News Chapter Four - Exploration Reveal

These peeps have done a fantastic job of producing Orerries: http://www.elitegalaxyonline.com/available-orreries/.

All the information needed for their creation is in the system data already, and the only reason EGO can't create them automatically is that there is no hierarchy info. stored in the log xml, though this is clearly available in the game itself. The utility and effectiveness of the EGO Orerry just transplanted into the game would be great; since someone else has done it, I can't see why it is so difficult or huge a task for dedicated devs to plug in at that level. It doesn't need to be some graphical whizz-bang to be of use :)

And since "Frontier" had a perfectly useful Orerry, I'm not sure what prevents us having one now....

And yet having a simple color slider for the HUD is also said to require an enormous amount of work etc., so there may be something preventing it from happening.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
And yet having a simple color slider for the HUD is also said to require an enormous amount of work etc., so there may be something preventing it from happening.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[haha]

True! I know that in business app. software, "requires a large amount of work" is often a fig-leaf for "we don't want to spend time doing that", rather than being genuinely difficult or onerous :D

Though I think fdev kind of lost that argument with the Orrery when they showed a basic Orerry working away in the Stellar Forge livestream ;) [video=youtube;Vz3nhCykZNw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vz3nhCykZNw[/video]
 
And since "Frontier" had a perfectly useful Orerry, I'm not sure what prevents us having one now....

Priorities. It’s not that Fdev can’t do the Orrery, they obviously could if they wanted to, the real reason we don’t have one is because they don’t feel it’s worth the time to implement it. It’s a lower priority than other things for them. Many of us see great benefit in having an Orrery, but Fdev just simply disagrees.

What’s ironic is that they used to agree with us. Back in the alpha the Orrery was a design goal for the game, Fdev even had a concept screen of how it would look. Then before 1.0 they announced that the Orrery would not make it for launch but would come at a later date. Sometime between then and now Fdev changed their priorities and they internally pushed the Orrery to the wayside, and it went from a feature to a “possibly someday” thing. Much like comets actually, which are to this day generated by the Stellar Forge but still lack graphical assets to represent them. Comets exist in the game as an unfinished forgotten feature.

Such a shame.
 
Priorities. It’s not that Fdev can’t do the Orrery, they obviously could if they wanted to, the real reason we don’t have one is because they don’t feel it’s worth the time to implement it. It’s a lower priority than other things for them. Many of us see great benefit in having an Orrery, but Fdev just simply disagrees.

What’s ironic is that they used to agree with us. Back in the alpha the Orrery was a design goal for the game, Fdev even had a concept screen of how it would look. Then before 1.0 they announced that the Orrery would not make it for launch but would come at a later date. Sometime between then and now Fdev changed their priorities and they internally pushed the Orrery to the wayside, and it went from a feature to a “possibly someday” thing. Much like comets actually, which are to this day generated by the Stellar Forge but still lack graphical assets to represent them. Comets exist in the game as an unfinished forgotten feature.

Such a shame.

You have the orrery- its supercruise. How do you think FD managed to get SC incorporated so quickly based on what people wanted? If SC was not a thing, I'd bet you would have an orrery right now.
 
Priorities. It’s not that Fdev can’t do the Orrery, they obviously could if they wanted to, the real reason we don’t have one is because they don’t feel it’s worth the time to implement it. It’s a lower priority than other things for them. Many of us see great benefit in having an Orrery, but Fdev just simply disagrees.

What’s ironic is that they used to agree with us. Back in the alpha the Orrery was a design goal for the game, Fdev even had a concept screen of how it would look. Then before 1.0 they announced that the Orrery would not make it for launch but would come at a later date. Sometime between then and now Fdev changed their priorities and they internally pushed the Orrery to the wayside, and it went from a feature to a “possibly someday” thing. Much like comets actually, which are to this day generated by the Stellar Forge but still lack graphical assets to represent them. Comets exist in the game as an unfinished forgotten feature.

Such a shame.

And what is even more frustrating is that now that USS's will be there at system jump in, that orrery map that shows us exactly where it is in relation to other places would make it extremely valuable to have.
And thats just the starter. I have loads of ideas that would only work with an orrery.
 
A suggestion for new exploration mechanics.

Adding a navigation beacon in all "known" systems, ie only visible if the main star has been tagged. (updated ... once a week ^^)
Imho, it might be a nice QoL tool in addition to the new system without changing any existing beacons mechanics and using existing mechanics too.

The "only" thing to code might even be the system database update procedure (triggered with mega ships movements).
 
As i currently log in and play the game and like exploring I would say I count. And personally no I don't think anyone of us should have the final say. It isn't their game or my game, it is FDevs game.

Yeah but do they actually play the game? Because if they did, maybe things would be done differently.
Asking for a friend.
 
Maybe you FDevs could also (instead?) finally implement this so long waited for feature :

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Agreed(not instead though). If they could make it look as good as that concept art it would be amazing.

I would also love to see a timescale slider in the orrery, to observe the different celestial orbits in relation to each other.
 
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This adjustment to the discovery scanner will impact on every aspect of play.

I suspect it's a "holding" strategy = keeping us occupied (grinding)

Doesn't that sort of thing save space?
 
And yet having a simple color slider for the HUD is also said to require an enormous amount of work etc., so there may be something preventing it from happening.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The colour element is used by a number of other things in the UI (eg: a mission giver's avatar); so they would need to re-write a bunch of stuff to use their own colour element, instead of a single colour source.
 
I'm well aware of that, that wasn't the point.
Then I'm not sure what your point was. :p

It's just that your post just made it sound like it was meant to be a simple task, yet was an enormous one for Frontier. So I mentioned the colour element in case you weren't aware (I obviously had no idea if you knew or not).
 
The process still starts with the “honk” (system scan), though its usage is now the start of a more engaging process (if all you did before was scan for some credits, don't worry, the scan still awards credits.)

The system scan now returns an aggregated display of how energetic the electromagnetic emissions are in the system. Signals are sorted on a low to high scale by their apparent energy. For example, emissions from rocky clusters will appear at the lower end of the scale, hot gas giants at the upper range. This information requires some interpretation as signals can overlap.

I think the removal of "honk to system scan" is detrimental because there are 400 billion star systems and a fraction of them are interesting (and you have the stats of how little of it has been scanned). Traveling long distances in the current system I can maintain maximum jumping frequency (efficiency) while still being able to stop to scan interesting systems along the way (I don't care if passive scan credits went away). New system would have me not scan a single thing because of the potential time wasted.

If all we have from system scan are emission blobs the whole minigame turns into Mass Effect 2 planet scanning "rotate one way while slowly raising elevation" until you've found everything. This I see as not interesting gameplay after the initial excitement of change. It gets old quite fast when you take into account how many star systems and planets there are in Elite.

In VR I believe forcing an external "turret" view is also detrimental, not only are you taken out of pilots seat but also unable to control your ship. Unless it's a different set of controls which complicates keybindings by having yet another set of overlapping binds.

However, I do like the idea of having actual mechanics to detailed scans, and be able to do this from much longer distances, rather than flying to and pointing the ship at a celestial object for 17 seconds.

Detailed surface scanner gains the ability to launch micro sensor probes in supercruise. You will use these probes to “map” a planet’s surface and locate resource hotspots in its rings.

I hope the probes will also allow locating planetary resource hotspots to reduce pointless wandering in the SRV.

You will be able to synthesise micro-probes for the detailed surface scanner, but the better aim you are, the less probes you will need to get complete coverage.

This has the potential to be a good tradeoff for gimbaled eyeballing or an annoying time sink to mine materials for refills on your journeys. Please balance it thoroughly.

Along with the Exploration update, we are improving the way that USSs work. USSs will now spawn throughout the entire system when you first enter it. This enables you to use the new exploration tools to find USSs throughout the system, not just in the area around you. You can still interrogate nav beacons to find the locations.

Because ADS takes one optional internal slot this change reduces the efficiency of AX fighting ships. I think discovery scanner should be made a slot like the planetary approach suite.

Whilst USSs do still have a decay time, the timers have been increased to allow you time to find and fly to the ones you are interested in. The decay time is also now displayed when targeted. Signal sources still obey rules determining where they can appear within a system, and mission critical signal sources will still be highlighted to differentiate themselves once located.

This promotes menulogging or jumping to closest system and back if USS/NHSS only spawn on entry to system, thus not really reducing tedium of HGE. I approve of the removal of "fly and wait" though.

As part of the exploration update, we are making sure that multi-crew members can use the discovery scanner and detailed surface scanner at the same time and all discoveries are shared among crew or wing.

This allows wings or commanders in multi-crew to engage in exploration together, each earning credits and exploration rank and making the process more efficient.

As much as I dislike the SRV related gameplay, I think that it's also necessary to be able to SRV while multicrewed.

Looking forward to testing the changes in the coming beta.
 
Priorities. It’s not that Fdev can’t do the Orrery, they obviously could if they wanted to, the real reason we don’t have one is because they don’t feel it’s worth the time to implement it. It’s a lower priority than other things for them. Many of us see great benefit in having an Orrery, but Fdev just simply disagrees.It
Only if it benefits combat. /s ;)

I hope Frontier (wishful thinking here) is considering orrery or maybe developing it just to surprise us at Q4. But it's probably unlikely. I'd like to see comets and more moons and small objects in space and the orrery being the tool to help you find it, or something.

What’s ironic is that they used to agree with us. Back in the alpha the Orrery was a design goal for the game, Fdev even had a concept screen of how it would look. Then before 1.0 they announced that the Orrery would not make it for launch but would come at a later date. Sometime between then and now Fdev changed their priorities and they internally pushed the Orrery to the wayside, and it went from a feature to a “possibly someday” thing. Much like comets actually, which are to this day generated by the Stellar Forge but still lack graphical assets to represent them. Comets exist in the game as an unfinished forgotten feature.

Such a shame.
Shame indeed.
 
The initial 'honk' will just reveal the entry star. As you use the to explore, more stellar bodies will be revealed as you find them, which will then populate the system map.

This is REALLY disappointing.
I want something which makes "discovering" an entire system quicker. I certainly do not want anything which restricts seeing planetary bodies or makes it longer than the initial "honk" to have the system revealed.

I want it to be easier to find POI on planet surfaces.
I want to be able to place markers on planet surfaces myself, so that I can easily find it and land nearby.

I want things EASIER. QUICKER and MORE CONVENIENT.
I expect things to develop in this manner - anything else disturbs my immersion in a future where the functionality of devices is worse and more convoluted than what we have now.
I don't even want to have to direct my scanner manually at the target body - scanners should rotate automatically!! This is the future we're talking about - can you not make this seamless?

And if this is anything like the annoying scanner on the SRV, I will be extremely < upset >. That thing is useless and annoying. Not fit for purpose, and every time I have to use it I am reminded that I'm not in a simulation of the future, but an annoying grinding game with developers who want me to waste my time looking for materials on literal barren, desolate rocks.

Just sayin', I do not hold out great hopes that you're not going to make this mind-numbingly boring and frustrating for people who just want to get in and get out of the sixth billionth solar system that's literally in the middle of nowhere that looks exactly like the majority of the rest of the entire universe.
 
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Really? So what would you call a feature that adds nothing, has no extra benefits, that is completely separate from the regular game, and only serves to increase the time it takes to yield the same result as before it was added and injects a sharp and sudden pause in the actual playing of the game?

"The actual playing of the game" meaning "getting inmmediate information and rewards". Just admit you don't like video games.

If you designed the Legend of Zelda, as soon as you walked through a dungeon entrance the boss would already be dead and you'd immediately get the dungeon treasure, a heart container, and a full map of the dungeon layout. It would then be entirely optional (and pointless) to wander around the dungeon and admire the traps, puzzles, and enemy placement, because all of that is a "Time Wall".
 
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