Random Island Generator

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

When I first heard people asking for a random island generator I was initially dismissive. I then gave it some thought and it just makes intuitive sense.

On Nublar, you have a finite play area of a particular shape. With a finite play area, there is literally only so many combinations of exhibit and path placements etc. That means, eventually you will literally run out of new ways to build a park. With a random island generator there is, by definition, unlimited ways to play the game.
I'm aware you can alter the terrain etc but the play area on Nublar will still fundamentally remain the same. Lifting the ground up and down will only go so far and after a while we will need something new.

I guess an argument can be made that since you aren't playing on the whole island, the shape and size of the island doesn't really matter. However, if you play on the same island with the same backdrop, of the same size and shape, after a while it will get repetitive. At least with a random island it really would feel like a fresh start.

That being said I'm certainly not unhappy with being able to build on Nublar; it's been a dream of mine since I was a child. My concerns are mainly regarding the longevity of the game with only one sandbox map.

What do you guys think?

Edit: what I mean by 'random' island generator isn't really random. I was referring to a system analogous to JPOGs where the player is able to control what geographic features the island posesses. (I understand a fair amount of work would go into something like this and it certainly isn't an urgently necessary feature)

 

[Grimnir]

I mean this was in Operation Genesis. For me, it is one of the best ways they can add infinite gameplay to the game. If we can decide size and the RNG kicks in, we could setup our own challenges to make a 5 star park.

It falls me in as the most obvious, and interesting, way to improve upon the game.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Also, using Planet Coaster as a comparison is not valid as the customization options in that game allow for vastly more ways to build a park. Since this is a management sim, all you are doing is placing down buildings. And since you can only place down buildings in a finite area so many times, this warrants new spaces in which to do it.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I mean this was in Operation Genesis. For me, it is one of the best ways they can add infinite gameplay to the game. If we can decide size and the RNG kicks in, we could setup our own challenges to make a 5 star park.

It falls me in as the most obvious, and interesting, way to improve upon the game.

I'm glad you agree!

It's all about longevity.

 

[Andrew2018]

Already said it isn't going to be im there since we have other islands to play with.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Already said it isn't going to be im there since we have other islands to play with.

That's kind of irrelevant though. The main point is that after a while, there are only so many combinations of ways to play the game with a finite area.

 

[Lora Craft69]

I suggest you post this also in the pinned wishlist: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/420613-Your-wishlist-for-Jurassic-World-Evolution

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I suggest you post this also in the pinned wishlist: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/420613-Your-wishlist-for-Jurassic-World-Evolution

Oh don't worry, I have.

The point of the post was to see if other people agree.

 

[gingeyphillips]

In theory it's a brilliant idea. One cool thing about JPOG was (with a bit of know-how) you could make an island into any shape you want, and more often than not it would turn out to look very nice.

However one problem I see with this game is that the islands themselves are done to a very good standard, a standard that would be hard to meet in random map generation. With the tools currently available in terms of terrain manipulation the random maps simply wouldn't be as nice as the ones Frontier made. An example of this happening in another game would be Ark, it has very nice maps made by the developers and modders but their procedural map system is quite bad due to it having to factor too much in, and as there's not really a way to change terrain in Ark you're stuck with what you have seeded in.

An alternative I thought of would be a somewhat random generation of what terrain you'll encounter on each island every time you start, e.g.: how many dense jungles or how many lakes there will be on Matanceros in the areas where there isn't already a park there for you. It's possible we could see something like this or even a map generator if they can get the way it makes the maps done right, but the way they've done the game involved a lot of modelling for the islands which is just too difficult to replicate currently in a map seeder.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

In theory it's a brilliant idea. One cool thing about JPOG was (with a bit of know-how) you could make an island into any shape you want, and more often than not it would turn out to look very nice.

However one problem I see with this game is that the islands themselves are done to a very good standard, a standard that would be hard to meet in random map generation. With the tools currently available in terms of terrain manipulation the random maps simply wouldn't be as nice as the ones Frontier made. An example of this happening in another game would be Ark, it has very nice maps made by the developers and modders but their procedural map system is quite bad due to it having to factor too much in, and as there's not really a way to change terrain in Ark you're stuck with what you have seeded in.

An alternative I thought of would be a somewhat random generation of what terrain you'll encounter on each island every time you start, e.g.: how many dense jungles or how many lakes there will be on Matanceros in the areas where there isn't already a park there for you. It's possible we could see something like this or even a map generator if they can get the way it makes the maps done right, but the way they've done the game involved a lot of modelling for the islands which is just too difficult to replicate currently in a map seeder.

Very interesting ideas.

I was thinking of a system analogous to JPOG where the player is able to somewhat design their own island by controlling the number of mountains, forests etc. For example, I see literally no issue with a totally flat map full of jungle and rivers; especially if we don't get to use the whole island.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

In theory it's a brilliant idea. One cool thing about JPOG was (with a bit of know-how) you could make an island into any shape you want, and more often than not it would turn out to look very nice.

However one problem I see with this game is that the islands themselves are done to a very good standard, a standard that would be hard to meet in random map generation. With the tools currently available in terms of terrain manipulation the random maps simply wouldn't be as nice as the ones Frontier made. An example of this happening in another game would be Ark, it has very nice maps made by the developers and modders but their procedural map system is quite bad due to it having to factor too much in, and as there's not really a way to change terrain in Ark you're stuck with what you have seeded in.

An alternative I thought of would be a somewhat random generation of what terrain you'll encounter on each island every time you start, e.g.: how many dense jungles or how many lakes there will be on Matanceros in the areas where there isn't already a park there for you. It's possible we could see something like this or even a map generator if they can get the way it makes the maps done right, but the way they've done the game involved a lot of modelling for the islands which is just too difficult to replicate currently in a map seeder.

It just occured to me that my previous comment kind of contradicts the whole 'random' aspect of an island genorater. That design element similar to JPOGs is what I meant from the start. haha

 

[DarkAnubis]

I love that idea. In addition to being able to create the shape of our islands, it would be amazing to name it, more terraforming tools, having editable settings such as: if the island will have infinite money, everything will be unblocked, what kinds of calamities will affect the island , if the island has a day and night cycle or a single schedule.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I love that idea. In addition to being able to create the shape of our islands, it would be amazing to name it, more terraforming tools, having editable settings such as: if the island will have infinite money, everything will be unblocked, what kinds of calamities will affect the island , if the island has a day and night cycle or a single schedule.

Yes! I love it.

I MUST have a day/night cycle haha

 

[Andrew2018]

In theory it's a brilliant idea. One cool thing about JPOG was (with a bit of know-how) you could make an island into any shape you want, and more often than not it would turn out to look very nice.

However one problem I see with this game is that the islands themselves are done to a very good standard, a standard that would be hard to meet in random map generation. With the tools currently available in terms of terrain manipulation the random maps simply wouldn't be as nice as the ones Frontier made. An example of this happening in another game would be Ark, it has very nice maps made by the developers and modders but their procedural map system is quite bad due to it having to factor too much in, and as there's not really a way to change terrain in Ark you're stuck with what you have seeded in.

An alternative I thought of would be a somewhat random generation of what terrain you'll encounter on each island every time you start, e.g.: how many dense jungles or how many lakes there will be on Matanceros in the areas where there isn't already a park there for you. It's possible we could see something like this or even a map generator if they can get the way it makes the maps done right, but the way they've done the game involved a lot of modelling for the islands which is just too difficult to replicate currently in a map seeder.

I never thought of that. It really would be hard to recreate the detail in a random generator.

 

[gingeyphillips]

Very interesting ideas.

I was thinking of a system analogous to JPOG where the player is able to somewhat design their own island by controlling the number of mountains, forests etc. For example, I see literally no issue with a totally flat map full of jungle and rivers; especially if we don't get to use the whole island.

Problem with JPOG's system in relation to this is that it's grid based (although significantly more impressive than most grid-based seeders) and JWE's isn't restricted by that, which is actually a bad thing for random map generation as it's harder to pinpoint what should spawn where and how far away this should spawn from that etc. if there's not a grid that's used when doing this. This by no means makes it impossible as it's still doable, it just means making it look good is harder.

From what I've read Nublar and Sorna will be the 'blank canvas' maps where you can turn it into anything you want (from the footage of Nublar at least it looks very flat with lots of space). But players could likely make their own maps were Frontier to release an Assembly Kit like Ark and Total War have done, but because they have Universal on their tail and they haven't already made one for Planet Coaster (it uses the same engine as JWE) this might not happen. Creative Assembly are working with Games Workshop on their Warhammer games and they almost weren't allowed to release mod support for it due to Games Workshop's brand being used in the game. If Games Workshop had an issue then I'm sure Universal has an even bigger issue given how big of a company it is.

It just occured to me that my previous comment kind of contradicts the whole 'random' aspect of an island genorater. That design element similar to JPOGs is what I meant from the start. haha

Oh no not necessarily, JPOG's was definitely a random island generator as is what you described, choosing what to have on the map doesn't necessarily dictate WHERE to have it thus still making it a random map.

 

[gingeyphillips]

I never thought of that. It really would be hard to recreate the detail in a random generator.

Yeah it's very difficult to get done right, especially with games done like Planet Coaster and JWE. Older games seem to be better at it, but that's because there's never as much scripting involved with them.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Problem with JPOG's system in relation to this is that it's grid based (although significantly more impressive than most grid-based seeders) and JWE's isn't restricted by that, which is actually a bad thing for random map generation as it's harder to pinpoint what should spawn where and how far away this should spawn from that etc. if there's not a grid that's used when doing this. This by no means makes it impossible as it's still doable, it just means making it look good is harder.

From what I've read Nublar and Sorna will be the 'blank canvas' maps where you can turn it into anything you want (from the footage of Nublar at least it looks very flat with lots of space). But players could likely make their own maps were Frontier to release an Assembly Kit like Ark and Total War have done, but because they have Universal on their tail and they haven't already made one for Planet Coaster (it uses the same engine as JWE) this might not happen. Creative Assembly are working with Games Workshop on their Warhammer games and they almost weren't allowed to release mod support for it due to Games Workshop's brand being used in the game. If Games Workshop had an issue then I'm sure Universal has an even bigger issue given how big of a company it is.



Oh no not necessarily, JPOG's was definitely a random island generator as is what you described, choosing what to have on the map doesn't necessarily dictate WHERE to have it thus still making it a random map.

The type of game that JWE is, namely a management sim, unfortunately doesn't allow for the type of creativity that games like Planet Coaster afford. This means that we will be very much limited in terms of how we can play the game and even where and how we can design the park. This is my main reasoning behind asking for a island generator. Fundamentally, on pre-made islands we will literally run out of the number combinations of park design.

I kind of feel like Frontier have shot themselves in the foot when it comes to reduced levels of customisation. This was my main criticism of the decision to not include a challange mode for Nublar. The game is not adequatley set up for an unlimited sandbox mode as it lacks the level of customisation necessary to make a mode such as that worthwhile. However, thats another topic altogether haha.

That being said, how something like this would be implemented is well above my head as I haven't the faintest idea about how something like this would work.

 

[gingeyphillips]

The type of game that JWE is, namely a management sim, unfortunately doesn't allow for the type of creativity that games like Planet Coaster afford. This means that we will be very much limited in terms of how we can play the game and even where and how we can design the park. This is my main reasoning behind asking for a island generator. Fundamentally, on pre-made islands we will literally run out of the number combinations of park design.

I kind of feel like Frontier have shot themselves in the foot when it comes to reduced levels of customisation. This was my main criticism of the decision to not include a challange mode for Nublar. The game is not adequatley set up for an unlimited sandbox mode as it lacks the level of customisation necessary to make a mode such as that worthwhile. However, thats another topic altogether haha.

That being said, how something like this would be implemented is well above my head as I haven't the faintest idea about how something like this would work.

I do definitely agree with you that the lack of at least variety in buildings that JWE has compared to Planet Coaster is a bummer, as you could section your roller coaster parks to fit different themes which made filling the gigantic maps up on that somewhat feasible. Something I could see down the line would be the implementation of more buildings or at least skins for buildings to mix things up a bit for the parks we have.

However I think a lot of the restrictions we have seen in terms of terrain tools and building designs (e.g.: we can't make our own buildings) would be down to controller support being offered in the game, could you imagine doing half the things in Planet Coaster with a controller?!? - NO THANKS! There's a lot of fine tuning involved with that game and I would feel for anybody using a controller to do that sort of stuff hahaha.

Overall I think there's a lot of avenues Frontier can take to make things more interesting in bigger parks, and I could see further down the line mod support being implemented that would allow users to create islands, with a lot of work lol. Before that time though I imagine we'll see DLC's that would add content to make parks more varied, like an original JP building DLC or an additional amenities patches.

 

[Andrew2018]

Yeah it's very difficult to get done right, especially with games done like Planet Coaster and JWE. Older games seem to be better at it, but that's because there's never as much scripting involved with them.

JPOG was in better terms pretty simple islands, I am not a developer, but you can tell the level of detail of the islands is no where near other games at the time.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I do definitely agree with you that the lack of at least variety in buildings that JWE has compared to Planet Coaster is a bummer, as you could section your roller coaster parks to fit different themes which made filling the gigantic maps up on that somewhat feasible. Something I could see down the line would be the implementation of more buildings or at least skins for buildings to mix things up a bit for the parks we have.

However I think a lot of the restrictions we have seen in terms of terrain tools and building designs (e.g.: we can't make our own buildings) would be down to controller support being offered in the game, could you imagine doing half the things in Planet Coaster with a controller?!? - NO THANKS! There's a lot of fine tuning involved with that game and I would feel for anybody using a controller to do that sort of stuff hahaha.

Overall I think there's a lot of avenues Frontier can take to make things more interesting in bigger parks, and I could see further down the line mod support being implemented that would allow users to create islands, with a lot of work lol. Before that time though I imagine we'll see DLC's that would add content to make parks more varied, like an original JP building DLC or an additional amenities patches.

I absolutely agree that asking for Planet Coaster level customization of buildings etc is a console-players worst nightmare. haha

Moreover, I also agree with you that there are certainly ways of increasing the level of customization that we currently have. Namely, if we're able to place down and design a fairly intricate pathing and fence system, surely we could also place down uncustomizable logs, rocks, bridges, etc.
Currently, the enclosure design options are fairly lackluster. Again though, I have faith that this will be addressed down the line.

I REALLY would love 1993 JP features.