Surface mining (installations) as per Elite Frontier II

Hi, i'm new to the forums but have been playing Elite in many incarnations over the years (started on amstrad 6128) and wish you would bring back the surface miners from Elite Frontier II where you could drop a miner on the surface and come back to retrieve the processed ore [yesnod]

This is taken from the original manual:

SURFACE MINING

Once you are established, this type of mining is a more predictable means
of getting ore. It does, however, demand a large initial outlay in order
to acquire the installations and possibly a larger ship (minimum of 30
tonnes of free cargo space) to transport them The only recommended device
is the MB4 Mining Machine which, alas is still not widely available. The
MB4 is impressive in that it not only mines but also refines the material,
so you put it in place, leave it and come back to pick up the results. The
MB4 can mine, separate and refine minerals, alloys and even on occasions
precious metals and gem stones.

The disadvantage is the risk of mining others' claims, resulting in an
aggresive response to your activities. In some areas it is illegal to mine
and police, depending their mood, may not be too interested in maintaining
a public image of fairness and understanding and may blast you to pieces.

SETTING UP YOUR WB4

Choose a mining site with a temperature below 200 degrees Centigrade. The
most likely suitable locations will be on systems' inner planets which are
more likely to be mineral rich. Ones which humans have hardly touched are
more likely to be mineral rich as machines like the MB4 and its
predecessors are very thorough, and will have scoured most of the surface
of core worlds by now. To test the composition of the crust, you need to
land.

Land at the chosen site and select the Weapons Control Panel by clicking on
the Scanner

Activate the Unload Rig icon (Fig 78) which will cause the mining rig to be
unloaded whereupon it will analyse a sample of the crust and relay the
results to your on board computer. If the prospects are good it will bed
itself in and begin drilling immediately. You may then take off and come
back later once it has mined the full capacitv of 10 tonnes.

FINDING THE MB4 AGAIN

All the mines have a beacon which has your own coded signal allowing the
computer to pin-point its position. If you pick up someone else's rig,
your computer will automatically register the code of the owner. All other
rigs belonging to them in this star system will then be shown on your
inventory page. This means that stealing ore is possible however the same
can be done to you. A safeguard is to avoid placing numerous rigs in one
system, so that they are not so easily found should one of your rigs be
purloined. Your beacons will use a different code in each system.

Select the Inventory icon F3 and cycle through until you come to the Mining
Installations page (Fig 79). It will list your rigs and their location.

Fly to the Star system in which a particular rig is situated.

Set up the Mining Installations page again and use the button next to the
rig you wish to find.

The on-board computer will then set it up as your current target. You may
then fly to it manually or with the Autopilot. You can deselect the target
as before by placing the pointer away from the target and using the left
hand mouse button.

COLLECTING THE ORE

Land near to the installation and select the Load Rig icon (Fig 80) with
one click. this will remotely instruct the machinery to off load ore into
your hold until it is full. It will be no more than 10 tonnes at a time
because that is the maximum capacity of the MB4's hopper.

If there is no ore to collect the first selection of the icon will load the
rig onto the ship if you have space.

Your cargo inventory (Inventory icon F3) will show the minerals on board

COLLECTING THE MB4 MINING MACHINE

Land next to the installation and click on the Load Rig icon twice so that
the rig and the contents of its hopper are taken on board.

As stated above, the rig will be loaded after the first click if there is
no ore in the hopper

The rig may be left for further mining. There is no need to bring it on
board if you intend to Deposit it in the same place.

If you want to move the MB4 to another location on the same surface because
a site is 'mined out', it is worth moving it a good distance. This is
because the MB4 probes quite a large area with its underground drills.

If your MB4 had found a rich seam of minerals, Do not move it as the seam
may be a long way below ground and the MB4 may not be able to find it
again.
 
Yes - these were always good fun to place, leave, try to find again, etc.

Of course, I'd be hoping for advancements in technology so that it didn't take a month for them to get 10 tonnes of cheap metals - or maybe I just had terrible luck with them back then.
 
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They were awful to use, but as they set a precedent in the elite lore hopefully they will bring them back in some form :D would be great to buy some and set them up somewhere remote and come back to a nice cargo hold full of goodies
 

Lestat

Banned
I think it a cool idea in general. But I think Frontier going to want us to be close to the Mining Rig. Maybe a new type of SRV that can scoop and deliver to the ship.
 
Hopefully they will, it might attract more people to mining if they can drop a miner and just harvest the ore every now and then

With respect, that's not mining so much as credit-farming.

I'm generally against passive earning mechanisms, since they don't actually add anything to gameplay, they just generate credits whilst you're offline.

Given the scale of earnings in ED, unless they generate millions of credits then the majority of players just won't bother with them. If they DO earn millions then most people will just set one up and just rake in the credits.

I honestly don't see the need for this feature.
 
With respect, that's not mining so much as credit-farming.

I'm generally against passive earning mechanisms, since they don't actually add anything to gameplay, they just generate credits whilst you're offline.

Given the scale of earnings in ED, unless they generate millions of credits then the majority of players just won't bother with them. If they DO earn millions then most people will just set one up and just rake in the credits.

I honestly don't see the need for this feature.

Would it perhaps be better if other players could find you mining machine(s) in a way similar to FE2 and FFE (find machine, take machine, get the locations of the player's other mining machines in the same system), or would this create even more problems (other players running off with a few million credits of player assets)?

As for the amount of credit income from a mining machine, I would think that a single machine could probably make about 1-2 million credits per day (as opposed to 1-2 million credit per hour through asteroid/ring mining), while needing to be emptied every 24-48 hours or so. Once you consider the possibility of other players finding and flying away with your mining machine (and any other machines you had in the same system, as per previous suggestion), and not wanting to have more than 2 mining machines in the same system, it would probably take about 5-10 minutes to collect the ore from each machine. Now, assuming that you were to collect the ore exactly every 48 hours, with each machine mining 2 million credits of ore per day, and you spending exactly 5 minutes to collect from each machine, you would be earning 48 million credits per hour while collecting your ore.

The two main limitations here are the number of machines you have and the size of your ship. If you only have 4 mining machines, you will only be able to earn that 48 million credits per hour for 20 minutes every other day. Also, 1 million credits of ore is quite a bit of cargo (for reference, mining for 4-5 hours in a pristine metallic ring in my T9 will net me 640T of ore worth a total of about 10 million credits). So, realistically, you would only be able to collect from 1 or 2 machines before having to head back to a starport to sell all of your ore, which would significantly reduce your credits per hour (you would probably be earning about 16-24 million per hour by collecting from your machines).
 

Lestat

Banned
Would it perhaps be better if other players could find you mining machine(s) in a way similar to FE2 and FFE (find machine, take machine, get the locations of the player's other mining machines in the same system), or would this create even more problems (other players running off with a few million credits of player assets)?
Let think here. There were no players in Those games.

Hum, how are people going to find your rig in 400,000,000,000 system? It would be like winning the lotto. If you found a system with another player on you best buy a lotto ticket because you got lucky. We would also have to rule out pirates because it would upset explorers that are in noncombat ships.

As for the amount of credit income from a mining machine, I would think that a single machine could probably make about 1-2 million credits per day (as opposed to 1-2 million credit per hour through asteroid/ring mining), while needing to be emptied every 24-48 hours or so. Once you consider the possibility of other players finding and flying away with your mining machine (and any other machines you had in the same system, as per previous suggestion), and not wanting to have more than 2 mining machines in the same system, it would probably take about 5-10 minutes to collect the ore from each machine. Now, assuming that you were to collect the ore exactly every 48 hours, with each machine mining 2 million credits of ore per day, and you spending exactly 5 minutes to collect from each machine, you would be earning 48 million credits per hour while collecting your ore.

The two main limitations here are the number of machines you have and the size of your ship. If you only have 4 mining machines, you will only be able to earn that 48 million credits per hour for 20 minutes every other day. Also, 1 million credits of ore is quite a bit of cargo (for reference, mining for 4-5 hours in a pristine metallic ring in my T9 will net me 640T of ore worth a total of about 10 million credits). So, realistically, you would only be able to collect from 1 or 2 machines before having to head back to a starport to sell all of your ore, which would significantly reduce your credits per hour (you would probably be earning about 16-24 million per hour by collecting from your machines).
Here the problem. One player with 1 active ship. The only thing they have to monitor is Mission they are currently on.

I don't think Frontier want to Monitor automative multiple mining rigs that they have to Maintained while the players offline and have to allocate game resources to. We also have to understand if they made the mining rigs only can be used while online. It would be easy to make a Macro/Bot to have a ship fly around for 24/7 so they can get the resources.

Here my suggestion. Make a mining Rig. But the player has to work on to earn Materials. Either moving Mats to To and from your ship.
 
I don't think this really counts as "passive" earnings, though.

If the hopper holds ten tonnes, and you happen to have found a good mining spot (which would take some trial and error) and it's full of gold rather than indite (or bauxite!), then that's about 100k credits for collecting it.

You'd need to spend probably at least five minutes approaching, landing, collecting, and taking off again. So even in the best case where you have a full set of these in ideal spots, you'd be earning maybe a million or two an hour ... and would have had to put in a significant amount of investment to get that far. And you'd need to very carefully schedule your returns to sites, be prospecting new sites for when you mined somewhere out, etc. There would be a big limit on how many you can manage at once.

That's rather more activity and thought than most ways of making money require ... even a 100t hopper per miner - which would probably mean you needed to deploy it from a pretty large ship to begin with - is going to get you perhaps 10 million per hour in ideal circumstances with a lot of set up. (And in practice you're not going to be getting ideal circumstances)

Compare to a single high-ranked surface scan mission, which pays out 3 million credits for the same basic land-interact-launch gameplay and don't usually take an hour to do three of them.

It's not going to be "passive" earnings - if you planted it and it teleported and auto-sold the cargo at the nearest refinery market, that would be passive - and it's not going to be anywhere near as high-earning as most other options. But it might be good fun.
 
I think anything adding more variants to gameplay would enhance the game model, if someone is a dedicated miner already they may welcome the addition of something like this. While they are already out there mining asteroids this could be a great way to supplement their current mining operation.
 
I think anything adding more variants to gameplay would enhance the game model, if someone is a dedicated miner already they may welcome the addition of something like this. While they are already out there mining asteroids this could be a great way to supplement their current mining operation.

Yeah, it's something of a niche activity, but I guess miners deserve some love too :D
 
I'd like to have those again!
In Frontier they gave me a sense of being able to do something on my own on all those moons, independent of bases that were put there by the game.
Of course we already have the shooting of rocks with the SRV now, and collecting data etc. But it'd give a new gameplay element in those enormous stretches of virtual surface terrain. I would like the kind of mineral to depend on the local surface colour, so I can scout for good mining places from the sky.
 
If you've bummed around planets lately, you should have noticed a few NPCs doing exactly this. A small batch of miner doohickeys, and a NPC ship parked nearby.
 
Agree surface planet mining should be a way forward i'm hoping that with a newer bigger more CARGO space SRV would be introduced with options to kit out not unlike ships with mining lasers, bins, etc. Would give mining a HUGE boost.
 
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