Locking yourself into a build like that sounds like a terrible idea.
Couple of points and a question. I see two kinds of PVP. One is like the knights of old jousting, with chivalry and a code you follow, I think that's what Bob Lighthouse is into. The other is killing the $%$%# gankers where there are no rules. That's the kind of build I want to have for now. These are the players who ambush normal non-PVP players at places like Dav's Hope and CG's, and they are the ones who say non-PVP players have no place on the open server. One player in my faction was rotating servers at Dav's Hope the other day and had his parked ship attacked when cycling thru open. That's why I advise everyone to dismiss their ship after deploying the SRV and to carry a spare SRV. Or just skip the open server entirely when at those kind of places. I would like nothing more than to setup ambushes for those kind of players.
For the question, I just spend a couple of hours last night at Guardian sites gathering mats and blueprints. Took me 2 g hours to find enough "Pattern Delta" data stuff. I bought the shield boosters thinking they were like the ones we put in utility slots but of course they're not. My bad for not doing more research. I have 1 module blueprint and 1 weapon blueprint (accidentally acquired) remaining plus most the mats I need for another module. I could get the Powerplant, Power Dist, module ref, or hull ref without going back out 800LY's.
So the question is how useful is any of this stuff for PVP builds? Or even PVE I guess since I have all but the human made stuff I can get inside the bubble. And what's the deal on engineering these? I've read conflicting info about the PP, they were supposed to have turned that off and nerfed the ones that got engineered by mistake. I've watched videos on the Guardian Weapons, and I seriously doubt anyone is using those for PVP, or even PVE although some of them look like they could be fun if you don't mind frying some bacon on your ship's components while you fire them.
Once again thanks for all the info.
For the question, I just spend a couple of hours last night at Guardian sites gathering mats and blueprints. Took me 2 g hours to find enough "Pattern Delta" data stuff. I bought the shield boosters thinking they were like the ones we put in utility slots but of course they're not. My bad for not doing more research. I have 1 module blueprint and 1 weapon blueprint (accidentally acquired) remaining plus most the mats I need for another module. I could get the Powerplant, Power Dist, module ref, or hull ref without going back out 800LY's.
So the question is how useful is any of this stuff for PVP builds? Or even PVE I guess since I have all but the human made stuff I can get inside the bubble. And what's the deal on engineering these? I've read conflicting info about the PP, they were supposed to have turned that off and nerfed the ones that got engineered by mistake. I've watched videos on the Guardian Weapons, and I seriously doubt anyone is using those for PVP, or even PVE although some of them look like they could be fun if you don't mind frying some bacon on your ship's components while you fire them.
Once again thanks for all the info.
Bob Lighthouse
Banned
Ftr, I do everything I can to learn from "the gankers" and try to emulate or even outright copy their builds.
That is to say, I am doing my best to give you gank-worthy builds, because that is the best defense from other PVPers.
So you are sort of making a false distinction.
A harder, faster/more maneuverable ship with more damage output potential is simply better for combat.
The Guardian FSD booster is very handy but it's not a combat module per se.
It does help to move low jump range ships around.
The Guardian MRP has marginally better damage absorption than a standard one, but it has power draw.
I've unlocked those and all 3 SLFs.
I'm not aware of anyone using the others modules or weapons in PVP off hand.
The consensus seems to be they are worse against human targets overall.
I use the Guardian MRPs in the combat ships that can spare the power, but it's seriously the last consideration.
The SLFs are pretty cool but I prefer the Imperial plasma fighter overall.
OK, once again I was confused, pretty much a normal state for me :S The Shock Cannons are Human, not Guardian. I can unlock Shard Guardian Cannons easily now but from what I understand they're just frag cannons, perhaps a little better and are basically used for Thargoid ships. The Shock Cannons do awesome damage to hulls and are decent against shields but have very limited ammo so pretty much a one or two engagement weapon. Probably good for "Kill the Pirate" missions. I might grind out some raw mats later today and get some of those.
I got the Guardian FSD booster first thing when I returned to the game in July since I was planning to do some deep space exploring. That was the only thing I didn't do when I played the game last year. Got my name on 11 Earth Like Worlds. As for the rest of the Guardian tech, unless I decide to fight Thargoids I don't see a whole lot of use for it. The Shield Booster thingie I have unlocked really only helps with Bi-Weaves, not enough boost to matter with other shield types. Since they fit in military slots they're worth having if you don't need hull/module/SCB's in there.
I agree 100% about learning from the "gankers" builds. Two members of my player faction are sacrificing themselves at the CG's against expert PVP players in order to gain experience. I think they're premature, one is even using a Python with gimballed weapons. I'm going to wait until I've got a really good PVP build that tests well for me in PVE then I'll give it a try. Also I'm tied up now managing the group's first expansion. We need to expand 2 more times in order to get to a system that's Industrial (good outfitting) with a large station only 5LS from the Sun. I'm running lots of Inf+++++ missions and trying to manipulate AI factions in the systems we'll be expanding to in order to pave the way.
I got the Guardian FSD booster first thing when I returned to the game in July since I was planning to do some deep space exploring. That was the only thing I didn't do when I played the game last year. Got my name on 11 Earth Like Worlds. As for the rest of the Guardian tech, unless I decide to fight Thargoids I don't see a whole lot of use for it. The Shield Booster thingie I have unlocked really only helps with Bi-Weaves, not enough boost to matter with other shield types. Since they fit in military slots they're worth having if you don't need hull/module/SCB's in there.
I agree 100% about learning from the "gankers" builds. Two members of my player faction are sacrificing themselves at the CG's against expert PVP players in order to gain experience. I think they're premature, one is even using a Python with gimballed weapons. I'm going to wait until I've got a really good PVP build that tests well for me in PVE then I'll give it a try. Also I'm tied up now managing the group's first expansion. We need to expand 2 more times in order to get to a system that's Industrial (good outfitting) with a large station only 5LS from the Sun. I'm running lots of Inf+++++ missions and trying to manipulate AI factions in the systems we'll be expanding to in order to pave the way.
Bob Lighthouse
Banned
I don't own any but shock cannons seem to be veryy useful, but it's also kind of a novelty weapon.
If you learn the fundamentals of using PAs and rails, you will probably be better off in the long run.
Nice.
I don't use the shield boosters myself, they seem to be sort of underwhelming to me.
Seems like SCBs and HRPs are generally more useful, but I have not crunched the numbers to be honest.
I would suggest small ship PVP at first.
Build a Vulture or Courier, and just fight each other and other Cmdrs.
If you are set on the mediums, just build solid and keep the firegroups simple.
The good players(read: gankers) aren't relying on special magic tricks to win.
Some of their builds are quite underwhelming defense wise.
They are just in many cases, much, much better pilots.
Build smart and learn to fly is my suggestion, don't chase magic tricks and exploits.
Good advice. I have both Vulture and Courier. Tried the Vulture with various weps but can't get a combo with high enough DPS to kill an NPC Anaconda before it's shields regen. The PA's came the closet, I could hit much better with those weps when in the Vulture. I even tried Double Shot Incendiary Frag Cannons.
I may buy another Courier, I've seen some videos with interesting combat builds. My current one is my "Fast Taxi" service when I need to recon or just get somewhere and don't need cargo/weapons with me. It can boost to 870 and jumps 48LY. (Guardian FSD Booster) Heat Sink only and all "D" rated gear except thrusters and FSD, everything engineered for light weight. Both ships would be good for practicing FA off quick turns and such stuff.
TheMegaTurnip
Banned
DO NOT BEAM LASER IN PVP!
To high draw, shedloads of falloff, too much heat.
The tradeoffs are simply not worth the horrendous effort to maintain Tot.
Huge multi or C4 PA always for the win!
To high draw, shedloads of falloff, too much heat.
The tradeoffs are simply not worth the horrendous effort to maintain Tot.
Huge multi or C4 PA always for the win!
hey grim fwiw i cannot repo this
i also think damage buffing ammo should be removed; like potting in mmorpg's, it also affects PvE content having to assume players always use it
Huh, I'll try it out again. It used to work, but may have been broken with the Engineers revamp.
Nothing in Elite's PvE is designed with it in mind, fwiw, but I'm with you on ditching it anyway. Wish they'd move Engineers to starbases, too. Not keen on new expansions adding power that freezes out players of older expansions, especially when those players can still encounter the super-buffed ships.
Just tried this and can re-iterate what torbach has said, it does not (No Longer) work. As soon as you refuel the premium ammo is washed away!
Not to be a downer but that is just a UI bug if you turn the module on and off again from the system panel you can see that the icon is just bugged out and still displayed you are not getting any damage increase even if you never refuel at the station and only scoop or if you store them there is no premium applied to the ammo once fuel is gained the buff is taken off.
a re-log also brings back the module info icon 'bug'; just noticed
i did not confirm the +%damage loss on an opponent however
curious : does +30% premium stack with Short range +additive or %multiplicative?
it would seem if you want Grade 5 Short range 2B rails, I guess you might use premium if it is +89% damage.. (unless it is only 56%)
also FYI plasma slug 1t of fuel ~ 195 rail bullets, (either size 1 or 2, does not matter)
Interestingly my testing gave about 52 shots per ton (I think). This was with lightweight mod - don't know if different blueprints could affect it.