Stop killing immersion for the sake of Atari gameplay.

[CMDR EDGEL0RD]

Sigh. Okay, time for some semi-true pseudo-history, but only because you made me do it ...

Because having people do these things on spaceships is important.

Long ago, well over a thousand years ago back in the 1950s/1960s on Earth, decisions were made. The scientists who built the first rockets wanted to send robotic probes into space instead of sending people. The people decided differently, believing that the physical presence of humans in space was important, and the human execution of tasks in space was also important, even if machines could do things more safely and more efficiently. The scientists and politicians struck a balance, in which the journey to space was pioneered by people and machines. As a result, ever since that day we as humans have assumed basic, easily automated roles in space, whether it was docking spacecraft to a space station, or building the first rocket fuel extraction plant on the earth's moon.

To borrow someone else's words from that time, we do these things not because they are easy, but because they are hard. Otherwise, you would simply sit at your computer, push a button to tell your automated space-faring robot fleet where to go and what to do, and wander away somewhere else for an hour or so before coming back, reviewing you profits, and with an empty, disconnected sigh, mumble "that's nice, I guess ... "

If the scientists had won, you would not need to worry about only two "fire" buttons. You also would not know the joy of canyon-racing on a world you and your friends and fellow explorers just discovered.

Too much to imagine for me. This have no ways to be real, in the world where people work, fight in wars, and not just canyon-race. That is the problem.
Why then I dont have to crawl outside and short-circuit firing mechanism in order to shoot?
This wouldnt surivie for 1300 years. Just no way.
And FSD in its operation already automates more than autopilot would.
And how you can imagine you ways around ship components not being avaliable for space peso?

 

[GraXXoR]

OP... SRSLY?

I was kinda nodding to a few things you said, then you went and dropped a clanger....

Places like Hutton Orbital couldn't be profitable.

It takes less than an hour to reach Hutton Orbital... There are plenty of towns in the real world today that take more than an hour to reach.
The fact that everyone knows it and most have made the pilgrimage once.... Some many more times...
That's one of the most interesting and "realistic" locations in the game... Actually Famous for something physical rather than some made up Power Play generic cookie cutter "famous."

Sorry, but you blew it with that argument.... Just sunk the whole boat.

 

[CMDR EDGEL0RD]

OP... SRSLY?

I was kinda nodding to a few things you said, then you went and dropped a clanger....

Places like Hutton Orbital couldn't be profitable.

It takes less than an hour to reach Hutton Orbital... There are plenty of towns in the real world today that take more than an hour to reach.
The fact that everyone knows it and most have made the pilgrimage once.... Some many more times...
That's one of the most interesting and "realistic" locations in the game... Actually Famous for something physical rather than some made up Power Play generic cookie cutter "famous."

Sorry, but you blew it with that argument.... Just sunk the whole boat.

Yet with travels speeds present in-game, places like Hutton would be least popular trade route. Or they would be incentified so much that I dont know what would be left of profits. What is wrong with my logic?

 

[UmbraRex]

Well, odd thing to ask me that particular follow up question on, but I went and checked the suggestion forums and could find not a single request for our hollo-mes to be able to view x-rated videos and post on forums in game. Since no one has asked for it, then I feel safe in saying that most would not consider these to be priorities.

And what, exactly, do you think you CMDR is doing when yer not there to fly the ship around?

*wanders off whistling innocently

 

[metascrawl]

And what, exactly, do you think you CMDR is doing when yer not there to fly the ship around?

*wanders off whistling innocently

Looking for a birthday present for his girlfriend. That's why he has to clear his browser history.

 

[GraXXoR]

Yet with travels speeds present in-game, places like Hutton would be least popular trade route. Or they would be incentified so much that I dont know what would be left of profits. What is wrong with my logic?

So just because somewhere isn’t Ginza means it’s a failure?
There are plenty of small towns that are famous for something or other. They might not have an economy equal to the City, but they support a couple of thousand residents.

Where’s the immersion breaker?

 

[ZeroAi]

Why only two fire buttons? Because.
Why no autopilot? Because.
Why no selective vector flight assistance? Because
And why all those and other things I can do on my home PC are unavailable in 3300 or whatever? JUST BECAUSE. Do I have to imagine that things are more complicated than I see, even in areas they clearly cannot be such?
Why no business/property opportunities? BECAUSE.
Why an increase in investments does not increase your profit?? BECAUSE.
Why there are so many *Corporations* with no signs of stock markets? Because.
Material traders exchange rates?? Because.
Why have I to scavenge for destroyed ship parts despite having about billion? JUST BECAUSE.

I wish FD would give everything they do with the game a reality check FIRST, rather than taking only "difficulty" and "time to achieve" parameters into account. Also, they have to understand that difficulty in a computer game should NOT have man-hours as its main measure.

I think most of what we want is on their "big" list of features they'd love to add.

And as a programmer myself, I know that sometimes what seems like it would be easy to add is not even close to being easy.

But yes, there are some simple qol things they won't add to their game for one reason or another, and only time will tell what effect that will have on the game.

 

[GraXXoR]

I think most of what we want is on their "big" list of features they'd love to add.

And as a programmer myself, I know that sometimes what seems like it would be easy to add is not even close to being easy.

But yes, there are some simple qol things they won't add to their game for one reason or another, and only time will tell what effect that will have on the game.

Unfortunately it seems that David will never allow more than two fire buttons. He has pretty much said this. Instar citizen, Chris calls it character giving flaws.

 

[CMDR EDGEL0RD]

So just because somewhere isn’t Ginza means it’s a failure?
There are plenty of small towns that are famous for something or other. They might not have an economy equal to the City, but they support a couple of thousand residents.

Where’s the immersion breaker?

Yeah. Maybe survive part is overexaggerated. At least after nerfs which happened.
What made me remember about Hutton is 5 million data transfer missions to it they used to give. No one would give such and will be left with some profit.

By the way, same goes for skimmer genocide, which I never approved. That thing being unrealistic is, what I belive, caused most of the criticism to it. And, on the other end, unrealistic lack of adequate profit opportunities at higher end of the game provided support for such bull existance.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

After reading the OP's responses, I think this thread is a good example of how being overly dramatic with diction and tone can derail the presentation and understanding of what one is attempting to communicate.

Yes, myself and I am sure many others would not protest meaningful changes/additions to introduce or add some depth to the whole 'space sim' potential that this game posses. I do not believe that anyone would be thrilled about having to wait for two hours for cargo to load (or any other changes in the name of realisim that impacts time required to do things, positively or negatively), and despite statements by the OP, I do not believe he would either.

I also do not believe that he would lobby for x-rated video content to be added either (can't use the 'p' word that sounds like corn for some reason).

I will then assume that he didn't mean the 'conole peseant' thing either, at least not literally.

I'm also not willing to rule out the involvement of alcohol as a contributing factor to the creation and more than a few resulting responses of this thread.

 

[CMDR EDGEL0RD]

After reading the OP's responses, I think this thread is a good example of how being overly dramatic with diction and tone can derail the presentation and understanding of what one is attempting to communicate.

Yes, myself and I am sure many others would not protest meaningful changes/additions to introduce or add some depth to the whole 'space sim' potential that this game posses. I do not believe that anyone would be thrilled about having to wait for two hours for cargo to load (or any other changes in the name of realisim that impacts time required to do things, positively or negatively), and despite statements by the OP, I do not believe he would either.

I also do not believe that he would lobby for x-rated video content to be added either (can't use the 'p' word that sounds like corn for some reason).

I will then assume that he didn't mean the 'conole peseant' thing either, at least not literally.

I'm also not willing to rule out the involvement of alcohol as a contributing factor to the creation and more than a few resulting responses of this thread.

"Console pesants" is an old meme.
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/the-glorious-pc-gaming-master-race
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Console%20Peasant

About protesting on meaningful changes, you have no idea. My dramatism grows too fast while being on those forums.
Also, English is not my native. Maybe im trying to build sentences correctly too hard or maybe just fail on this.

 

[CMDR ANCALAGON]

"Console pesants" is an old meme.
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/the-glorious-pc-gaming-master-race
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Console%20Peasant

About protesting on meaningful changes, you have no idea. My dramatism grows too fast while being on those forums.
Also, English is not my native. Maybe im trying to build sentences correctly too hard or maybe just fail on this.

No worries, I caught on pretty quick.

We each have our own flavors, but sometimes we have to mute some of them if we expect to actually be considered.

Know what the difference is between "bitc$&-#" and "complaining is? Complaining is when someone actually expects something to be done about it.

 

[Bashy81]

"For me, magic was gone when I've got to Python stage at 3rd week of playing. No ways to conveniently use my belly plasma was outrageous in its inconsequence. And discontent just were increasing futher I went."

Sounds like youve just rushed through the game by grinding it, & learned nowhere near enough about using smaller ships that give you the experience you need to enjoy & make the most of larger ships when you get them. You've ruined the game for yourself as a consequence. It seems that all you have to teach others is a cautionary lesson on how not to start playing the game. If this describes what youve done, im sorry for you. Playing the game is letting the game take its own pace. You end up trying a bit of everything, and naturally gravitate to the things you enjoy & pickup the skills you need as you go. If you try to fasttrack everything you are effectively trying to break the game, and strangely enough it then seems broken to you.

 

[CMDR EDGEL0RD]

"For me, magic was gone when I've got to Python stage at 3rd week of playing. No ways to conveniently use my belly plasma was outrageous in its inconsequence. And discontent just were increasing futher I went."

Sounds like youve just rushed through the game by grinding it, & learned nowhere near enough about using smaller ships that give you the experience you need to enjoy & make the most of larger ships when you get them. You've ruined the game for yourself as a consequence. It seems that all you have to teach others is a cautionary lesson on how not to start playing the game. If this describes what youve done, im sorry for you. Playing the game is letting the game take its own pace. You end up trying a bit of everything, and naturally gravitate to the things you enjoy & pickup the skills you need as you go. If you try to fasttrack everything you are effectively trying to break the game, and strangely enough it then seems broken to you.

No serious rushing, just had a lot of time on my hands when I've started. Winders were jammed into neutron stars, blackholes visited, rares traded, etc. And mostly D grade Python on class 6 PP with disconut doesnt cost too much.
But two fire buttons? As I've read later, "genius solution"? This thing put a big crack on all of my impression on the game, which started to grow with time.

 

[crushdepth]

I find that the developers tend to listen more when you're not scolding them like intractable children.

Actually they don't listen at all, so how you go about it has no difference in the outcome.

 

[d8veh]

Guys, remember the Golden Rule.

The golden rule is that there are no golden rules!

 

[damon8r351]

Actually they don't listen at all, so how you go about it has no difference in the outcome.

I actually have two documented instances when things I pointed had action taken by the developers that I've written about later in the thread. No doubt this was something you hadn't got to yet before you rushed down here to point out I was wrong. I'll give you a second to get to that, and expect an apology shortly afterwards.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

I've dropped Elite a while ago, but returned as some steps in the right direction are clearly being made. The game started to give hope. But I am far from playing immersed as things are now.

Here we go with that word again...

Your level of deep mental involvement <> anyone else's level of deep mental involvement.

I hate to be the one to clue you in, but "your immersion" is "your problem". Not Frontier's, not mine, not anyone else's, just yours.

If you can engage mentally, deeply, with what you're doing, nothing anyone else does will change that.

And most importantly, Elite is not a Starship Pilot Trainer. It's not a Life in 3304 Simulator.

It's a GAME. If it didn't have some "gamey" elements, to be honest, it would blow.

"Your Elite" would not be "My Elite", and I wouldn't want to play your vision of Elite, because it wouldn't be any fun.

 

[avow555]

I find that the developers tend to listen more when you're not scolding them like intractable children.

Really!

The devs on this game respond neither to (justafiable) outright criticism or rectum kissing.

"Elite Rngerous"...

 

[Havvk]

Here we go with that word again...

Your level of deep mental involvement <> anyone else's level of deep mental involvement.

I hate to be the one to clue you in, but "your immersion" is "your problem". Not Frontier's, not mine, not anyone else's, just yours.

If you can engage mentally, deeply, with what you're doing, nothing anyone else does will change that.

And most importantly, Elite is not a Starship Pilot Trainer. It's not a Life in 3304 Simulator.

It's a GAME. If it didn't have some "gamey" elements, to be honest, it would blow.

"Your Elite" would not be "My Elite", and I wouldn't want to play your vision of Elite, because it wouldn't be any fun.

Wrong.


I bought Elite, thinking it was going to be a more accessible/poor-man's Star Citizen. So far it's failed all of my hopes. Unless Braben can roll out at least space legs, then I'm sure a lot of us will be happier with SC