Modes The modes are brilliant!

[Robert Maynard]

That's the thing: everything being described here in this thread as a manifestation of psychopathic "in real life too" can be avoided with marginal effort. As much as some of you guys want to resist the idea this IS a competitive multiplayer game, not your lifestyle simulator. If you're a probro pvper that means the latest deathmobile, and if you're a scientist wanting to explore dangerous alien ruins in your srv with your ship parked a few kilometers away it means hiring well armed escorts. Yes, I use "competitive" in a very broad way, and it's apt.

Much simpler, given the design of the game, to select Private Group rather than Open at the mode selection screen.

While the game may indeed be competitive, that competition need not involve shooting at / being shot at by other ships - as that's an optional part of the game for those inclined to participate in it.

 

[bootsam]

Cheese rolling is a competative game but Im yet to see a gang of FdL's turn up and start ganking the competitors.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Much simpler, given the design of the game, to select Private Group rather than Open at the mode selection screen.

While the game may indeed be competitive, that competition need not involve shooting at / being shot at by other ships - as that's an optional part of the game for those inclined to participate in it.

it doesnt change the fact that the modes are not equal, when the design was intended for them to be. Solo/PG have an advantage over Open being the less challenging modes.

 

[jasonbarron]

Much simpler, given the design of the game, to select Private Group rather than Open at the mode selection screen.

While the game may indeed be competitive, that competition need not involve shooting at / being shot at by other ships - as that's an optional part of the game for those inclined to participate in it.

Taking the possibility of hostility into account is an imperative when playing Open, and preventative measures can be accomplished with minimal effort. The sad truth is that you almost have to want to die in order to be killed by another player, and in the event that it does indeed happen, you can rebuy your ship with what amounts to a few minutes of ingame work and be on your merry way, armed with the knowledge of how to avoid a similar outcome in the future.

When viewed through this logical, practical non-judgmental non-narrow minded viewpoint, you start to realize that some of you guys slinging insults (mod approved, apparently) about the real world character of competitive players are simply over reacting.

 

[Sir.Tj]

Heck, even Eve4ever pointed to one person in your click openly opining about causing real world harm. That one just went sailing past unchecked by the powers that be I noticed.

We can't be everywhere at once and rely on the forum member to notify us of posts they feel break the forum rules.

I'm assuming you reported the post in question?

 

[GJ51]

My favorite mode

Pie a la

 

[StiTch]

We can't be everywhere at once and rely on the forum member to notify us of posts they feel break the forum rules.

Not to start a whine but that's weird, because y'all are like an organised task force when it comes to challenging pro-PvP posts...

 

[Sir.Tj]

Not to start a whine but that's weird, because y'all are like an organised task force when it comes to challenging pro-PvP posts...

Only ones that break the forum rules....

 

[Robert Maynard]

it doesnt change the fact that the modes are not equal, when the design was intended for them to be. Solo/PG have an advantage over Open being the less challenging modes.

Challenging for whom?

Probably not for those that have spent ages Engineering their preferred combat ship and honed their PvP skills for even longer, especially not when up against non-combat ships....

 

[jasonbarron]

We can't be everywhere at once and rely on the forum member to notify us of posts they feel break the forum rules.

I'm assuming you reported the post in question?

Well, it seems you are here after all. Funny how you're not paying attention until someone brings it up though.

No, I didn't report it; I don't play the game or the forum that way, as I'm sure you're aware. But you should have no problem scanning the last few pages where various PvPers have politely insisted that they are not in fact real life murderers and assorted psychos while their counter parts in the discussion have insisted that they are, loudly and with a great deal of determination

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Challenging for whom?

Probably not for those that have spent ages Engineering their preferred combat ship and honed their PvP skills for even longer, especially not when up against non-combat ships....

I am in a process of making a video of how to fly a type7 in open, the challenges are there for both parties, traders and combat pilots. If traders being killed by pvp ships, they should be countered by other pvp ships and here you have the challenge for the original PVPiers.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

That's the thing: everything being described here in this thread as a manifestation of psychopathic "in real life too" can be avoided with marginal effort.

Indeed. Don't connect to other game clients, or connect to a select few in a private group.

Otherwise if one chooses to connect to any old game client, one could potentially be in for a world of annoyance - if one's not a PvP-Pro-Bro.

As much as some of you guys want to resist the idea this IS a competitive multiplayer game, not your lifestyle simulator.

Well, it really is a competitive multi-player game. The main competitiveness - designed right into the very heart of the game - is in the PvE gameplay, which - by design - can be done in any of the three game client connectivity modes/social filters. This game also - by design - could be a fantasy lifetime simulator if a player wishes it so, that's the beauty of this game.

If you're a probro pvper that means the latest deathmobile, and if you're a scientist wanting to explore dangerous alien ruins in your srv with your ship parked a few kilometers away it means hiring well armed escorts.

There are various impractical reasons as to why a ship couldn't be parked km's away from alien ruins - and still can't. This was explained before but the message still seems to have gone over heads. Plus, the explorer/scientist types are simply. not. interested. in random pew-pew, regardless of what other players want or have a deep psychological need for.

You guys don't really know the truth about whether this attitude makes me a psyco bad person in real life because not even one of you knows me (or any other PvPer) outside of the game/forum, but I can tell with an absolutely irrefutable certainty that those of you insisting that we're "bad people" are very irrational, illogical, narrow minded intolerant people yourselves who don't mind stooping to the lowest of the low accusations with literally no proof whatsoever to back it up. The last three pages of this thread is ample proof of this.

An actual quote from a published science paper on griefing...

Seeking an understanding of griefing and its forms, Foo and Koivisto (2004) analyzed discussion board posts and interviews conducted with griefers, non-griefers, and developers looking for common features. This resulted in a definition of griefing as typically intentional and enjoyed behaviors which cause the victim of griefing to enjoy the game less). Similarly, four categories of griefing were found, the last of which exemplifies a form of griefing in which intention to disrupt other players’ experience is less concrete and the motive is different from mere enjoyment. These four categories of griefing are (Foo & Koivisto, 2004):

• Harassing- causing emotional distress for the victim by shouting slurs, insults, spamming, disrupting events, or threatening

• Power Imposition- dominating players through repeatedly killing them, targeting new and inexperienced players, or exploiting loopholes in the game to harass players

• Scamming- using fraudulent schemes to swindle other players

• Greed Play- when the griefer seeks to benefit themselves even if it bothers other players, such as stealing items or achievements from other players who earned them.

Yes, I think you guys are the problem. Your attitude is beyond the pale.

I personally have a problem with players whose entire reason and mental motivation for starting the game, is to embark on in-game behaviour which amounts to intentional and enjoyed behaviors which cause the victim of griefing to enjoy the game less.

I don't see why that should be a problem. I don't see why that's an attitude which is "beyond the pale". In fact, I see my attitude towards griefing as a rational, normal, and healthy attitude. I also find it amusing that there are one or two posters who try to excuse griefing behaviour like it's just playing the game - like this is normal and harmless. That's failarious.

I'm just playing the game; you guys are the one's vocally, loudly tearing me and like minded players up outside of the game.

Other players are just playing the game too - it's just, well let's put it this way... Frontier add content like the alien wrecks, which happen to be designed in such a way that parking ships km's from the site is impractical for reasons which have been stated numerous times. The last thing needed is for other players "just playing the game", to deliberately travel to the alien wreck sites and take advantage of the fact that ships truly needed to be parked right inside the area, and embark on in-game behaviour which amounts to intentional and enjoyed behaviors which cause the victim of griefing to enjoy the game less.

 

[StiTch]

Only ones that break the forum rules....

You mean the ones you wouldn't have noticed because you can't be everywhere at once?

Not gon' start a flinging match here. It seems to be an accepted norm, and I'd rather make the effort to change the game than the forum.

I don't see why that should be a problem. I don't see why that's an attitude which is "beyond the pale". In fact, I see my attitude towards griefing as a rational, normal, and healthy attitude.

The bit he's challenging is that none but a handful of PvE players seem to be able to discuss the matter without instantly attacking the poster as a sicko griefer, regardless of discussion or context. And I'm sorry but that just reeks of far more insecurity than any in-game attacks.

Any reasonable discussion on PvP, "we don't care because dirty griefing". PvP bounty hunting? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Lovingly done piracy? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Game continuity? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Players need to create survivable ships? "We don't care because dirty griefing", despite the fact FD developers themselves continually state this is a dangerous galaxy (ironic that people keep complaining when people refer to Elite:Dangerous, because dangerous is still the word the devs tout time after time when introducing something mildly hazardous).

Helluva post, but thankyou for proving everything jasonbarron said.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Taking the possibility of hostility into account is an imperative when playing Open, and preventative measures can be accomplished with minimal effort. The sad truth is that you almost have to want to die in order to be killed by another player, and in the event that it does indeed happen, you can rebuy your ship with what amounts to a few minutes of ingame work and be on your merry way, armed with the knowledge of how to avoid a similar outcome in the future.

Indeed it is - Open is where players of all play-styles can choose to play. Frontier would seem to consider that it has a population / reputation problem though - from the recent proposed revisions to C&P and comments made about Open in general in older threads and recent streams.

Regarding the facility of accomplishing preventative measures and/or escaping the unwanted attentions of an attacker - that suggests compromising somewhat on the optimisation of the build for the purpose intended. I'm fairly sure that those interested in combat aren't compromising their builds though - and a vessel that is not optimised for combat has, I would expect, a significantly lower chance of survival / escape than one so optimised.

As to rebuys - quite often the ship is the least part of the consequential loss on destruction - so probably not "a few minutes of ingame work" to recoup. Even if it was only "a few minutes" that significantly exceeds the ten or so seconds of "emergent content" that caused the rebuy.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I am in a process of making a video of how to fly a type7 in open, the challenges are there for both parties, traders and combat pilots. If traders being killed by pvp ships, they should be countered by other pvp ships and here you have the challenge for the original PVPiers.

Please be sure to show how much cargo capacity it has - there was one video that purported to show a rather robust Type-7 - it wasn't outfitted as a trade ship though.

I doubt that most traders would enjoy hanging about to see if there were any PvP players willing to escort them (and that's before any trust issues are dealt with - too many "epic" stories of betrayal around for that to be a non-issue) - then there's the question of payment - trade dividends are only 5% and do missions pay anything to Wing members?

 

[bootsam]

Other than fewer ships for you to shoot at, what difference does it make to you what mode people play in? If they played another game entirely would you continue to post threads urging them to stop playing CoD whatever and return to ED open? The nonsense over PP and BGS has been put to bed well and truly umpteen times.

But eww, Im playing a more challenging game...ewww...so bleeding what? Im playing the game my way, not yours. Who are you to tell me what I can or cannot do. Youre no-one, you have no control over my actions and even less influence. Stop trying to CONTROL people and demanding people do WHAT YOU WANT. No one cares one iota what you want. Accept that and move along. Play the game your way, great but dont expect anyone else too. Maybe someone will give you a medal.

 

[jasonbarron]

Genar, what part of me suggesting that scientists hire an escort didn't you get? If you guys would pool your resources you could probably afford a decent wing. Heck, I'd even come back and lend a hand if there was a chance at some serious, emergent gameplay. And before you laugh, remember that I was trustworthy enough to go all the way to BP with the DWE, parking my Anaconda right next to such luminaries as Olivia/Erimus/Dr Kaii/Agony Aunt on over a dozen occasions with no harm befalling them.

The problem, the fatal flaw as it were, with your assessment of the character of PvPers in real life is that it is far too inclusive and black and white. The truth is more complex and varied, and you are nowhere near it. And with your narrow viewpoint, you probably will never get any closer, either.

 

[StiTch]

I don't see why that should be a problem. I don't see why that's an attitude which is "beyond the pale".

The bit he's challenging is that none but a handful of PvE players seem to be able to discuss the matter without instantly attacking the poster as a sicko griefer, regardless of discussion or context. And I'm sorry but that just reeks of far more insecurity than any in-game attacks.

Any reasonable discussion on PvP, "we don't care because dirty griefing". PvP bounty hunting? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Lovingly done piracy? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Game continuity? "We don't care because dirty griefing". Players need to create survivable ships, even in PvE? "We don't care because dirty griefing", despite the fact FD developers themselves continually state this is a dangerous galaxy (ironic that people keep complaining when people refer to Elite:Dangerous, because dangerous is still the word the devs tout time after time when introducing something mildly hazardous).

Helluva post, but thankyou for proving everything jasonbarron said.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Please be sure to show how much cargo capacity it has - there was one video that purported to show a rather robust Type-7 - it wasn't outfitted as a trade ship though.

I doubt that most traders would enjoy hanging about to see if there were any PvP players willing to escort them (and that's before any trust issues are dealt with - too many "epic" stories of betrayal around for that to be a non-issue) - then there's the question of payment - trade dividends are only 5% and do missions pay anything to Wing members?

224 cargo space, how is it?

 

[Goose4291]

An actual quote from a published science paper on griefing...

'Swindling and Greed.'

I'm glad this game keeps you molly-cuddled Genar, you'd have had an aneurism back in the glory days of Star Wars Galaxies or Ultima Online!