regardless of who gets the kill.

Without launching the fighter I ranked up 1% at Master by killing 2 x Elites, 2 x Deadly's, 1 x Dangerous, and 1 x Master. Total XP 9.75

After launching my NPC fighter pilot we killed 2 x Elite, 5 x Deadly's, and 4 x Dangerous. Total XP gain 16, total Master percentage gain for me 1%. Diving the sixteen by two we get 8 XP to go up 1%, this is in line with the earlier multicrew and FDL experiments above.

To summarise it seems that your Elite combat rank 'XP' gains are divided by two when using an NPC pilot (actually flying SLF not just aboard doing nothing).

If you carrying multicrew members these gains are divided amongst you and the crew, meaning you will only get 1/3 XP if carrying two other multicrew.

I'm aware their rate of ranking up is increased and I also never take them off "Defend" mode, so the occasions where they are "soloing" a kill is negligible.

edit: Actually, read into the thread - there are multiple support replies. This one in particular stands out as worrisome for me:

"I'm going to amend the previous comment to point to this one as it appears this thread has a fair bit of confusion in it.

Crew behave the same as wing members. If you have a crew member helping you take out other ships, you share the combat rank progression equally (assuming everyone in the fight is the same combat rank).

For example, if you have one crew member active and participating in a kill, you'd receive 50% of the progression you'd have gotten without that crew member active.

If you have a crew member and one wing member assisting you, you'll each get a third of the progression one of you would have gotten by doing the same thing solo.

So, if you have a crew member, make use of them! Take on something that's high ranked and poses a much greater challenge (and reward). If your crew are higher ranked than you, let them help. You'll get more for it and they'll get less. They're there to help, even if they do need to share with you.

And finally, we'd like to apologise for the previous confusion about this issue - I'm glad we could clear this up.

CMDR Vanguard"

Which basically confirms that NPC SLF pilots are stealing half the combat experience....

But, naturally, there's no information on that thread about what happens after said pilot reaches Elite rank.

 

[V'larr]

Surely someone out there has spent time figuring this out?

 

[Cmdr Aeries Hunter]

Funnily enough it was reddit where I saw that they take half your experience and that someone had proof of it via keeping track of the kills they got with and without a SLF pilot...trying to dig that link up now....
edit: Found the quote but not the direct link:


I'm aware their rate of ranking up is increased and I also never take them off "Defend" mode, so the occasions where they are "soloing" a kill is negligible.

edit: Actually, read into the thread - there are multiple support replies. This one in particular stands out as worrisome for me:


Which basically confirms that NPC SLF pilots are stealing half the combat experience....

But, naturally, there's no information on that thread about what happens after said pilot reaches Elite rank.

Wow had no idea! Great post. This info should have been made clear by the devs.

 

[Mano d'Oro]

Yeah, thanks for bringing that up, +repped! (Note to self: no hiring crew/installing a fighter bay until I hit combat Elite...!)

 

[Mrat13]

If you don't mind laying them off, you can get rid of them before you make any money, and then lose nothing. Also, if they're elite, I'm pretty certain they don't take any experience off you either. Only downside is you might feel cruel exploiting them.

 

[Codger]

Wow, I've never heard this either. Somehow that little fact slipped by me. Thanks for pointing it out, it certainly puts a damper on having a crew member.

As if there weren't enough dampers on them as it is. Amazingly weird game design on these.

I had just recently hired one and kept them around for the first time, myself. Just for the heck of it, really. But I didn't realize they took a cut of the combat experience from you, I thought it was just credits.

 

[ShadowWolf Kell]

"However, should your NPC crew member land a kill, you will not receive the credit and therefor will not receive the experience for the kill."


Apparently they can KS you as far as XP goes. If a player did that, you'd get neither the XP or the cash so working as intented. Don't let them get the kill and you won't have to worry about it. Never had an issue with mine here, since I manually tell them to focus my target while my Anaconda/Cutter pulverizes whatever it is into space dust.

Also explains why in the 2.3 beta both my crew and myself were increasing combat rank from CZs pretty quickly. I think I got 10-15% towards Elite just from two Anaconda videos I did, and my crew went from Competent to Master. During the Battle for Lugh (1.1-1.2 iirc), 1% towards Elite took awhile in CZs.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

Looks like a non-issue. In the quote from the reddit thread, the evidence that the SLF crew member is "stealing" experience doesn't add up. Can't just point out that the crew member stole half of the XP earned and just ignore the fact that twice as many experience points were earned with the SLF than without.

The CMDR in the quoted scenario earned 8 xp without the SLF, and with the SLF he took out more ships and the combined XP increased to 16XP, which was split between them, leaving the CMDR with 8XP. The extra kills from the SLF offset the XP split.

Go alone, get 8 XP.

Have SLF, get 8 XP.

It's a wash.

 

[V'larr]

"However, should your NPC crew member land a kill, you will not receive the credit and therefor will not receive the experience for the kill."

Read deeper into that thread, the other Support responses indicate that was erroneous and say differently....

I quote:

For example, if you have one crew member active and participating in a kill, you'd receive 50% of the progression you'd have gotten without that crew member active.

If you have a crew member and one wing member assisting you, you'll each get a third of the progression one of you would have gotten by doing the same thing solo.

Looks like a non-issue. In the quote from the reddit thread, the evidence that the SLF crew member is "stealing" experience doesn't add up. Can't just point out that the crew member stole half of the XP earned and just ignore the fact that twice as many experience points were earned with the SLF than without.

What do you mean it doesn't add up? He only went up a single percentage point despite earning 16 Xp vesus only 9.75 when solo to go up 1%. It's pretty clearly being split between him and his NPC pilot, and confirms the final Frontier_support post in the thread that I just quoted.

Having an SLF doesn't just magically get you extra kills, far from it - especially in combat zones. At best it's like having an extra huge hardpoint (and in my opinion should only be like having an extra pair of small/medium hardpoints, but I digress) that goes offline half the time.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

Read deeper into that thread, the other Support responses indicate that was erroneous and say differently....

I quote:





What do you mean it doesn't add up? He only went up a single percentage point despite earning 16 Xp vesus only 9.75 when solo to go up 1%. It's pretty clearly being split between him and his NPC pilot, and confirms the final Frontier_support post in the thread that I just quoted.

Having an SLF doesn't just magically get you extra kills, far from it - especially in combat zones. At best it's like having an extra huge hardpoint (and in my opinion should only be like having an extra pair of small/medium hardpoints, but I digress) that goes offline half the time.

Maybe I'm missing something, but:
- he earned 9.75 XP and he got 1% increase (1 CMDR)
- they earned 16 XP (2 CMDR, and more kills), and his share of their combined efforts was 1% increase
- he did NOT earn 16XP. THEY did.

Or

- one CMDR kills ships, earns 8XP and 1% increase

Vs

- two CMDRs go and kill ships, and one earns 9.75XP and the other earns 6.25 XP. Their combined XP was 16, but individually they earned what they earned.

If you and I went out together to kill ships and we each killed 10, I wouldn't turn around and say that since we killed 20 and I only got credit for 10, than you stole 10 from me.


The guy earned 8-9XP and a 1% increase with and without the SLF. When the SLF was active, they also killed more ships and the XP gained was reflective of the CMDR's XP gain based on ships destroyed and of the NPC crew member's XP gain based on ships destroyed.

 

[V'larr]

Maybe I'm missing something, but:
- he earned 9.75 XP and he got 1% increase (1 CMDR)
- they earned 16 XP (2 CMDR, and more kills), and his share of their combined efforts was 1% increase
- he did NOT earn 16XP. THEY did.

No. "They" would mean they *both* earned 16 XP. They each only earned 8 XP, meaning every kill they got was effectively halved in experience worth.

If you and I went out together to kill ships and we each killed 10, I wouldn't turn around and say that since we killed 20 and I only got credit for 10, than you stole 10 from me.

Working in a wing of multiple ships is one thing (and should still result in experience share, in my view). Being part of a single crew is another.

The guy earned 8-9XP and a 1% increase with and without the SLF. When the SLF was active, they also killed more ships and the XP gained was reflective of the CMDR's XP gain based on ships destroyed and of the NPC crew member's XP gain based on ships destroyed.

Reflective? What on earth is reflective about it? The NPC effectively took experience points that would have otherwise gone to the CMDR's sum total. Each individual kill's worth was halved.

If you were to grind to combat Elite while using an NPC, you would have to take twice as long.

That is why this is so frustratingly outrageous.


Also it still seems like *nobody* knows the answer to whether this applies to Elite NPC crew members too, or they at *least* stop stealing experience when they reach the cap at Elite.

 

[ebbrell]

Isn't it 16% they get if they are elite

 

[V'larr]

Isn't it 16% they get if they are elite

That's profit share, and that is dependent upon which rank you hired them at as well. I'm talking about *experience* gain here, something that is not at all made visible/explained ingame.

 

[Aashenfox]

Dale? Please could you ask someone about this for us? It really needs clarifying once and for all how it works (at all levels). I for one will stop using the fighter if it continues to eat my experience after it becomes elite. Thanks in advance.

 

[Infiltrait0r]

Isn't it 16% they get if they are elite

Mine is Deadly and takes 9%. At elite she will take 10 i think, but i raised her from harmless. And it's not xp but profit share.

To summarise it seems that your Elite combat rank 'XP' gains are divided by two when using an NPC pilot (actually flying SLF not just aboard doing nothing).

I'm not sure it has anything to do with the SLF is being launched or not. Npc crew earns xp even if i don't launch them. Maybe at a slower rate, i haven't done any research on this.


That being said i didn't even knew they take away not just credits but also xp.

 

[Athan]

As I just posted over on the source thread:

Depending on the rounding involved it's possible that 9.75 and 16 XP are both 1% increase in rank.

If we assume normal half-rounding, and that 16 XP was just under the 1.5% threshold (so would get rounded down to 1% rather than up to 2%), then 1% would be a little under 16 / 1.5 = 10.666(recurring). That's close enough for 9.75 to be rounded up to 1% as well.

To expand on the example, assume 1% would be 11XP, then 16XP is 16/ 11 = 1.45% and 9.75XP = 9.75 / 11 = 0.88%. Both will round to 1%.

Obviously this is also affected by exactly how far up from an integer percentage of rank progress you are, i.e. 0.6% actual progress can look like 1% if you were already on X.4% progress.

Not that the poster is necessarily wrong, it's just that the posted data doesn't concretely prove it.

 

[tomalus]

I am deadly
My npc pilot is deadly

He takes away 50% of my xp for each kill.Proof? It took me hours and hours of killing high ranked ships to get 1% progress.Its much faster when I go solo without npc pilot. It might even be that he gets more then 50% if he is lower rank then you.