Beyond C&P - Must admit I'm slightly concerned about PvP piracy outcome

So all the 'open only' fanatics will be forced into solo momentarily, delicious.

Don't seem right tho'; kill people at rescue ship in open but when you undock at penal colony you're magically protected, why?

Because people will camp prisons because people will be guaranteed thrown there and will fly out.

No such guarantees can be made about other places in galaxy.

People coming out of prison will already faced their penalty, having guaranteed PvP attack when coming out of prison would be just a bit too excessive.
 
This!

We've heard the Stick, now where is the Carrot?

^^ yeah, where is it indeed ?

PvP piracy is always going to be a tough one. But.

PvE piracy could be easily improved a lot.

1) Have NPC's called "rare traders" do the well known rare trade loops. Have their hold filled with the appropriate goodies. Have missions to steal rare goods and deliver them quickly (so mix of theft and buckyball)
2) Add FED/Imp/Alliance/AEGIS convoys with special cargo like AI relics and other very expensive shady cargo. Put missions (hell, wing missions) to steal those for a large payout.
3) Make all drugs rather expensive except in anarchies, and make all illegal drugs sell for double value on the blackmarket, vs normal in the normal market (they are valuable because they are forbidden).
4) Add more illegal rare drugs in some anarchy systems (work as rare, plus can be sold for double on the black market => some traders will come => piracy targets (NPC or Players)
5) Change the way limpets work : instead of just making 4t of stuff get out in a trail, have the limpet act as a net to grab 10-20t of cargo, stop them near other colleceted booty (speed 0) and activate a beacon visible at long distance
=> if police shows up, draw them away and SR back to the booty. Even better, make the beacon an instance that can be returned to => escape to scene and come back later once things cool down.
6) With the new harsher Bounty system coming in place, why not have dying ships toss out some part of the cargo ?
 
I don’t follow. What you said is how piracy should be. You can’t just commit a crime (steal the goods) in a system that has the security in place to detect those hot goods.

Now they didn’t talk about scale of deterants. Except for listening up friendly fire. You assume a limpet theft will equate to a full on kill? That’s all feedback we need to provide in beta.

A CG in a security system shouldn’t be a place pirate want to “have a notion to pirate in”. A CG in an OPEN Anarchy system will be a nightmare, and should be.

I agree the payouts need to scale with risk.

So what we end up with is seemingly CGs (in OPEN), in a security system, becoming super safe now? Piracy (even using just limpets) is now being penalised even more - it's bad enough at the moment - that it could all but disappear I suspect. So an CG in a security system risks basically becoming super safe, apart form the odd murder hobo out for a giggle.

How is this a good step for "trading" or a good steap for piracy.

PvP is already in a bad place, and removing the one mechanic where at least there's CMDRs to be found, and a (small) purpose/profit to get, seems odd to me!


NOTE: THIS IS ASSUMING - if I've understood correctly - that let's say you only use limpets on a victim, then when you arrive at the station its facilities are closed to you, and you CANNOT pay off a fine/bounty there to then regain them. My impression is you cannot pay off a bounty, and using even a limpet would be a bounty.

Seeing as how you will be able to pay off your own Bounties, I'd say things just got a whole lot easier for would-be pirates.

Aha! This is important then! So you recon if:-
1) You use a limpet on a CMDR, then go to the nearby station where its facilities are now not available to you, you can pay off your bounty there and regain the facilities?
2) You destroy a CMDR, then go to the nearby station where its facilities are now not available to you, you can pay off your bounty there and regain the facilities?

Because I had the impression from one source that you could not pay off bounties at the station in question? Only fines?
 
And don't forget this - there are no crimes in anarchy systems. So either commit those acts in that space, or retreat there to offload booty.

Yes, this of course is a significant oversight/issue in itself, as this will mean murder-hobos will continue their toxic nonsense there. eg: An alien site is found outside the bubble, explorers rush out to see, and murder hobos rush there to destroy as many explorers as possible for the griefing giggles, safe in the knowledge not be a single blemish will appear on their record. It's a bad approach.

Illegal destruction is illegal destruction no matter where it takes place. There may not be security service to come to the victims aid, but it's not as if no one knows about it and no one cares (The Pilots Federation and Insurance companies would)!
 
Yes, this of course is a significant oversight/issue in itself, as this will mean murder-hobos will continue their toxic nonsense there. eg: An alien site is found outside the bubble, explorers rush out to see, and murder hobos rush there to destroy as many explorers as possible for the griefing giggles, safe in the knowledge not be a single blemish will appear on their record. It's a bad approach.

Illegal destruction is illegal destruction no matter where it takes place. There may not be security service to come to the victims aid, but it's not as if no one knows about it and no one cares (The Pilots Federation and Insurance companies would)!

Then no change then.
 
So yes, illegal destruction (of a CMDR) should result in significant penalties.

But, if you're simply trying to be the nicest pirate you can, and even only use the existing crummy limpet mechanism to extract cargo from another CMDR, surely you're now going to be even worse off due to this new C&P mechanism? ie: Lose station facility access etc etc?

Have I understood clearly?


EDIT: Can you at least always pay off fines and bounties at a station (that currently is denying you facilities)?

Well killing isn't going to get you anything piracy wise anyway? so yeah? no need to destroy, just disable them?
 
The C&P changes are sounding great.

Now those who want to actually RP being criminals get to actually get treated like criminals if they want.

The ship rather than person focus is still an easy get out for the LOL Crims.

I wish we could have more than one pilot and that the justice system was person focused.

It would be fun having to survive as a full time, Wanted criminal.
 
So what we end up with is seemingly CGs (in OPEN), in a security system, becoming super safe now? Piracy (even using just limpets) is now being penalised even more - it's bad enough at the moment - that it could all but disappear I suspect. So an CG in a security system risks basically becoming super safe, apart form the odd murder hobo out for a giggle.

How is this a good step for "trading" or a good steap for piracy.

PvP is already in a bad place, and removing the one mechanic where at least there's CMDRs to be found, and a (small) purpose/profit to get, seems odd to me!


NOTE: THIS IS ASSUMING - if I've understood correctly - that let's say you only use limpets on a victim, then when you arrive at the station its facilities are closed to you, and you CANNOT pay off a fine/bounty there to then regain them. My impression is you cannot pay off a bounty, and using even a limpet would be a bounty.



Aha! This is important then! So you recon if:-
1) You use a limpet on a CMDR, then go to the nearby station where its facilities are now not available to you, you can pay off your bounty there and regain the facilities?
2) You destroy a CMDR, then go to the nearby station where its facilities are now not available to you, you can pay off your bounty there and regain the facilities?

Because I had the impression from one source that you could not pay off bounties at the station in question? Only fines?


It's funny how you're complaining about lawful activities in high security systems being safe (shocking!), while at the same time complaining that being a thief and a criminal at a high security system is not safe enough...
 
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It's funny how you're complaining about lawful activities in high security systems being safe (shocking!), while at the same time complaining that being a thief and a criminal at a high security system is not safe enough...

I think it's funny how you you say I'm even talking about scenarios at "High Security" systems (so you can make a dramatic non-point?), when I've specifically not mentioned that. Because the issue - if there is one - is common to even low security if I've understood it correctly?

So basically, I'm still waiting for clarification on if a CMDR can rock up to a station where they've lost access to the facilities and instantly regain them? My impression was, a fine they pay off, so yes. A bounty they cannot pay off, so no. I'd love this to be cleared up...
 
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But, if you're simply trying to be the nicest pirate you can, and even only use the existing crummy limpet mechanism to extract cargo from another CMDR, surely you're now going to be even worse off due to this new C&P mechanism? ie: Lose station facility access etc etc?

Doesn't matter. Combat logging has killed true piracy years ago.
 
So yes, illegal destruction (of a CMDR) should result in significant penalties.

But, if you're simply trying to be the nicest pirate you can, and even only use the existing crummy limpet mechanism to extract cargo from another CMDR, surely you're now going to be even worse off due to this new C&P mechanism? ie: Lose station facility access etc etc?

Have I understood clearly?


EDIT: Can you at least always pay off fines and bounties at a station (that currently is denying you facilities)?
You could i just restock and repair at Anarchy stations like it should be and use a clean ship to operate in security systems.

I think it's funny how you you say I'm even talking about scenarios at "High Security" systems (so you can make a dramatic non-point?), when I've specifically not mentioned that. Because the issue - if there is one - is common to even low security if I've understood it correctly?

So basically, I'm still waiting for clarification on if a CMDR can rock up to a station where they've lost access to the facilities and instantly regain them? My impression was, a fine they pay off, so yes. A bounty they cannot pay off, so no. I'd love this to be cleared up...
IIRC a bounty can be paid off at interstellar factors, they are not present in high security systems though. I suggest everyone reads the recap again.
 
I think it's funny how you you say I'm even talking about scenarios at "High Security" systems (so you can make a dramatic non-point?), when I've specifically not mentioned that. Because the issue - if there is one - is common to even low security if I've understood it correctly?

So basically, I'm still waiting for clarification on if a CMDR can rock up to a station where they've lost access to the facilities and instantly regain them? My impression was, a fine they pay off, so yes. A bounty they cannot pay off, so no. I'd love this to be cleared up...

Fines absolutely, bounties only if there were an interstellar factor in that starport.
 
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