Is JWE good or bad for ED?

[Dommarraa]

I am not a fan of software companies getting bigger. Experience is diluted, passion and vision gets isolated from the cutting edge, and progress gets measured with KPIs rather than the intangibles that people here scream about so often.

It's not a disaster, but wish they were not doing it.

 

[Iskariot]

I only recently (about a year ago) became interested in Frontier because ED was announced for the PS4, so I don't really know the company like some of you do. That's why I'm looking for your insight.

Optimistic view - Jurassic World Evolution is a good thing for Elite Dangerous, because it will infuse more money into the company and perhaps provide the software routines needed to give ED landable earth-like worlds with living creatures running around NMS style, but better! [yesnod]

Pessimist view - JWE is a shift in the company's focus, and resources are being diverted away from ED to focus on this new project. It seems like Frontier "spared no expense" in creating JWE, whereas ED feels like a back-burner project these days..

So what do you think, is JWE the beginning or the end of ED?

I believe that the end of the world is nigh.
Or to articulate more succinctly: Doom, doom, doom.

I believe a game developer can never work on more than one game at the time.
And obviously no game developer has ever done that before.
This is the end.

 

[Gully Foyle]

Only if you fold it right. And of course you will need a size 3 Life Specimen Transportation Unit.

If I have to collect mats and engineer a bird cage I will pop a blood vessel

 

[Gully Foyle]

I am not a fan of software companies getting bigger. Experience is diluted, passion and vision gets isolated from the cutting edge, and progress gets measured with KPIs rather than the intangibles that people here scream about so often.

It's not a disaster, but wish they were not doing it.

Wise words you handsome feller!

There is a tipping point to a developers size for sure. I think if they keep the 3 games in separate divisions, it will slow the chances of this happening.

 

[Alex Brentnall]

I only recently (about a year ago) became interested in Frontier because ED was announced for the PS4, so I don't really know the company like some of you do. That's why I'm looking for your insight.

Optimistic view - Jurassic World Evolution is a good thing for Elite Dangerous, because it will infuse more money into the company and perhaps provide the software routines needed to give ED landable earth-like worlds with living creatures running around NMS style, but better! [yesnod]

Pessimist view - JWE is a shift in the company's focus, and resources are being diverted away from ED to focus on this new project. It seems like Frontier "spared no expense" in creating JWE, whereas ED feels like a back-burner project these days..

So what do you think, is JWE the beginning or the end of ED?

They did a hiring spree over 2016/2017 as well as a new hq building. I'm fairly convinced that they spent a ton of time expanding and training new devs which delayed horizons and spread it over 2 years instead of 1. On the flip side they now have 3 teams, a much broader and more experienced Dev team and now seem to have slowed the hiring. Not sure if it's slow increase or just staying level now in terms of headcount but compare 2015 to now and the number of staff at FDev has increased significantly.

So the short answer is - It has delayed Elite a bit but has significantly strengthened the team and company that build Elite. Short term hit, long term gain. More finances and experience to continue development.


Note: I know nothing, this is all speculation based off teh internets!

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I don't know the answer to this. One thing that feels like a 'red flag' to me is progress in ED compared to JWE. Frontier just created an amazing-looking game (JWE) from scratch, and during that same time period, the additional content added to ED has been "meh" in comparison. Now if Frontier starts using JWE features to create ELWs in ED, then that's a different, more optimistic story.

JWE has comparingly simple gameplay loop comparing to ED. It does one thing and it does it very well. ED looks amazing as well.

 

[Gully Foyle]

Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.

 

[Gully Foyle]

I believe that the end of the world is nigh.
Or to articulate more succinctly: Doom, doom, doom.

I believe a game developer can never work on more than one game at the time.
And obviously no game developer has ever done that before.
This is the end.

I think I just had an acid flashback. I heard The Doors in my head!

JWE has comparingly simple gameplay loop comparing to ED. It does one thing and it does it very well. ED looks amazing as well.

I hope we can play as the dinos. I have a need , a need to FEED

 

[Soon(TM)]

ED has been on the side lines since the development for Planet coaster started. Then they moved on to Jurrasic World Evolution.

Why would they keep the majority of Devs working on a 4 year old game that has already made its money.

It's about business.

David Braben has a passion for Elite games, we all know that. But first and foremost he's a businessman, and business men make money.

The dev team for ED was once 200 strong, now id bet it's around 20 at most.

I for one am very excited about the new Jurassic park game, FDEV have always been good at that genre, rollercoaster Tycoon 3 was amazing and still is.

£44.99 is a bit steep mind you!

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

ED lost its Executive Director (edit ... actually correct title is Executive Producer) to JWE, so that is bound to have had an impact. A replacement was made, but we have heard nothing (as far as I am aware) from him.

Eddie and Adams were executive producers for ED for 2 years at that point, they were producers for Horizons, not Michael Brookes.

 

[kilvenny]

Definitely good for ED. The information system JWE is a great fit for ED. Park people look more realistic. Dinosaurs look good.

The genome piece looks interesting, if this can also convert into the dinosaurs looking different then you can see the potential to seed this into ED to create worlds with different dinosaurs.

Terrain and weather looks interesting.

I was also quite intrigued by the helicopter shots when they were shooting the dinosaurs. There was a side on shot of the gunner and then the shooting itself. The dinosaur was shot and moved without any one the ground. This would work well as a mechanism in ED. Gather items/animals etc.

More generally, I think there is a large team working on something for ED, Eddie Symons and Laurence Oldham have been very quiet recently.

 

[JesusRocks1988]

I choose to believe that JWE is a good thing for Elite Dangerous.

At the content reveals at the Expo, I watched as FD showed stuff for JWE first. One of the features that looked absolutely brilliant was the InGen Codex.

I remember seeing that and thinking "wow, that would be great if they added that to ED".

Then later on, during the Beyond content reveal, they mentioned the Codex for the Q4 update.

Either they already had that planned for ED and cross pollinated with JWE or the JWE team came up with it and cross pollinated with the ED team.

Either way, JWE is clearly good for ED.

 

[Maro-Val]

Its bussiness. Jurrasic world is a huge franchise. Way bigger than the elite franchise so.. the math is easy.
Elite needs the vision of a true gamer at heart in order to shine one day. I only see a cold bussiness vision. Hense the so fitting "mile wide, an inch deep" saying.
So i believe that yes.. its the beginning of the end, but it only makes sense in bussiness.

 

[Valorin]

Was Planet Coaster bad for ED? I really don't think so. I think quite the contrary. I am under the impression that Frontier developed a lot over the last two years and I am really happy for them.
Generally I don't believe any game a company developes is bad for another one. I guess in small companies teams have to be split, but even then I am pretty sure it's a plus for all their games in the long run. I also believe, that a company which wants to give up on a game would try to develope something that is even a little bit in line with the game they would want to lay to sleep. In Frontier's case they have space ships, rollercoasters and soon a dinosaur zoo simulation. Those games are so different, I am pretty sure they don't even share much of a playerbase.
As far as I am concerned I really love Elite, but I can't be bothered to buy Planet Coaster. Not even discounted, though it seems to be awesome it's just not my genre. Jurrassic World... Hm. That's hard. I am not very interested in zoo management but... Dinosaurs! Perhaps I'll look at it when it's discounted, though I really hated the last movie.

EDIT: what also just came to mind, I guess we all hope that the engines of Elite and Jurassic World are even a little bit related and that the vegetation and terrain, and perhaps also the creatures (if not dinosaurs) might be part of a future Elite feature...

 

[Lightspeed]

Eddie and Adams were executive producers for ED for 2 years at that point, they were producers for Horizons, not Michael Brookes.

On June 21 2017 MB announced he was moving to a new 'secret' project. Elite Horizons first released for PC on Dec 15 2015. There is a difference between 'producers' and 'Executive Producer.'

If you are going to keep arguing everything I type in this forum, at least get your facts straight. You know, those facts that sometimes get in the way of what you are trying to do.

 

[Weps]

So what do you think, is JWE the beginning or the end of ED?

In the middle, but leaning substantially towards the pessimist view. 3.0's content so far made it clear for me just how many developers are still assigned to E: D.

It's true that tech developed for JW: E could end up being used for E: D, but that's only a positive if there's some gameplay to accompany that tech. Tech has always been FDEV's strong point, and E: D is a marvelous gem in that regard, but the problem with it has been either missing or downright bad gameplay.

As for the money infusion, I never adhered to that logic. PC for example didn't seem to boost in any way E: D's development. That's just not how it works, a company won't reinvest in a product it already cashed in on, big time, just for the sake of "making things right".

 

[stormyuk]

Duck, I think for us PS4 peasants it's probably a good thing, it gives Frontier programmers more experience with the PS4 and Cobra. Hopefully some of that can translate back into Elite for improved performance for us. I am very interested in what resolution the PS4 Pro is running at with JWE.

 

[SnowyNI]

By the look of it, it's just Planet Coaster with Dinos, not sure how they would use it in ED, unless we're getting ED the RTS game?

 

[Stigbob]

It's OK for game development companies to make video games.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

On June 21 2017 MB announced he was moving to a new 'secret' project. Elite Horizons first released for PC on Dec 15 2015. There is a difference between 'producers' and 'Executive Producer.'

If you are going to keep arguing everything I type in this forum, at least get your facts straight. You know, those facts that sometimes get in the way of what you are trying to do.

They are both EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS for Elite Dangerous: Horizons Whole expansion where done under their command. They even talked about this recently on stream. There is no one big guy calling shots - it is essentially team of executive producers who each tries to do their own field but consult together about things in question.

In such large teams there's NEVER one person responsible for, well, everything.

In the middle, but leaning substantially towards the pessimist view. 3.0's content so far made it clear for me just how many developers are still assigned to E: D.

So you are saying FD is lying when they say ED team is basically same size as has been for last two years?