Modes Will 3.0 Increase, decrease or have no effect on Open population?

[jasonbarron]

Okay everyone. I know you all think I'm heartless, dishonest and without compassion, that I'm only living up to my avatar's namesake by being a selfish, rabid devotee of capitalism who never gives anything back to the "little people." Well, I'm going to prove you all wrong. I am, in fact, off to give something back to the community right now in terms of using my ill gotten gains (an extra 4 billion liquid and a new murder machine engineered from over 900 g5 mats obtained at the same time) to fund a murder spree in Shinrarta. Or, rather I would need a fortune if it weren't for my knowing how to clean my hot ship for pennies on the dollar, virtually allowing me to watch dust gather on my enormous fortune.

Later all. I hope I see you all ingame at some point

 

[Mouse]

I was part of the team on a multiplayer-game back in the day and was part of the team handling players. We differentiated cheating into bug abuse and feature abuse. The skimmer exploit would have been a cheating of what we called feature abuse. "An obvious non-intended feature that rewards the player which he then proceeds to use repeatedly for benefit". And no, we didn't care if people claimed they were to stupid or ignorant to understand that it was non-intended unless they were fresh players.

The "has no effect on you" argument is really old and abused. It's not fun to see cheaters buy the top vessels after 3 hours of abusing a reward that was obviously way over the top. The goal of buying the top ships is tarnished, who cares about achievements or playing the game when you can just wait for the next feature to crop out. And I'm not playing to achieve something anymore, I'm just playing catchup to everyone who got it outside of the indended game mechanics.

These days though games don't wield the banhammer for these types of offenses, because they don't want to lose the business. Which is sad and is probably also why they get to proliferate and go unnoticed for so long. Cheaters know they get away with it, and probably they just run around thinking they're playing the game like everyone else... because essentially their behavior is condoned by designers. I was lucky enough to be a part of a game where we would punish. Didn't stop all the cheating, but we probably had a lot more feedback on active features. For an offense like this we would probably have nuked all gains plus a significant portion of other assets on the active account. And I can tell you right now it was good fun to catch the abusers too.

And rewards elsewhere in the game being too low is another debate entirely. A game design needing adjustments doesn't mean glitches designers never intended should be just left as is.

We try to explain this to them until we are blue in the mustache and all we get is blank faces and "It's not cheating".

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Okay everyone. I know you all think I'm heartless, dishonest and without compassion, that I'm only living up to my avatar's namesake by being a selfish, rabid devotee of capitalism who never gives anything back to the "little people." Well, I'm going to prove you all wrong. I am, in fact, off to give something back to the community right now in terms of using my ill gotten gains (an extra 4 billion liquid and a new murder machine engineered from over 900 g5 mats obtained at the same time) to fund a murder spree in Shinrarta. Or, rather I would need a fortune if it weren't for my knowing how to clean my hot ship for pennies on the dollar, virtually allowing me to watch dust gather on my enormous fortune.

Later all. I hope I see you all ingame at some point

Its about time you join us. The adress is on my sig. Discord is free for all, yall invited but some stuff there not for the weak minded.

Anyway I will be god modding my FAS using the engineering mats I acquired while finnaly enjoying PVE for the first time in a while.

 

[jasonbarron]

We try to explain this to them until we are blue in the mustache and all we get is blank faces and "It's not cheating".

As far as I can tell I'm the only one with a blue 'stache.

Its about time you join us. The adress is on my sig. Discord is free for all, yall invited but some stuff there not for the weak minded.

Anyway I will be god modding my FAS using the engineering mats I acquired while finnaly enjoying PVE for the first time in a while.

Thanks for the invite. I'll check it out.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I know it's hard to understand, but some people like to play honestly in multiplayer games.
And we expect those we play with to also do the same. Otherwise there is no point in playing multiplayer is there.

The lovely thing is, whenever people come up with the argument: "Why are you bothered? My ill gotten gains don't affect you!" you can point to this thread where at least 2 players are boasting to use their exploited credits with the sole purpose of ruining other player's games. Added to that is that they will do so without any risk to themselves, so the excuse PvP costs a lot of credits doesn't fly either.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

The lovely thing is, whenever people come up with the argument: "Why are you bothered? My ill gotten gains don't affect you!" you can point to this thread where at least 2 players are boasting to use their exploited credits with the sole purpose of ruining other player's games. Added to that is that they will do so without any risk to themselves, so the excuse PvP costs a lot of credits doesn't fly either.

Again, explain "exploited credits".
Who decided that more than X credits per hour is an "exploit"? Who decided on the value of X?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Again, explain "exploited credits".
Who decided that more than X credits per hour is an "exploit"? Who decided on the value of X?

Paige.

As you are likely aware, an issue was recently discovered which allowed players to earn 200/300 million credits per hour by completing Skimmer Massacre Missions. We have removed this mission type while we investigate, and we will update this post as an edit once we have more information.

 

[Jockey79]

Again, explain "exploited credits".
Who decided that more than X credits per hour is an "exploit"? Who decided on the value of X?

Considering Frontier keep balancing things to be on par with trading, I'd say FDev use that as a measuring stick.
So anything 10x trade is clearly broken.

Even when DBOBE chimed in, he wanted to bring other profession up to traders earnings so all professions would be valid.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

Paige.

She didnt say it was an exploit.

So 200m/300m c/hr is not allowed? What aboit 100m? 50m?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

She didnt say it was an exploit.

They must have shut it down because it was working as intended, right?

 

[Jockey79]

She didnt say it was an exploit.

So 200m/300m c/hr is not allowed? What aboit 100m? 50m?

Looking at previous exploit payouts, anything over 20 Million / Hr gets removed.
So you don't need to be Rachel Riley to figure out what is broken and earning too much.

(and for our older readers, replace Rachel with Carol Vorderman)

Edit;

Just to add, I'm not suggesting what a Cr/Hr cap should be, but that seems to be FDevs action point for stepping in.

Edit 2;

And mining missions have been pulled, due to rep rewards..... is there anything FDev didn't break in this update?

 

[jasonbarron]

They must have shut it down because it was working as intended, right?

They shut it down, all of the skimmer missions galaxy wide, because there was a core issue at work that they were unclear on. While it's just common sense that they don't want that kind of "money per hour" thing going on too long for balance purposes, it's a loooong ways away from calling everyone "cheats" like Jockey & Co has been doing. If Fdev thought it was cheating, they would have explicitly said so, and then got to banning players who engaged in it along with stripping assets similar to the 5/1 scandal. They didn't, and they haven't. The very worst thing that happened was that players took advantage of a lucrative opportunity using well established ED gaming principles and mechanics!

Where were all the over the top accusations of cheating during Robigo, ultra rares, Massacre Missions, 17 Draconis, Sothis & Ceos? Personally, I think those in the "Hang them thar cheaters!" brigade have sunk to a new low

Edit: and I'm still the only one here with a blue 'stache!

 

[Rob At Work]

looking back, i think it's a trick question because the answer is "all of 'em"

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

They shut it down, all of the skimmer missions galaxy wide, because there was a core issue at work that they were unclear on. While it's just common sense that they don't want that kind of "money per hour" thing going on too long for balance purposes, it's a loooong ways away from calling everyone "cheats" like Jockey & Co has been doing.

Yeah, I seem to be disagreeing with everyone in this thread. I call it an exploit, not a cheat. (As I did for all the other gold rushes by the way) And I feel it's bad for the game, so I also disagree with Obsi Ant.

I am Ziggy, and I disagree.

 

[jasonbarron]

Yeah, I seem to be disagreeing with everyone in this thread. I call it an exploit, not a cheat. (As I did for all the other gold rushes by the way) And I feel it's bad for the game, so I also disagree with Obsi Ant.

I am Ziggy, and I disagree.

Well, for what it's worth I harbor no negativity towards you (or anybody else). I was just pointing out the facts. Honestly, I've had more fun both in the game and the forum than I've enjoyed in months!

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Well, for what it's worth I harbor no negativity towards you (or anybody else).

I disagree

I was just pointing out the facts.

No you weren't

Honestly, I've had more fun both in the game and the forum than I've enjoyed in months!

No you haven't.

 

[jasonbarron]

I disagree


No you weren't


No you haven't.

You probably can't tell because of my magnificently bushy mustache, but I'm sticking my tongue out at you.

 

[Theodrid]

Again, explain "exploited credits".
Who decided that more than X credits per hour is an "exploit"? Who decided on the value of X?

Them :-

Good afternoon, Commanders.

Thank you for your patience during our investigations into this issue. We have identified a fix and expect it to be fully implemented within the next few weeks. After a careful review of the situation, we have decided to allow the rewards earned to be kept by participants and we'll not be removing them at this time (similarly to Sothis, Quince, and Smeaton).

In regards to ‘mission board flipping,’ we've taken on your feedback and the team are looking into how we can improve the mission board. However, we want to do this in a fair and balanced way, and as soon as we have any more information on this we’ll let you know.

Regarding other bugs or issues that have been highlighted in this thread, the Beyond series of updates is set to address many of these concerns and we will have more information, including dedicated feedback forums and live streams, in the coming months.

Thank you.

The very fact they have to mention that they'll be allowing people to keep their ill gotten gains speaks volumes, if all this was fine and legit that sentence wouldn't be in there, simples.

Frontier leniency strikes again.....no, I'm not surprised either.

 

[jasonbarron]

Them :-



The very fact they have to mention that they'll be allowing people to keep their ill gotten gains speaks volumes, if all this was fine and legit that sentence wouldn't be in there, simples.

Except she never used the phrase "ill gotten gains" nor any other pejorative term. At face value she is quite simply saying that the fault (if any) exists solely on the programming end and players did nothing wrong.

 

[Theodrid]

Except she never used the phrase "ill gotten gains" nor any other pejorative term. At face value she is quite simply saying that the fault (if any) exists solely on the programming end and players did nothing wrong.

You don't mention that people can keep their shinies at all if there is nothing untoward here, c'mon Jason. They would have simply said 'we screwed up' and not mention player rewards if that were the case.