Windows Mixed Reality Headsets (WMRD) and Elite: Dangerous

evanevery · Nov 30, 2017

Globusdiablo said:
Hey all

I've been trying to find solid intel, but haven't been able to so far.

Does anyone here have any actual hands on experience with these new WMRDs and E: D, and has anyone made direct comparions to Rift/Vive?

Thanks in advance.

Yup, I filed a couple of pretty detailed reports in the following thread a couple of weeks ago: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/390741-ED-and-Windows-MR-(Samsung-Odyssey-1440x1600)

I'm waiting for the next update to the "MR4VR" component before I try the Samsung again... I'm pretty sure that's the performance bottleneck right now (its only in Beta/pre-release)....

ICDP · Nov 30, 2017

Pville_Piper said:
the Samsung headset doesn't have issues with the sweet spot. I tried both the Lenovo and the Samsung and the Samsung was much better. Text and images were clear from one side of the lens to the other. The reason I chose the Rift over the Samsung was that I had a GTX 970 and the ASW would allow me to run VR without upgrading. Bear in mind that some are having issues with the Steam Beta for Windows MR and others are not.

ASW works on WHMRs, it is a steamVR feature and ED uses SteamVR.

Pville_Piper · Nov 30, 2017

ICDP said:
ASW works on WHMRs, it is a steamVR feature and ED uses SteamVR.

That would have been nice to know... It would have tilted the decision towards the Samsung for sure...

evanevery · Nov 30, 2017

Pville_Piper said:
the Samsung headset doesn't have issues with the sweet spot. I tried both the Lenovo and the Samsung and the Samsung was much better. Text and images were clear from one side of the lens to the other. The reason I chose the Rift over the Samsung was that I had a GTX 970 and the ASW would allow me to run VR without upgrading. Bear in mind that some are having issues with the Steam Beta for Windows MR and others are not. .

Actually, the Samsung Odyssey DOES have a smaller sweet spot than the Rift. The Samsung focus drops off noticeably quicker as you reach the edges of the FOV when compared to the Rift.

loribee · Nov 30, 2017

Every review I read about the Samsung called this out. You must have been lucky with your ipd/head shape to be able to get a good image. I even struggle with my PSVR to get it into my sweet spot.

Flapdrol1337 · Nov 30, 2017

With the rift I just put it on my head and the image is clear. But if it's not perfectly positioned the image warps when you move your head. Very annoying.

ICDP · Nov 30, 2017

evanevery said:
Actually, the Samsung Odyssey DOES have a smaller sweet spot than the Rift. The Samsung focus drops off noticeably quicker as you reach the edges of the FOV when compared to the Rift.

This is indeed very true, the sweetspot is narrower on WMRH devices. The CV1 has a sweetspot that stretched further and keeps it relative sharpeness over more of the lens. Having said that my experience of the CV1 is that there is still a very noticeable sweetspot and it is plagued by god rays across the entire lens.

WMRH have a sweet spot that is narrower, but it is sharper, reduced god rays (none in the sweetspot) and reduced SDE. Overall it is clearer and IMHO these advantages outweigh any negatives.

If I still had my CV1 I would be tempted to trade it if I had tested and compared it to the Lenovo HMD. Though it must be said again, it is not a "wow, so much better" experience, more of a, "yes, this is an improvement overall".

loribee · Nov 30, 2017

Flapdrol1337 said:
With the rift I just put it on my head and the image is clear. But if it's not perfectly positioned the image warps when you move your head. Very annoying.

Same with my pimax 4K/b1 do you think it’s because of the strap design? The Rift/Vive/pi4k are all more like scuba masks, whereas the windows mr and psvr are the headband type.

The straps are adjusted to my head so it’s consistent every time, with the psvr and the wmr you’re starting from scratch essentially every time you put it on.

One thing I noticed with the Samsung were these awful rays that were coming off the halogen lights in the roof of the hangar. I don’t get those with the pimax.

Pville_Piper · Nov 30, 2017

evanevery said:
Actually, the Samsung Odyssey DOES have a smaller sweet spot than the Rift. The Samsung focus drops off noticeably quicker as you reach the edges of the FOV when compared to the Rift.

I didn't think so... I specifically looked at this after the demoing the Lenovo as there was a quite noticeable difference in the Lenovo compared to the Samsung. I did the Lenovo first and was taken aback at poor I felt it was compared to the Rift and Samsung I did the week earlier. I did the Samsung right after that and then did the Rift about 15 minutes later.

I didn't notice a sweet spot at all on the Samsung (or the Rift) nor any real blurriness near the edges. It could be the fact that I only demo'ed it for a couple of minutes or that maybe my IPD is close to the preset? Not sure, but the Lenovo was a major disappointment to me. I did notice some blurriness in high contrast areas on the Samsung like the Oculus but no god rays. It's really hard to tell because I didn't to play the Rift and the Samsung back to back on the same game where I could do a direct comparison.

Again, it could be the way I perceive things. I'm not bothered much by the jaggies but other people can't tolerate them at all. Also, I normally wear bifocals and didn't wear then for either demo because I felt the no need.

Pville_Piper · Nov 30, 2017

loribee said:
Every review I read about the Samsung called this out. You must have been lucky with your ipd/head shape to be able to get a good image. I even struggle with my PSVR to get it into my sweet spot.

You maybe right. It seemed fine to me. Others love the Lenovo. Ang on Mixed Reality TV seems to think it's awesome... But I hated it. I was really glad I got the chance to see these with my own eyes. I would've been put off if I ordered the Lenovo... It would be nice if other places demo'd VR, it's a lot of money, especially when you factor in the computer and GPU. Someone's body might not fit at all where it's perfect for others.

=71st=RuSh · Nov 30, 2017

I use lenses inside the Rift and have no problem reading any text in ED or DCS world (even the HUD bearing on any aircraft), but you need to setup the game config VR to 1.5 pixel density! They come with 1.0 by default (the same for Steam VR)

The head movement is smooth with no lags, the only problem is the scuba mask vision!

GPU: AMD R9 380x w/4GB
CPU: i5 7400

Pville_Piper · Nov 30, 2017

=71st=RuSh said:
but you need to setup the game config VR to 1.5 pixel density! They come with 1.0 by default (the same for Steam VR)

Huh? Wha chu tawking about Willis?

loribee · Nov 30, 2017

Pville_Piper said:
Huh? Wha chu tawking about Willis?

Supersample

I wish I had taken a photo through the lens of the Samsung. It wasn’t like the text was blurry, more like it wasn’t rendered correctly..at all. Almost pixelated to oblivion.

It was strange because the non text elements were mostly fine. Again the ipd not going down to 60mm affected it slightly but not to point of making the text illegible.

I was also seeing inconsistencies with Evan on here with what steam was reporting the resolution of the display, which was weird. That might be part of the problem.

All moot now as I moved back to my pi4k ..

dogbite · Dec 1, 2017

ICDP said:
ASW works on WHMRs, it is a steamVR feature and ED uses SteamVR.

ASW is an Oculus feature. Steam uses Asynchronous Reprojection, a technique more akin to ATW than ASW.

Flapdrol1337 · Dec 1, 2017

loribee said:
Same with my pimax 4K/b1 do you think it’s because of the strap design? The Rift/Vive/pi4k are all more like scuba masks, whereas the windows mr and psvr are the headband type.

The straps are adjusted to my head so it’s consistent every time, with the psvr and the wmr you’re starting from scratch essentially every time you put it on.

One thing I noticed with the Samsung were these awful rays that were coming off the halogen lights in the roof of the hangar. I don’t get those with the pimax.

I don't think my cv1 is all that consistent, tilt and height are different every time. But it's reasonably sharp if it's not way far off. I still fiddle with it every time I put it on, it might be sharp but it warps when you move your head when it's not properly positioned.

Would be nice to have a way to position it identically every time. The best way I found to center it now is to go to the ipd calibration screen and then try to get the "god ray" artifact centered over the cross.