[LORE OOC] Schematics

Heya Michael (et al).

Is there any chance that we could get some schematics of ships and parts of the stations? Of course we can make it up, but we also know that the models are there and it'd be nice to 'keep it real'

Many thanks, Eid
 
Could be a role playing thread specific to each ship type; eg. Tales from a Cobra, handling characteristics of my Cobra etc, under one thread? Might be an interesting way to collate tall tales for transfer into a wiki later??
 
Could be a role playing thread specific to each ship type; eg. Tales from a Cobra, handling characteristics of my Cobra etc, under one thread? Might be an interesting way to collate tall tales for transfer into a wiki later??

This could reflect irl stuff like 'The Mini owners club' 'Mustang owners club' etc.
 
Anything that is available is posted in newsletters. We won't be putting specifics of interiors until we start focusing on them after the game's initial release.

Michael

Damn! I was looking for a Haynes manual for the Anaconda, my warp drive generator is leaking anti-matter and I have bodged a repair with a can of radweld and a couple of jubilee clips! :D
 
Anything that is available is posted in newsletters. We won't be putting specifics of interiors until we start focusing on them after the game's initial release.

Michael

Michael, for the sake of role play, do our hyperdrives use antimatter or exotic matter?

And are our engines Quantum vacuum plasma thrusters or are they traditional engines? No specifics have been given.
 
Heya Michael (et al).

Is there any chance that we could get some schematics of ships and parts of the stations? Of course we can make it up, but we also know that the models are there and it'd be nice to 'keep it real'

Many thanks, Eid

Yeah, I think that I need a schematic as I was wandering round an Ocellus Spaceport when I realised that I was lost so have begun to walk in a straight line but never seem to be able to reach the end of this corridor and am sure that I past that same bar a few hours ago :)
 
Damn! I was looking for a Haynes manual for the Anaconda, my warp drive generator is leaking anti-matter and I have bodged a repair with a can of radweld and a couple of jubilee clips! :D

Do yourself a favor and get hold of a Chilton's, too. It's always nice to have a copy of each on-hand, since they sometimes have different ways of looking at the same problem.
 
I think for ships interior layouts, us roleplayer could start to make our own (and maybe vote for the best ones per ship) maybe FDev might even appreciate us helping with those.
 
Michael, for the sake of role play, do our hyperdrives use antimatter or exotic matter?

And are our engines Quantum vacuum plasma thrusters or are they traditional engines? No specifics have been given.

All three frame-space drives (Newtonian free-space, frameshift-space, and Witchspace) all draw from the same 'fuel source,' and since you can scoop fuel from stars and gas giants (or should I say 'will be able to') and the units of fuel in previous Elite games were measured in metric tonnes, I'd say that the reactor uses hydrogen fusion, and that there might be some non-consumable exotic matter that is incorporated into the jump drive that is used to keep the Witchspace wormhole from collapsing during transit. Couldn't find that much exotic matter on a regular basis to support such a large space economy, and you don't generally find antimatter measured in tonnes when harvesting from celestial magnetic fields.

The Newtonian drives themselves are a good question, since 'reaction mass' never seems to be an issue, but since the primary drives seem to leave a visual 'vapor trail' of some form (particularly visible when boosting), I'd say that some form of electric drive is being used, and that 'reaction mass' is either drawn from the same fuel source as the reactor fuel, or...we're just hand-waving that part of the question away. Interstellar space dust concentrations aren't high enough to account for the visual aspect, and quantum vacuum plasma should be invisible (though maybe has a 'wake' through dark matter?). In fact, it is possible that they are fusion engines, and that the reason your drives always *seem* to be venting plasma even when you are 'cruising' (not actively accelerating) could be the drive keeping plasma 'bottled-up' and ready for venting as soon as you need it. The blue color suggests extremely high temperatures--higher than anything we can produce today--which would mean greater fuel efficiency if coupled with very high magnetic field strength.
 
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The blueprints for sidewinder, condor, imperial fighter and the farragut class BCs are super cool. I hope we'll see such material for all the ships in the game, with the info on engines, shields and hard points de-classified.
 
Damn! I was looking for a Haynes manual for the Anaconda, my warp drive generator is leaking anti-matter and I have bodged a repair with a can of radweld and a couple of jubilee clips! :D

I do believe you are missing the Gaffa Tape my friend, nothing is fixed until there's a roll of gaffa tape applied.
 
All three frame-space drives (Newtonian free-space, frameshift-space, and Witchspace) all draw from the same 'fuel source,' and since you can scoop fuel from stars and gas giants (or should I say 'will be able to') and the units of fuel in previous Elite games were measured in metric tonnes, I'd say that the reactor uses hydrogen fusion, and that there might be some non-consumable exotic matter that is incorporated into the jump drive that is used to keep the Witchspace wormhole from collapsing during transit. Couldn't find that much exotic matter on a regular basis to support such a large space economy, and you don't generally find antimatter measured in tonnes when harvesting from celestial magnetic fields.

The Newtonian drives themselves are a good question, since 'reaction mass' never seems to be an issue, but since the primary drives seem to leave a visual 'vapor trail' of some form (particularly visible when boosting), I'd say that some form of electric drive is being used, and that 'reaction mass' is either drawn from the same fuel source as the reactor fuel, or...we're just hand-waving that part of the question away. Interstellar space dust concentrations aren't high enough to account for the visual aspect, and quantum vacuum plasma should be invisible (though maybe has a 'wake' through dark matter?). In fact, it is possible that they are fusion engines, and that the reason your drives always *seem* to be venting plasma even when you are 'cruising' (not actively accelerating) could be the drive keeping plasma 'bottled-up' and ready for venting as soon as you need it. The blue color suggests extremely high temperatures--higher than anything we can produce today--which would mean greater fuel efficiency if coupled with very high magnetic field strength.

After learning a bunch of physics (thank you Kerbal Space Program) including the Tsiolkovsky equation, it's a valid question, and I think one that is overlooked. If FD doesn't have a good explanation (and I think they have their hands rightly full making the game/sim), I think some hard-science fans will probably come up with a plausible sounding explanation that doesn't depend on too much hand-wavium.
 
WTS: 5t of HandWavium at Chango Dock. Please form a queue.
To the OP, I think eventually they'll fill in all this sort of content. I went trough the beta/early days of Eve and I can assure you, the lore was pretty weak, back then.
 
Damn! I was looking for a Haynes manual for the Anaconda, my warp drive generator is leaking anti-matter and I have bodged a repair with a can of radweld and a couple of jubilee clips! :D

If you leak anti-matter... leave your ship immediately so you can get far enough to survive the explosion :p :)


All three frame-space drives (Newtonian free-space, frameshift-space, and Witchspace) all draw from the same 'fuel source,' and since you can scoop fuel from stars and gas giants (or should I say 'will be able to') and the units of fuel in previous Elite games were measured in metric tonnes, I'd say that the reactor uses hydrogen fusion, and that there might be some non-consumable exotic matter that is incorporated into the jump drive that is used to keep the Witchspace wormhole from collapsing during transit. Couldn't find that much exotic matter on a regular basis to support such a large space economy, and you don't generally find antimatter measured in tonnes when harvesting from celestial magnetic fields.

The Newtonian drives themselves are a good question, since 'reaction mass' never seems to be an issue, but since the primary drives seem to leave a visual 'vapor trail' of some form (particularly visible when boosting), I'd say that some form of electric drive is being used, and that 'reaction mass' is either drawn from the same fuel source as the reactor fuel, or...we're just hand-waving that part of the question away. Interstellar space dust concentrations aren't high enough to account for the visual aspect, and quantum vacuum plasma should be invisible (though maybe has a 'wake' through dark matter?). In fact, it is possible that they are fusion engines, and that the reason your drives always *seem* to be venting plasma even when you are 'cruising' (not actively accelerating) could be the drive keeping plasma 'bottled-up' and ready for venting as soon as you need it. The blue color suggests extremely high temperatures--higher than anything we can produce today--which would mean greater fuel efficiency if coupled with very high magnetic field strength.


I think you might be wrong on the antimatter point
One can generate anti-matter using metric ton fuel, today we need those Hadron Colliders (I am not english, so sorry if got the name for it wrong) to create anti-matter (or other exotic particles), a thousand years later we might need way smaller equipement to do the same on a larger scale.
This meaning that these exotic particles do not need to be non-consumable since you can generate it using normal, scoopable fuel, and it might account for the maximum range of jump drives, dependant on the amount of exotic particles your jump drive is capable of storing.
 
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Does the sidewinder have a 'downstairs' ? I guess so, as it seems to have a rear door, as to most if not all of the ships (even the Eagle).
I wonder, what is the accommodation area like ? Bunk + a small living space/lounge I'm guessing...
 
I think you might be wrong on the antimatter point
One can generate anti-matter using metric ton fuel, today we need those Hadron Colliders (I am not english, so sorry if got the name for it wrong) to create anti-matter (or other exotic particles), a thousand years later we might need way smaller equipement to do the same on a larger scale.
This meaning that these exotic particles do not need to be non-consumable since you can generate it using normal, scoopable fuel, and it might account for the maximum range of jump drives, dependant on the amount of exotic particles your jump drive is capable of storing.

Well, as far as I know, we actually don't generate anywhere close to metric-tons of antimatter, currently. We certainly do generate antimatter today, and use it even beyond physics labs--anti-electrons are used in P.E.T. scanners, for example, which hospitals use to see electrical activity in the brain in near-real-time. But it's not only super hard to capture and store, it's super hard to make in the first place. Every particle accellerator in the world, working together, couldn't generate a fraction of a metric ton. The last numbers I heard, through various talks by Dr. Michio Kaku, is that a few *kilograms* of, what I assume to be antiprotons, would bankrupt the world economy. Those numbers might be wrong, but they're the best I have access to right now. Regardless, even if we assume that the process can be miniaturized and made much more reliable, it still doesn't make any sense for a starship to generate antimatter within itself, and then use it as a fuel source, for two reasons. First is that every method of generating antimatter that is even in the hypothetical stage, at this time, requires massive amounts of energy to accomplish. And since you're USING that antimatter to *produce* energy, you'll never get enough energy OUT of the antimatter to make up for the energy it took you to MAKE it in the first place. So says the first law of thermodynamics. At best, antimatter is a tremendous energy *storage* medium, just as gasoline is an excellent storage medium, but if you're generating it onboard your ship, all you're really doing is *wasting* energy, not producing it, no matter how efficient your system is.

Much like your car--I used to work in auto parts, and I could never get my conspiracy-theorist customers to understand the physics-flaw with their home-made "hydrogen-injection system;" the idea was that, with a liter of water or so, and electrodes hooked up to the alternator, you could split the water into hydrogen and oxygen and let it get picked up by the air intake, where it would burn along with the standard fuel/air inside the engine and give you an extra little kick, 'free power,' increasing fuel mileage and such. What they never understood was that it the electricity required to make the split comes from the car's alternator, which, in order to generate that electricity, puts a strain on the engine, and the *tiny* amount of hydrogen produced couldn't offset the amount of strain the alternator put on the engine in the first place. And all that assumed they even got the thing to work, which I know for fact most didn't, even to the point of seeing any change in mileage one way or another.

And then there's problem 2: by itself, antimatter is useless, just as hydrogen is pretty useless without, say, oxygen. Antimatter can only give you usable energy if it interacts with matter, so for every antiproton you have, you STILL need a proton to combine it with in a 1:1 ratio. Protons are easy--stars cast off protons and helium nuclei by the metric ton *per second* throughout their entire lives. Hence the fuel scoop. What they *don't* produce is a lot of antimatter--proton-on-proton fusion leaves one proton intact, the other proton being converted into a neutron, an anti-electron, and a single photon that streaks off as a gamma ray, if memory serves. But as soon as that positron (anti-electron) hits an electron, floating around in the soup that is the star's core, they both boom as energy and two gamma rays, well before it ever makes it to the surface of the star. I don't know how rare antiprotons are in nature, but it would still have the same problem.

Now, if we want to make a case for using matter/antimatter reactions to generate lots of energy very quickly, as in opening a witchspace wormhole, then sure, I can get on board with that. It makes sense, actually--when you "charge" your drive, you're actively converting hydrogen into antiprotons, which you mix with protons all at once to get a massive burst of energy that you couldn't possibly *store,* and would probably blow you up if you didn't channel it directly into opening a witchspace wormhole. That...doesn't explain why the drive charges more slowly when another ship is near, of course, or a number of other issues due to artistic license, but what I DO know is that I just got done flying forty or fifty lightyears and the only energy I took in was from star skimming. No matter how you slice it, your main fuel consumable fuel must be hydrogen, because that's the most abundant material you'll find in a star's corona, where your fuel scooping is conducted.
 
Perhaps each ship has a fusion reactor, creating enough power to keep some as-yet-undiscovered reactionless drive working, as well as the alcubierre SC drive and wormhole hyperdrive. The vapor trails could be leftovers from the fusion...not really used as reaction mass but merely vented out the back. The Tsiolkovsky equation pretty much rules out any form of chemical propulsion, as well as any type of reaction-mass drive we've got today.
 
The ship designs have vectored thrust as well as retro thrust redirection ports. So I doubt it's reactionless. I also assume the maneuvering thrusters are simply miniature versions of the main drive, and those clearly eject something as well.

Given that hydrogen is the main fuel source here, it's probably some form of condensed hydrogen structure, possibly the metallic variant that is as yet unconfirmed. It also seems likely that fusion is indeed the way that power is generated. I assume some of the heat is harnessed as electrical energy, and the resulting helium is ejected as reaction mass through the thruster nozzles. We also know each ship carries many tonnes of fuel. I haven't done the math but I assume such a process would have really good specific impulse, much better than anything we have today.

Powering the warp drive obviously requires a lot of energy. And this setup could explain the engine glow shining very brightly when engaging that. As essentially you are looking directly into the fusion core through the thruster nozzles, and the fuel use and power output is ramped up dramatically to meet the new power requirement. Why this doesn't cause increased thrust is a mystery, perhaps this fuel is vented through the main thrusters and retro thrusters equally to keep the ship stable.

I also assume this process exceeds the thermal capacity of the ship, and that it's the same process used for boosting. Which is why this level of power output isn't used in regular flight. What keeps the ship cool when actually in supercruise I don't know. Perhaps the other systems going to a lower power "cruise" state does it?

And we know they have some form of space compression used for the cargo space. So probably there is a lot more fuel in a ship than meets the eye.
 
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