So, why do you support a minor faction?

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Deleted member 147460

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I have posted a somewhat similar thread before, nevertheless, I am curious to hear some of the communities' thoughts. For those that do, why do you choose to support a particular NPC minor faction? With such vague descriptions, I am finding it difficult to find reasons to work for one minor faction over another. In some cases, such a democratic as opposed to an anarchy faction, the distinctions are fairly clear. On the other hand, there are often two minor factions that are both democracies and allied with the same superpower. Sometimes they have elections and one can help out through trading and such. Elections over what though? Without any context why should I care? Hopefully one can understand the gist of my concern.

To be 100 percent clear, I love that Elite is a sandbox, and I don't believe it should ever have a campaign or any type of linear story. That said, it is still possible to have a sandbox with more context. Perhaps I am missing something since I am relatively new to the game.
 
There are 30,000+ minor factions.....that's probably 29,000 too many IMO

Personally I don't care about any RNG organisation 'HIP 2597 Gold Foundation' is utterly meaningless to me.

I did try to fight a player faction (with a stupid name) that was dropped into my home system by the Devs (thanks for that btw) but I don't play enough to fight an entire group of dedicated players so I moved on.

The BGS and the sheer number of minor factions is another design decision that totally baffled me....I've written about this before.

But as one poster on here already stated, some have built communities around their factions and love the BGS gameplay, pushing their chosen faction into various states, fighting their wars, expanding their territory....so who am I to criticize.
 

Deleted member 147460

D
There are 30,000+ minor factions.....that's probably 29,000 too many IMO

Personally I don't care about any RNG organisation 'HIP 2597 Gold Foundation' is utterly meaningless to me.

I did try to fight a player faction (with a stupid name) that was dropped into my home system by the Devs (thanks for that btw) but I don't play enough to fight an entire group of dedicated players so I moved on.

The BGS and the sheer number of minor factions is another design decision that totally baffled me....I've written about this before.

But as one poster on here already stated, some have built communities around their factions and love the BGS gameplay, pushing their chosen faction into various states, fighting their wars, expanding their territory....so who am I to criticize.

Hmmm, at the moment, I tend to agree with you. Why is it necessary to have so many factions. Sometimes less is more. It can often seem like one giant mess that's hard to make sense of.
 
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There are 30,000+ minor factions.....that's probably 29,000 too many IMO

Personally I don't care about any RNG organisation 'HIP 2597 Gold Foundation' is utterly meaningless to me.

I did try to fight a player faction (with a stupid name) that was dropped into my home system by the Devs (thanks for that btw) but I don't play enough to fight an entire group of dedicated players so I moved on.

The BGS and the sheer number of minor factions is another design decision that totally baffled me....I've written about this before.

But as one poster on here already stated, some have built communities around their factions and love the BGS gameplay, pushing their chosen faction into various states, fighting their wars, expanding their territory....so who am I to criticize.


I was under the impression that there are around 75,000 NPC minor factions. To be honest, I really do love this variety. In the context of the game, it means that each of the 20,000+ bubble systems each have their own things going on which may or may not be in direct conflict with the systems just next door. It means that there is not a single narrative where one minor faction can become overwhelmingly powerful and reach past a few systems without a hell of a lot of positive energy going on. Which is a really good thing. It would be a bit pants if a large group of players could leverage a minor faction to span a large the breadth of bubble, would it not. It keeps the impression that each player is a fairly insignificant part of the galaxy and not some all-conquering super-hero at the centre of the galaxy plot. Which is exactly square-on to FDev's intent.


Why would I support any NPC faction?

Well, I'm pretty nomadic as a player, with no real ties to any home system or even an adopted system. So dropping into any random system if I were to take any missions, they would need to be aligned to my personal tastes. Federation. Democratic. My CMDR is pledged to Winters because this was the one head of faction that aligned with personal standards. That said, my CMDR never invests in PowerPlay and has never cashed in a single MERIT (tbh I'm not even sure what MERITs are or how you achieve them, I've only really seen them typed on forum posts to know the term exists).

I also avoid illegal missions and massacres, etc.

That means I would gravitate towards any NPC faction by a process of elimination. If they kept spawning missions that I like, then I might continue to hang around that system to help them grow their faction, while also helping me out.

Many CMDRs just game the system and take any factions missions, provided they are the desired missions, or provided they give the right rewards, such as engineer materials. My CMDR is much more principled. Not massively fussed about engineering, so doesn't sell out on principles just to gather the wanted materials.

I'm often to be found in certain systems just to occasionally assist some well known player factions keep their influence levels up. (Mainly because other unsavoury CMDRs work against them ((and they do this mainly, it appears, for out-of-game reasons. Shame on them!!)) Hence my principled CMDR lending my efforts). In consequence, I'll drop into a system while running one of those missions and scan the mission boards for anything else I can do, and if one of the NPC factions appears to be aligned and has acceptable missions, I'll take them on...


And this is what I spend a lot of time doing in-game perhaps 1/3 of my game time. Faction hopping and running missions. I'm not super-focussed at ship optimisation, fleet building, engineering, grinding for superpower rank or materials or even for money or combat rank or trade rank. All of those things will take care of themselves, in time. I just enjoy playing the game...

The other main game themes for me are science and exploration - again about another 1/3 of my game time near the bubble has concentrated on guardians missions and exploration and puzzles and on the developing barnacle/UA/UP/crashed aliens science stuff leading to the Unknown Settlements and the puzzles therein. This has perhaps been the most enjoyable part of the game.

The remaining 1/3 has been in supporting CGs. Also very good fun, especially in the early days in Open when I was flying a Cobra and the CGs weren't being ganked and blockaded ((again - always for fake out-of-game reasons.)) Since moving to Mobius CGs are just as much fun as they used to be, although I continue to visit Open to see what is going on and I've never failed to witness gank-fests taking place ((again, mostly definitely for out-of-game reasons with the same CMDRs using contradictory "reasons" one week to the next)).


Both of the other 2/3 of gameplay can lead directly to the discovery of excellent new NPC faction opportunities, and this is why I mention them.
- Doing science-y stuff and visiting, for instance, Canonn can lead to some profitable NPC faction missions in adjacent systems.
- Doing combat CGs - dropping in for repairs at a station can have profitable missions to take on.
- Doing trade CGs - finding stations selling the required goods can lead to a bunch of aceptable NPC faction missions.


Having said all that, I don't tend to create myself a home with any of the NPC minor factions. I'm still nomadic and follow my gameplay nose with no particular hard goals in mind.

Yours Aye

Mark H
 
The NPC minor factions are pretty meaningless to me (apart from their role in populating the game galaxy of course, wouldn't want to lose them). The only time I've purposely sided with one was to get a system permit, which in turn was to just get a discount on a ship. Mercenary? Moi?

I am signed up with a player faction though (as obvious from my sig pic) and that is something I find enhances the game greatly. Why?

1) I like science, even fictional pseudo-science, and I like puzzles and the odd conspiracy theory and Canonn do all that stuff very well.

2) They have clever dedicated CMDRs who work on the BGS and can advise members (like me) who want to do BGS stuff but can't be bothered getting into (or are baffled by) the details & complexities of its workings themselves. I find working the BGS far more engaging than PowerPlay because PowerPlay seems a bit of a pain and it's much more fun seeing your own player faction taking over systems and stations rather than a bunch of NPC figureheads taking all the glory.

3) I'm not much into multi-player games in general. I play ED much like I played the original Elite and Frontier E2 - in my head as a solo role-player. I never play in Open and I'm not interested in PvP. I'll happily play co-op in a PG , but so far my playing times never match up well enough with others - I'm on PS4 so it's a smaller player base too. However being part of the Canonn player faction and joining in with the discussions, puzzle-solving, research projects and discoveries on discord and the forums, etc, still gives me that inclusive feeling of group play.

... and finally ...

4) They have their own Mega Ship that jumps around interesting systems and its Traffic Controller is Dr Ant Ross, I mean... come on! That's awesome!
 
The people deserve a Voice and the Oppressed need a strong hand to straighten them up again.

Justice, Liberty, Cooperation. These are the keys to prowess and prospering worlds.


Join the Résistance. YOU can make a difference!
 
Because between Feds, Imp and Indie profitiring, the Alliance won't grow itself.

But oh it did. And I hope people are prepared for that 1000 systems benchmark, because it's getting closer by the day. :D
 
There are 30,000+ minor factions.....that's probably 29,000 too many IMO

The BGS and the sheer number of minor factions is another design decision that totally baffled me....I've written about this before.
The BGS as designed is very harsh on large factions - even with the backing of a well organised player group, factions spread over multiple systems are likely to spend a lot of time in adverse BGS states unless very carefully managed. Ones without such backing can end up as near-permanent wrecks.

With ~20,000 systems in the Sol bubble, then there needs to be probably 3-4 times that number of factions to allow stable control of systems to persist. The only way to get rid of the need for so many minor factions would be to either have a much smaller number of populated systems, or to adjust the BGS so that the current "diminishing returns" effects didn't apply and mini-superpower minor factions were much easier to build...

...

The Colonia region has 68 systems and 79 factions, if you want an example of what a smaller region with fewer factions might play like under the current BGS rules.

Broadly [1], it leads to an interesting dilemma where no-one particularly wants to expand much, because this will put them in a system where they're on low influence and subject to repeated wars ... but if no-one expands much, there are no buffer factions to stop you expanding, and expansion is therefore much easier than retreat. The largest factions (on a systems present count) are therefore not always the most organised - or even always player-backed at all.

[1] Anyone familiar with the region will notice several excessive simplifications in this paragraph, of course.
 

Deleted member 147460

D
The BGS as designed is very harsh on large factions - even with the backing of a well organised player group, factions spread over multiple systems are likely to spend a lot of time in adverse BGS states unless very carefully managed. Ones without such backing can end up as near-permanent wrecks.

With ~20,000 systems in the Sol bubble, then there needs to be probably 3-4 times that number of factions to allow stable control of systems to persist. The only way to get rid of the need for so many minor factions would be to either have a much smaller number of populated systems, or to adjust the BGS so that the current "diminishing returns" effects didn't apply and mini-superpower minor factions were much easier to build...

...

The Colonia region has 68 systems and 79 factions, if you want an example of what a smaller region with fewer factions might play like under the current BGS rules.

Broadly [1], it leads to an interesting dilemma where no-one particularly wants to expand much, because this will put them in a system where they're on low influence and subject to repeated wars ... but if no-one expands much, there are no buffer factions to stop you expanding, and expansion is therefore much easier than retreat. The largest factions (on a systems present count) are therefore not always the most organised - or even always player-backed at all.

[1] Anyone familiar with the region will notice several excessive simplifications in this paragraph, of course.

I am no expert on the matter but I don't see any need to have so many minor factions. They are unnecessary. Personally, I think the minor factions are an example of a "mile wide, inch deep". Having 78,000 or so minor factions is a mile wide, and the fact that the only thing we know about them is one to two sentences worth of description is an inch deep. Take for example the description, "Political. Members of this group are actively engaged in the promotion of a democratically approved political agenda". What does that even mean? What agenda and why should I care?

I want so badly to love this game because I have such a passion for science, sci-fi, and space. Unfortunately, I keep running into to design decisions that leave me completely baffled. I just don't know what to think.
 
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I am no expert on the matter but I don't see any need to have so many minor factions. They are unnecessary. Personally, I think the minor factions are an example of a "mile wide, inch deep". Having 78,000 or so minor factions is a mile wide, and the fact that the only thing we know about them is one to two sentences worth of description is an inch deep. Take for example the description, "Political. Members of this group are actively engaged in the promotion of a democratically approved political agenda". What does that even mean? What agenda and why should I care?

I want so badly to love this game because I have such a passion for science, sci-fi, and space. Unfortunately, I keep running into to design decisions that leave me completely baffled. I just don't know what to think.

What are you looking for; the galaxy to have only 500 political factions across the whole of known inhabited space? That seems incredibly limiting for a product which is built to be built upon. Reducing width doesn't add the depth you're looking for, it just makes less game.
 
I am no expert on the matter but I don't see any need to have so many minor factions. They are unnecessary.
Broadly, they're necessary because there are 20,000 inhabited systems, each of which needs at least one "native" faction, and ideally a few more, to keep the BGS operating reasonably stably in regions without a well-organised player group directing it - and to give new or small player factions something no-one cares about to fight against to start with...

I assume the number of inhabited systems is a natural consequence of taking the average distance between inhabited systems that they wanted, combined with the real positions of Achenar, Alioth and Sol.

(A much smaller number of inhabited systems would have allowed more individual distinctiveness, but also pushed the player base much closer together - every inhabited system would have CG-like levels of traffic - so is into "completely different game" territory)
 
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