Exploration ships

[Baddestjerkface]

Can we get a large or at least larger dedicated exploring ship? Something that has the view and maneuverability of an aspX but the module capacity of a pthyon or anaconda. It's pretty sucky that in order to explore we have to choose between great view or carrying enough modules to have extended trips. With an aspX, at least two modules get left behind (those modules of course vary on which the player deems more important), that can make the journey less painful. With a python you sacrifice jump range and view, getting a sluggish ship. With an anaconda you sacrifice the view and downgrade almost every single core module to retain jump range, and still end up with a slow ship that feels like it's dragging.

Exploration is already taxing enough on player patience, can you at least look at what players, dedicated exploration players, are doing with their ships. Then design a ship that mirrors their wants. Or give exploration ships dedicated internals like combat and passenger ships?

 

[sam445]

It would indeed be nice to have a dedicated exploration ship without compromises. It's easy even to specialize it without making a powerful multi-purpose: simply have (what? 5?) small optional internals so that explorers can fit their needs and nothing more. Pack that in a relatively nimble ship and you're done.

The issue with that however is that it would remove the niche of the AspX, AspS, and DBX.

 

[Baddestjerkface]

It wouldn't take away from those examples anymore than the Corvette takes away from the dropship or the anaconda from the cobra.

It would be a progression from those to this new ship, an end game goal. It's a little old that all roads lead to the Anaconda. Combat ships have progression. Multipurpose ships have progression. Trade ships have progression. Even passages ships have progression. Exploration ship progression ends at the Asp Explorer.

 

[Exeider]

It wouldn't take away from those examples anymore than the Corvette takes away from the dropship or the anaconda from the cobra.

It would be a progression from those to this new ship, an end game goal. It's a little old that all roads lead to the Anaconda. Combat ships have progression. Multipurpose ships have progression. Trade ships have progression. Even passages ships have progression. Exploration ship progression ends at the Asp Explorer.

What's kind of messed up is that honestly we dont need a larger explorer ship, because as it stands there isnt any reason to carry more of the same equipment we already have. There are no new scanners or exploration mechanics that require new equipment.

During the exploration revamp I'm hoping that exploration get some kind of new mechanics to play with, which requires new equipment, which in turn will require a new and larger ship.

I've often pictured that large exploration ship could use SLF as Super Cruise only (IE no hyperdrive) exploration skiff. You could deploy a small group of these while your explorer ship if sitting somewhere in the system.

The smaller SLF sized ships will scan the planets and even get detailed surface scans. But in the midst of that they could find a few things that require the use of a deeper scaner or some kind of physical sampling equipment on the larger explorer ship.

After you recall the ships to the explorer ship, it can then go where it's needed, to the locations of the third tier scanning/sampling exploration mechanic.

The ship/crew would finish their research and then move onto the next system.

 

[Kenneth McGrew]

Can we get a large or at least larger dedicated exploring ship? Something that has the view and maneuverability of an aspX but the module capacity of a pthyon or anaconda. It's pretty sucky that in order to explore we have to choose between great view or carrying enough modules to have extended trips. With an aspX, at least two modules get left behind (those modules of course vary on which the player deems more important), that can make the journey less painful. With a python you sacrifice jump range and view, getting a sluggish ship. With an anaconda you sacrifice the view and downgrade almost every single core module to retain jump range, and still end up with a slow ship that feels like it's dragging.

Exploration is already taxing enough on player patience, can you at least look at what players, dedicated exploration players, are doing with their ships. Then design a ship that mirrors their wants. Or give exploration ships dedicated internals like combat and passenger ships?

what the hell are you putting in your ships? i can fit everything i need in an Adder, more comfortable exploration is a DBx (thx to the lemon campaign of spring 3303), let alone an AspX, and the glorious hold of a Conda where i can take 16 spare kitchen sinks and a cat hospital to beagle point if i wanted to.

Exploration is so wonderful because there are so many ships you can go in..., in fact 19 out of 31 of them can make it to the far reaches of our galaxy (semotus beacon) in the right outfitting, thats 19 ships to choose from, the others which cant get there still can explore 99% of the galaxy

its a choice;

Modules
Jump range
Manoverability

Pick 2 ^^

even a dedicated exploration ship (should one ever exist) will have a compromise somewhere! and there is no explorer ship progression.... i started in an Adder, moved to a DBx then a Dolphin all small ships available with a few hours of play, Theres still folk out there in the void in sidewinders, T6's you name it, and like me probably have billions in the bank because largest jumprange and loads of modules is not the best ship for exploration

if FD did add more content in a future update, and this came in the form of more modules without updating the smaller ships it would destroy the beauty of exploration being open to all, we dont want to be pushed into anacondas / other large ships to explore.

 

[Maymo]

Can we get a large or at least larger dedicated exploring ship? Something that has the view and maneuverability of an aspX but the module capacity of a pthyon or anaconda. It's pretty sucky that in order to explore we have to choose between great view or carrying enough modules to have extended trips. With an aspX, at least two modules get left behind (those modules of course vary on which the player deems more important), that can make the journey less painful. With a python you sacrifice jump range and view, getting a sluggish ship. With an anaconda you sacrifice the view and downgrade almost every single core module to retain jump range, and still end up with a slow ship that feels like it's dragging.

Exploration is already taxing enough on player patience, can you at least look at what players, dedicated exploration players, are doing with their ships. Then design a ship that mirrors their wants. Or give exploration ships dedicated internals like combat and passenger ships?

I think if FD just gave a little more love to the class 1 module slot people would be happier. The class 2 module slot is used far to liberally among all the games ships...ugly little slot that one...

2x1 is so much more useful.

 

[Atebits]

Asking Frontier to do development is like asking for your time back from playing games.

 

[Vorthax]

If FD could make an exploration variant of T-10:
- nerf guns, armor, PP, PD
- remove some slots (or make 2 of them size 1), leave enough for both SLF and SRV bays + essential modules
- improve supercruise handling and jump range
- nerf speed but improve landing thrusters

All of the above is configuration, alter the spoiler shape and it is ready for release

 

[Baddestjerkface]

what the hell are you putting in your ships? i can fit everything i need in an Adder, more comfortable exploration is a DBx (thx to the lemon campaign of spring 3303), let alone an AspX, and the glorious hold of a Conda where i can take 16 spare kitchen sinks and a cat hospital to beagle point if i wanted to.

Exploration is so wonderful because there are so many ships you can go in..., in fact 19 out of 31 of them can make it to the far reaches of our galaxy (semotus beacon) in the right outfitting, thats 19 ships to choose from, the others which cant get there still can explore 99% of the galaxy

its a choice;

Modules
Jump range
Manoverability

Pick 2 ^^

even a dedicated exploration ship (should one ever exist) will have a compromise somewhere! and there is no explorer ship progression.... i started in an Adder, moved to a DBx then a Dolphin all small ships available with a few hours of play, Theres still folk out there in the void in sidewinders, T6's you name it, and like me probably have billions in the bank because largest jumprange and loads of modules is not the best ship for exploration

if FD did add more content in a future update, and this came in the form of more modules without updating the smaller ships it would destroy the beauty of exploration being open to all, we dont want to be pushed into anacondas / other large ships to explore.

It would still be open to all, what I'm saying is there should a larger ship than the aspx for end game explorers. A ship that is dedicated to exploration that way people who are primarily explorers have an alternative to the pick 2 scheme or at least a less harsh pick 2 scheme. Right now I'm flying a imperial clipper as an explorer because it checks most of the boxes off, for me personally anyway, but it's still lacking in being a true explorer. Not to mention that it's locked behind a rank wall. If there had been a ship similar to the iclip that didn't require non-exploration activities I would be content. But, I played the game differently than I would have liked because the aspX didn't have everything I wanted and the python/anaconda were too much ship (in size/internals and too cumbersome.)

 

[Velixar]

It called sacrifice. To get everything is not a win it more of a lazy player dream. The game right now space equal slowness. Or range. In some cases it the view players dream of.

You all think the Anaconda is the best. Long range distance kills it. More jumps equals better pay. I would rather take a space cow or type 10 defender just due to the view. You also make more money

 

[Misty_Dark]

Well if we could outfit the Anaconda with a second flight bridge in the front, where we have the "panorama" window. then we would have one such option.

Also I have made another suggestion to have more explorer centric hull to use on our ships, that in short would allow us to use AspX with more smaller internals.
The idea behind Exploration hulls would be to restrict some compartments, like power plant, thrusters, power distributor by one size, and this should give us more internal space, and also add exploration slots.... also if we have two of the biggest slots, we break up the 2nd into smaller slots. Giving us more smaller slots.

Exploration slots would be restricted to specific modules, depending on ship size, we would get 1 to 2 size 1 slots (for putting our scanners), we would also on the bigger ships get a dedicated slot for fuel scoop.

Some more works and tweaks would need to be done, but as we could easily fit military slots to existing ships, I do not see any problem to add those 1-2 size 1 slots to ships with exploration hull, and also remove any military slots for that ship.

 

[Donalbane]

Better Exploration ships...and more

I think it is ironic that the better, more expensive ships, cant out-jump the asp. Shame on Frontier. It isnt only about mass, because that is overcome by engine size, fuel throughput, and design...we do need a better designed explorer and frankly, it should likely have been something born out of the dolphin line or maybe the keelback (if it could carry both a fighter (for scouting) and a SRV...that would be cool and very possible). It would need to jump further than the ASP however. We also need to get those $100M+ ships to get past the lame jump ranges they have... And those "purists" that talk about being lazy or such....nonsense... we dont get in a prop plane to fly anymore...we use jets...unless we own the plane. Is it really the point of the game to go through that same jump sequence over and over and over...and watch stars that arent even there go by? I have jumped to the edge where there are no stars left and while I was making that jump, about 5 or 6 stars went by that I KNOW were not there...so it is FAKE NEWS....but I digress. Look, there are 400 million stars in the game... 400 million. You could spend every day of the remainder of your life trying to visit systems and not even make a dent...seriously. We all end up inventing ways to stay ENTERTAINED in this GAME. It is a game and anything that would improve the experience is an improvement. I get the 400 plus jumps from the bubble to Colonia...fine...but would it hurt to have an explorer that could do it in, say, 300? or 200? Especially since they would have design limitations (such as thinner hull armor, lack of large hard points, limited cargo, etc.) so they have better jump range. Additionally, perhaps the FIX is to design a special engine that can jump far, at the expense of power consumption...that way you cant put it in a fighter without having to do a ton of power management? My ASP jumps at around 52ly...and tell me again why I cant modify to jump say...80 in my Cutter...or my Anaconda? Perhaps we could just all just push to other directions...such as player built bases or stations? Ships that can transport smaller ships? Ship trading? or with the coming "fleet carrier" how about this suggestion:

Maybe you use the fleet carrier to set up a colony:

Steps:
Collect participating friends to be part of a colony "fleet" (not required, but available)
Compile money to purchase a fleet carrier and associated components (perhaps a joint fund can be established to cultivate a "fleet" effort...otherwise players will have to donate goods to a trusted player that can be sold and go toward the purchase of the fleet carrier)
Identify a target system
All participants load onto the fleet carrier (or travel separately)
Fleet carrier relocates to the target system.
Deploy (disassemble) the fleet carrier: Fleet carriers are designed to be converted into a base and outpost (or perhaps a combo of bases, outposts or even stations depending on costs for modules you build into the fleet carrier)
Fleet members do coordinated activities to setup of the colony like piloting the components to put the station or base together, landing the planetary base on a target planet, etc.
Once complete, the owners have the option to "advertise" the base on a news feed and register it into the common map...or they can keep it to themselves for a private base or station. (Frontier will have to figure out specifics on this with respect to game functionality)

This would open up entirely new reasons to play ED... and bring a whole new excitement to the game... for pirates, or explorers, Thargoid fighting efforts, etc.

Lets push for new ideas

 

[Daynen]

As often is the case, I have to caution against simply asking for bigger, better versions of what we have, for a few reasons. First off, the ships we have fill all the game's desired roles quite well, even without min-maxing and grade 5 engineering. Second, the "big 3" (really 4 now, with the T10,) aren't supposed to be just "end game goals." They're supposed to be ships with more room for more functions or more stats that come with commensurate costs and risks. Some may see the Anaconda as an endgame goal for example, but it's not simply "better" in all respects than a smaller ship. It's missing a lot of what makes a small ship great and it's NOT cheap to maintain or replace. It has advantages, but you're trading a lot for them. It's a horizontal progression almost as much as a vertical one. A squadron of skilled Sidewinders can put down your anaconda for a hundredth of the cost, even combined.

Secondly, Not every function needs to be fulfilled by every ship class. What we call "exploration ships" should really be more aptly named "scout ships." The DBX, the Aspx, etc. are not huge warships or science vessels. They're not the Defiant and they're not the Enterprise. They're small, long range single pilot scout ships. Trying to get a bigger scout ship is self-defeating. Scouts are agile over long trips and low maintenance. A larger scout ship would only be worse at both.

What we need, rather than more ships that fit our playstyle like a glove, is more roles that need filled and more functions that have to be performed by the player. This will create deeper, more diverse gameplay experiences that call for a greater variety of game mechanics, which in turn may eventually call for new modules types and, ultimately, new ships. Frontloading us with ship after ship will only dilute our current choices if there's no call for most of them. Some of our current ships are so similar that we end up skipping one entirely (DBS, anyone?) This is because the number of ships far outnumber the gameplay elements for which they were made. We're mining, scanning, trading or shooting other ships. Those are really what everything boils down to and the last is the only one that takes any real effort or specialization.

I can take one small mining laser and keep two limpets busy simultaneously while still leaving enough hardpoints to defend myself and modules to take care of the rest.

I can scan entire systems with one scanner and make reasonable money for no effort, though it takes time. (detailed scanner is garbage and not worth the slot.)

Trading just means loading up on cargo racks and learning to land (or getting a computer.)

Combat? That takes up your whole ship AND demands high skill to win against able foes.

THIS is what we should be asking for. A more engaging challenge from activities outside of combat, along with more kinds of activities that actually require THOUGHT on our part, rather than just being a randomized collection of the same limited gameplay loops. Ever do a planetary scan? Close in, change direction three times, flip your ship over, pull out SRV, scan and run. It's repetitive and mindless with no real physics or searching involved. THAT is an example of what we should be asking to improve. We need clues, breadcrumbs, tracks to follow so that when we discover something, it's an actual DISCOVERY and not just a name unlock that we turn in for a few paltry credits. The same notion can be applied to all facets of the game; better ships will solve nothing.

 

[varonica]

As often is the case, I have to caution against simply asking for bigger, better versions of what we have,

I also have an objection to implying that everyone wants a Conda as an end game ship, I still explore in my T6, I don't see a Conda as being an upgrade, a side grade maybe, but it really goes to the side I have no interest in. Not everyone wants a Conda, not everyone wants to explore in a ship designed for exploration, they fly ships they like.

 

[Chrystoph]

Personally, I want the model of a Viper IV with the available volume of an Asp Explorer, but I want to design the ship from the ground up so that it meets my desires instead of me conforming to it.

I doubt that wish will ever get even close to being granted, but one can dream...

 

[Nitross]

I think the problem lies more with the increasing amount of useful modules while module space stays the same in our ships.

Ship build flexibility would increase - for exploring or otherwise - if, for instance, we had:

• A single Limpet Controller module for multiple limpet types (like SLF bays)
• A single module combining the Discovery Scanner and the Detailed Surface Scanner
• Modules that include cargo with their basic function so they can work without a second module: Limpet Controllers, SRV Bay

With just these changes or other like them, you can free up module space in current ships to make them a lot more flexible.

The major limiting factor for exploration or, rather, long range travel that this does not help with is Jump Range. In this case, I find it strange that there are modules the increase many stats on your ships - hull integrity, shield strength and recharge, etc. - but there isn't for jump range.

Why don't we have an Optional internal that increases Jump Range somehow? And, for group travelling or pursuit, how about a "Hyperspace Conduit Stabilizer" Utility module that lets you follow a scanned High Wake or a Wingmate's Wake regardless of it's required range? It could also work the other way around and make your own wake easy to "follow"; a double edged sword if you're being chased and forget to shut it of

 

[Captain Jack Sparrow]

One of the best ideas idea I've seen posted in a while and a breath of fresh air compared to the "we want space legs" or the endless requests to turn this game into GTA threads I see. As someone else stated, not all of us want a Conda or have the funds for one. It would be nice to have a dedicated explorer. We have dedicated combat ships, dedicated passengers ships, cargo ships, but no ships that are strictly for exploration. DBX doesn't cut it. The AspX is the closest thing and is almost there but could use some additions.

 

[Konnivar]

One of the best ideas idea I've seen posted in a while and a breath of fresh air compared to the "we want space legs" or the endless requests to turn this game into GTA threads I see. As someone else stated, not all of us want a Conda or have the funds for one. It would be nice to have a dedicated explorer. We have dedicated combat ships, dedicated passengers ships, cargo ships, but no ships that are strictly for exploration. DBX doesn't cut it. The AspX is the closest thing and is almost there but could use some additions.

Sure, but what exactly makes a "dedicated exploration ship" you mention that the DBX and AspX don't cut it and that you don't want an Anaconda. I'd argue that those three already are dedicated exploration ships; heck two of them have "Explorer" in the name! With the recent buff to the DBX it can have a 58ly range and fit everything you could want for exploration, ADS, DDS, SRV bay, one AFMU, Fuel Scoop, and a shield generator; all for about 17M (https://eddp.co/u/d9qth7Tv). The AspX and Anaconda simply allow you to have some extra module space to add things like fuel or repair limpets or a SLF bay. Sure those things are nice to have, but how often are they used during exploration?

I just completed a 5 month trip Circumnavigating the galaxy in my Anaconda Alternate Efficiency which at the time had a maximum jump range of 54.7ly. I would have taken a different ship, but the jump range and module space of the Anaconda made it the best choice for what I wanted to do. That's the point: every ship can do every task in the game and some are better at certain tasks than others, but they trade something for it. In this case I traded super cruise maneuverability and a bit of normal space speed for the increased jump range.

Therein lies the issue with a "dedicated exploration" ship: everyone has a different idea of what that means. I am by no means opposed to the addition of new ships or even the addition of another "dedicated explorer"; I am simply pointing out that there are already quite a few "dedicated exploration" ships in the game.


P.S. If you are looking for a good ship for exploration that is maneuverable, has some extra module space and doesn't move in super cruise like a cow then try the Orca (https://eddp.co/u/rzYtwsFF).

 

[Daynen]

Why don't we have an Optional internal that increases Jump Range somehow?

Again, I must caution against this. Even the average non-engineered Asp can break 20 LY in a single jump, while others have posted their jump ranges of over 50--FIFTY--light years; just how fast are you planning on jumping from one end of the ENTIRE GALAXY to the other? Is that your only goal in ED? Do you WANT to be completely bored with this game in a Week? Asking for more speed, longer jumps and the like only shrinks the game...which sells itself primarily on the vastness of space, mind you! Asking for more jump range, especially without some considerable risks attached, is doing yourself a disservice and admitting that you're not actually having fun playing the game. I know this because I've seen the pattern thousands of times in hundreds of games. Huge open world takes time to explore, players whine for faster travel, then they can pop over from one end to the next, then they're bored the next day. It's a vicious cycle and this is where it starts.

I do agree with two of your bullet points though; the detailed surface scanner should never have existed and the limpet controller should have been able to perform more than one function --based on it's size and grade-- but the controller or bays probably shouldn't come with cargo. If a carried vehicle has it's own cargo space, that's okay, so long as it automatically transfers to your hold on docking --OR-- stays put if your hold is full (it shouldn't just be impossible to carry what you've already picked up, IMHO.)

 

[Stellar Gambit]

... maybe we could have a modual for a tread mill, or a toilet. I mean, sitting in that one seat for weeks/months on end cannot be good for the back or blood flow.

But seriously, I like things as they are. I personally favour the DBX.. but then I sacrifice the brilliant view from the Asp..