I'm a newbie and trader, just got killed by pirates, help appreciated

[IndigoWyrd]

Doubt he has the 160million to buy and outfit a Python and it cuts his cargo hauling abilities down over 60%. Bad move.

Inexpensive? lolcopter. And again, he'd only be able to haul a 3rd of what he is able to now. Bad move. If he doesn't have the money to a rate his T9, he damn sure can't a rate a Python.

Type-9 Base Cost: 73 million
Python Base Cost: 55 million
Anaconda Base Cost: 141 million

Yes, inexpensive, relatively speaking.

The thing with PVP interdictions is they behave nothing like NPC interdictions. Also not really a great idea telling someone to downgrade ships, OP just needs to learn to defend himself, it isn't exactly hard, just takes a little practice and more importantly discipline, it is easy to just start mashing buttons and trying to run when all hell is breaking lose.. All it takes is to remain calm and follow a procedure, no need to downgrade cargo space and switch to a Python or Anaconda.

Pretty sure if you can beat a PVP interdiction you can beat the best NPC interdiction. Yes, Players aren't going to generally make stupid interdictions, like attempting an interdiction in the cone of a white dwarf that insures their destruction - NPC's will. Nor will players interdict someone into the corona of a star or at orbital entry of a planet, causing interdiction to break automatically. NPC's will though.

NPC's tend to be rather patterned and predictable, Players on the other hand... not so much.

And we don't know what the OP's actual cargo capacity is - granted with a Type-9 it IS pretty easy to break 200 tons without much thought. However, being an admitted New Pilot, and considering swapping ships at this point already, it seems more reasonable to make a smarter, somewhat lateral move to a more multi-role suited ship that is vastly less expensive than an Anaconda, far easier to get accustomed to flying - the Anaconda's high rear bridge and unusual view can make it quite challenging for the inexperienced pilot, and even a bit awkward for experienced pilots (I still bump my head once in a while undocking mine).

But that is one of the nice things about Elite - we can all be right and we can all be wrong at the same time. The real question here is, what is a better fit for the OP? Only (s)he can answer that.

 

[777Driver]

While the money could be an issue, the cargo hauling certainly isn't. You can pick up lucrative delivery missions to/from outposts, which the T-9 can't do. And you can also defend or run much more easily.

A Python can't haul 752 tonnes of cargo with a value of 40+ million. It's a great ship, I own two, but it is a downgrade, heavy freight guy's could care less about outposts, they are tiny in number compared to large pad ports. You can defend yourself just as easily in a T9 as you can in a Python, just different methods.

Pretty sure if you can beat a PVP interdiction you can beat the best NPC interdiction. .

Yes you can, but the way interdiction's behave seem to be very different with Players, I use a completely different method when dealing with NPC interdictions. Just saying that the best way to understand NPC behaviour during the interdict mini game is to let yourself be interdicted by NPC's. They don't behave the same as humans, at least in my experience.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

A Python can't haul 752 tonnes of cargo with a value of 40+ million. It's a great ship, I own two, but it is a downgrade, heavy freight guy's could care less about outposts, they are tiny in number compared to large pad ports. You can defend yourself just as easily in a T9 as you can in a Python, just different methods.

Yes you can, but the way interdiction's behave seem to be very different with Players, I use a completely different method when dealing with NPC interdictions

You are correct - though my own Type-9 moves a mere 640 tons, while still affording itself a decent set of defenses. However, even at 10.5m per load, using your own per-ton cargo value, the Python will pay for itself rather quickly, even quicker if the pilot is able to survive and actually complete the delivery and make the money. What good does it do anyone to try to haul 40+ mil in cargo if they can only do so successfully 1 in 3 times? Better to make less successfully more frequently than gamble on a jackpot.
But that's just my way of thinking.

Please don't tell me you submit-boost-high-wake. That gets so many new pilots killed.

I always look at what kind of ship and rank of pilot are trying to interdict me (a quick tap of Highest Threat will select the ship attempting interdiction and the left hand panel will tell you all you need to know). If it's anything less than an Elite Anaconda, even in my Type-9, I will stop and claim their bounty voucher, they're guaranteed destroyed. Hauling cargo in almost anything else, even the Elite Anacondas are toast. But I'm far from an inexperienced or new pilot.

I cut my teeth hauling in a Keelback, because a Type-6 was a one-shot kill back when I was starting out - over-engineered NPC weapons were pretty gross by any standard.
At least my Keelback could soak a hit. I moved into a Type-7 after that, and found it to be more than capable of evading even the interdictions that showed two Escape vectors moving in opposite directions at the same time (don't miss that bug either).

After a few trips in my Type-7 I moved over to a Python - the change in firepower was magnificent, and they changed the AI to evade mines with near 100% accuracy (I do miss mining things to death). A few dozen runs around what I've come to call the Rare Goods Ring, which included Hutton Orbital, and 500m in the bank, I opted to give a go at the Type-9. Bought it, outfitted it, and promptly wedged it in the mail slot on my first trip out (managed to dislodge myself before the station did it for me) and prompted wedged it in the mail slot on my first arrival, and named it "Corky" after I managed to break loose once more and narrowly evaded spiking myself on the back of the station. I'd fallen in love with that flying warehouse, and after a few more runs, bought a second one and outfitted it for mining.

The Type-9 IS a great ship, but it's not a great ship for beginners. It's awkward, slow, and cumbersome. It takes a good bit of getting use to, and even then, it IS still slow and cumbersome, but that's part of its charm.

 

[ZeroAi]

So I am not very good at combat, died the first time I tried it, previously I've managed to win the interdiction minigame pretty much every time while trading, but now my trade rank is "Entrepreneur" and I think the pirates are getting harder

I'm an Elite trader and haven't lost the interdiction minigame in months, so I think there is hope for you to continue to avoid interdictions.

Just make sure your throttle is in the middle of the blue area so you have the most maneuverability... this works on all my ships, and that includes all of the ships I use for hauling which are "D" rated to reduce weight, well except for the FSD, and have minimum shields and no weapons (so avoiding interdictions is important when I'm hauling ;-) )

Best of luck!

o7

 

[EvoBeardy]

@OP:

You've got plenty of good suggestions here from seasoned and experienced (even experienced 'newer' players, time doesn't always = experience), I'd like to throw in a couple too.

Firstly, a better understanding of your current configuration would be good, and what Engineers you've access to.

Assuming you have Farseer unlocked for your FSD, did you G1 OC the Power Plant with her also? G1 OC with Monstered will give you +17% power capacity, so that should alleviate your power constraints.

If possible, unlocking The Dweller should become a next priority. He looks y but he's cool.
He'll give you access to not only Power Distributor mods (essential if you ask me), but also G3-4 in Thermal Weaponry.

Usual recommendations for the Distributor are Charge Enhanced, however I'd go with Engine Focused and extra capacity Experimental. This way you can apply 2 pips to Engines, 4 to Sys and about-turn boost away upon submitting, and then boost again to try and get some distance.

Plonk a couple of Turreted Long Range Pulse Lasers on the two medium hardpoints, with Emissive Munitions and Phasing Sequence.
Whack mines on the remaining hard points.

Get a feel for your layout as you add stuff, do the odd runs and get interdicted for practice.

Work on unlocking Lizard Ryder or Juri Ishmaak next. Juri needs 100k or 1m in bounties, depending on reasons. He was 100k for me so super easy. Lizard needs 200 landmines sourced and delivered (after doing a couple of missions with the Eurybia Blue Mafia). Liz offers G1 Hull Reinforcement and Armour upgrades (handy if your shields go down, ideally want to prevent that firstly though) and Juri offers Sensor and Scanner mods. So pick and choose.

With either of them unlocked, mod your mines for High Capacity and add 2x Ion to the small and Reverb to the medium.

Get a feel for these too.

You should now have some defensive weaponry while you focus on fleeing upon interdiction.
When you submit, 4 pips to sys, 2 to Eng and practice FA-Off 180 turns, FA-Off and boost. Target the enemy (mine is 'H' for Hostile Threat), ensure Lasers are set to Fire at Will, wait until they open fire and then unleash the mines behind you as you prepare to Wake out. While you're running, be erratic, snake around, don't fly in a straight line.

It's worth noting that also unlocking either Elvira or Lei to pop resists on your Shield and Boosters, will keep you alive a bit longer under fire. That may want to be a priority while you get accustomed to your stock defensive countermeasures.

I also suggest toying with a medium-sized fighter in a High RES at some point, to get more accustomed to combat situations so you can deal with them better, also "know your enemy".

Otherwise, good luck and have fun!

 

[Sugarat]

Best advice you can get is here OP.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uh9AWV_BWo0 ..Video is for T-7, but is transferable to T-9.

 

[Durden T.]

The thing with PVP interdictions is they behave nothing like NPC interdictions. Also not really a great idea telling someone to downgrade ships, OP just needs to learn to defend himself, it isn't exactly hard, just takes a little practice and more importantly discipline, it is easy to just start mashing buttons and trying to run when all hell is breaking lose.. All it takes is to remain calm and follow a procedure, no need to downgrade cargo space and switch to a Python or Anaconda.

This exactly. Repped.

OP: No matter how many advises you get, or follow, the best one is to always keep calm and do the right thing in the right moment. Everything happens so fast when interdicted, specially in PvP, but even though you need to act quickly, you need to be calm and steady, otherwise you'll end up hitting everything at the same time, and doing your opponent a favor...

Escapology guide via high-wake:

Do this

Submit to the interdiction, your cool-down is faster (not applicable to escaping a fight)
As soon as you drop out of super-cruise max pips to engines 2 to shields
Start boosting at full throttle away from the hostile (or back past it if it's a less maneuverable ship than yours)
Spam chaff
Select a nearby system and start your jump (can't be mass-locked)
Evade whilst boosting until you jump
Once you've jumped drop out of super-cruise select another nearby star and jump again (repeat if necessary)
Return to desired course

Do not

Waste time wondering who he is or what he wants (interdiction is hostile)
Waste time talking
Fly without shields
Combat log

This is very good advise overall, except for the pip management. I think shield strength is far more important than boost capacity, specially if your attacker is faster than you, which you probably won't even know...

Players aren't going to generally make stupid interdictions, like attempting an interdiction in the cone of a white dwarf that insures their destruction...

That is true generally speaking, certainly, but there are stupid and over confident commanders out there too... I've met a few...

 

[Stigbob]

This is very good advise overall, except for the pip management. I think shield strength is far more important than boost capacity, specially if your attacker is faster than you, which you probably won't even know...

As a rule I only fly nimble ships so the guide is based (and works) on them. I've never flown the bigger freighters, so I'll happily bow to your pip wisdom.




Edit : I've now edited that into the escapology guide for the benefit of future generations

 

[SkyB]

7A G5 + experimental dirty drive thrusters let you get away from any npc.

I think that's the easiest solution + you can also put these thruster in a Conda. I always prefer internal switching over more engineering.

 

[Stigbob]

7A G5 + experimental dirty drive thrusters let you get away from any npc.

I think that's the easiest solution + you can also put these thruster in a Conda. I always prefer internal switching over more engineering.

In an anaconda with 7A thrusters you should be trouncing any NPC in short order.

 

[piercehead]

7A G5 + experimental dirty drive thrusters let you get away from any npc.

That's truly hilarious advice for a T9.

 

[777Driver]

That's truly hilarious advice for a T9.

Yeah, trying to figure if he's joking or not. Imperial Cutter, most definitely. The T9's mass is over 1800 tonnes when laden, unlike the imperial Cutter it uses Class 7 thrusters. I think I get about 184m/s top cruise speed, 290m/s boost, that is with G5 Clean drives. Trying to run in that ship is the worst thing you could do.

 

[[VR] Dr Gentech]

Thank you everyone! So the takeaway stuff is that high-waking is hyperspace jumping and will generally work, I was right to submit to the interdiction when I thought I was going to lose, upgrading to an Anaconda is an objectively terrible idea for newbs that will get me tarred and feathered lol, and I could maybe get a better shield or something along those lines? My shield is currently 5A, unengineered. I do eventually want an Anaconda because I want to take it exploring, but I won't upgrade to it until I've got enough money to outfit it properly + at least a few rebuys. I do want to limit engineering my T9 to what modules I can transfer to the Anaconda when I get it (the 6A fsd so far); it doesn't sound like engineered 7A thrusters will be very useful but they would transfer between ships? Are there any other components on my T9 I could engineer to make it more survivable that will transfer over to an Anaconda in the future? What size shield should an Anaconda have, maybe I should upgrade my T9s shield (currently 5A) and engineer it a bit? Thank you everyone!

About interdictions, I'm considering getting my partner to get on the game and interdict me a few times so I can practice lol, this is my first flight simulator but he knows a lot more about them

 

[GunnerBill]

Escapology guide via high-wake:

Do this

Submit to the interdiction, your cool-down is faster (not applicable to escaping a fight).
As soon as you drop out of super-cruise max pips to engines 2 to shields in a nimble ship, 4 to shields and 2 to engines in a slow ship.
Start boosting at full throttle away from the hostile (or back past it if it's a less maneuverable ship than yours).
Spam chaff.
Select a nearby system and start your jump (can't be mass-locked).
Evade whilst boosting until you jump.
Once you've jumped drop out of super-cruise select another nearby star and jump again (repeat if necessary).
Return to desired course.

Do not

Waste time wondering who he is or what he wants (interdiction is hostile).
Waste time talking.
Fly without shields.
Combat log.


EDIT : added pip management for freighters

I'd add to this: don't even bother with guns

1. They make you think you can fight, which by the time you realise that wasn't a good idea usually means you're gonna die.
2. Leaving them off makes you go faster and jump further.

 

[Adhock]

My shield is currently 5A, unengineered.

*spittakes*

5A!?!!?? Jesus Christ OP no wonder you're getting popped!!!

You need to run a Class 7 shield MINIMUM until you get used to the ship. Rating doesn't matter. Your weight and balance on the shield is terrible with a 5A. Those shields won't last a single shot even if you engineer them to god mode! If you are not running a Class 7 or 8 shield, DON'T fly the T9.

Trust me. You'd be surprised how much better your shields will hold at 7E compared to a 5A.

Give me your entire loadout so I can PROPERLY judge your weight and balance. You'd be surprised how much more survivable a properly weighted and balanced ship is compared to min/maxing certain well known attributes.

Once you get used to the T9 and it's quirks then you can do whatever you want with it but until you do, ALWAYS fly with a proper Weight and Balance.

 

[[VR] Dr Gentech]

*spittakes*

5A!?!!?? Jesus Christ OP no wonder you're getting popped!!!

You need to run a Class 7 shield MINIMUM until you get used to the ship. Rating doesn't matter. Your weight and balance on the shield is terrible with a 5A. Those shields won't last a single shot even if you engineer them to god mode! If you are not running a Class 7 or 8 shield, DON'T fly the T9.

Trust me. You'd be surprised how much better your shields will hold at 7E compared to a 5A.

Give me your entire loadout so I can PROPERLY judge your weight and balance. You'd be surprised how much more survivable a properly weighted and balanced ship is compared to min/maxing certain well known attributes.

Once you get used to the T9 and it's quirks then you can do whatever you want with it but until you do, ALWAYS fly with a proper Weight and Balance.

Okay okay, that sounds serious, how do I tell you my Loadout? I can try tell you just what I've got on the ship?

1. No weapons
2. 1x point defence 1x chaff launcher 1x 0A Shield Booster
3. stock Lightweight Alloys hull, 4A power plant, 7D Thrusters, 6A Frame Shift drive (engineered to G5 with mass manager), 5D life support, 5D power distributor, 4D sensors
4. (Everything in optional internal is cargo except for the 5A shield generator and the docking computer and the planetary approach suite)

This is basically the Loadout from Masark's guide to trade, I think it is designed to maximise laden jump range

My shields did seem to go really quickly so I will start shopping around for a bigger one

 

[777Driver]

Okay okay, that sounds serious, how do I tell you my Loadout? I can try tell you just what I've got on the ship?

1. No weapons
2. 1x point defence 1x chaff launcher 1x 0A Shield Booster
3. stock Lightweight Alloys hull, 4A power plant, 7D Thrusters, 6A Frame Shift drive (engineered to G5 with mass manager), 5D life support, 5D power distributor, 4D sensors
4. (Everything in optional internal is cargo except for the 5A shield generator and the docking computer and the planetary approach suite)

This is basically the Loadout from Masark's guide to trade, I think it is designed to maximise laden jump range

My shields did seem to go really quickly so I will start shopping around for a bigger one

Do you have access to Selene Jean? You can get an upgrade on that stock hull, there won't be any mass penalty. I disagree with Adhoc regarding running Class 7 or 8 shields, you can get away with class 6 engineered, just use quad boosters, no point messing around with point defence. Keep all PIPS in the shields until you highwake.

Of course if you don't feel comfortable you should go for max shielding, personally seems like a waste of cargo space, you are not planning on fighting, just holding shields until you can jump. I am referring purely to NPC pirates.

 

[Spacecat]

Also, when choosing a system to high wake to, use the left navigation panel, not the map. Systems are listed in order of closeness to the current system, simply scroll to the top and pick one of the ones just under it.

 

[[VR] Dr Gentech]

I really appreciate the advice everyone. I don't have access to Selene Jean, I will look into how to get access to her. I might try 6A shields and see if I can engineer them and some shield boosters maybe. What engineer modifications should I put on my shields and shield boosters?

 

[Adhock]

It does come under the limit for it's FSD rating but that is an extremely risky build. In fact submitting and high waking with this build is not a viable strategy for you.

You have a subpar shield and no armor. This build is built entirely around never getting caught. Ever. Even voluntarily. If you get interdicted, YOU MUST WIN.

While it does maximize for FSD travel, once it's dragged into normal space, it's a sitting duck.

Your FSD is not going to be able to save you with your shields pushed well past the breaking point, your armor nonexistant, and your thrusters are actually being overworked if you're carrying a full load meaning the T9 will not respond well when in normal space. It's slight but you're going to be sluggish even compared to a properly balanced T9 who thrusters are not overburdened.

This is a VERY high risk build and once you're caught, you'd better have a combat escort or you'd better start dumping cargo to lighten the load.

The smaller power distributor hurts too. You're not going to have as much power to shift so if your shields go down, the regeneration is going to eat your pool sooner which will slow their regen time and you will be shields down much longer. And with essentially no armor, that's going to cost you.

Also you won't have the power to feed your booster so you won't be able to boost as often which is how you gain and keep distance from the pirates chasing you.

While this ship is excellent for moving cargo across vast distances, that's all it's good for. Once you drop into real space, it's a fat target and little else.

Upgrade the Power Plant and Power Distributor back to Class 6 but D rate them. Thusters should go to Class 7 but C rate those. Upgrade to the Reinforce Alloy to give you more Hull points so if your shield DOES go down, they have to eat through more hull then if you had the stock lightweight alloy. That will buy you more time. Get a Class 7E shield and fill the Class 5 slot with a cargo bay.

With more power you can even fit a second A rated Shield booster.

You'll lose about a lightyear in laden jump range and about 70 cargo slots but you'll find your ship will perform much better when in normal space and under attack. With more breathing room, you can practice the escape techniques touted by the rest of the forum. Once you have those down to a science and they're second nature if you want to go back to the build you listed above then by all means, take the risk.

Others may disagree with me but I know the value of a properly Weight and Balanced ship. Pirates have tried before to attack me in a T7.

I may not have been able to jump as far or as fast but when a Pirate decided they wanted to pick a fight... it did not end well for them. And I happily went about unloading my cargo as well as picking up an extra bounty payday.