LOL! PWA = Pulse Wave Analyser! ie: The key new tool giving a heat map of the asteroid field. I'll amend the OP
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Mining - Am I alone feeling it's unbalanced/not quite working?
- Thread starter NeilF
- Start date
LOL! PWA = Pulse Wave Analyser! ie: The key new tool giving a heat map of the asteroid field. I'll amend the OP
Because I don't have a reason to strike a personal issue with someone who's simply showing gratitude, unless of course you're pleading to the idea someone has to explicitly say that in order for it to be true? That's a pointless fallacy my friend. There is a conflict within the idea of having choices when there is only one good choice. That is a simple matter of fact and the entire reason why balance is important in any game. I don't need to quote someone to make that point.
Generally, a good game provides you an opportunity to be more successful through reward by rising to a greater challenge, but doesn't increase the reward 10x for an activity that's 1.2x more challenging. Elite has more adventurous tasks available that are 10x more difficult but only 0.1x more rewarding. The balance is completely out of whack and I'm seeing a lot of greed and laziness weigh into defending it.
Don't worry. The high payouts for metals and minerals will most likely be reduced in a few weeks.
I think the core problem of this thread is the assumption that mining is just mining. There can and shall be only one way of mining.
In contrast, i see two very different ways to go for mining now. The one is what's been described as "motherlode -> motherlode -> motherlode" here more than once. That's a gold diggers way of doing mining now. You head out for the big reward. Just like in old times, where gold diggers disregarded rather big deposits of copper and iron and just were out for gold, the new soldier of furtune disregards stuff like Bertrandine or Painite and only goes for core materials.
But not everybody is a soldier of fortune. The constant worker rather brings his mining lasers, abrasion baster and displacement missile. He doesn't rely on luck as much as the first kind of mining and still makes his profit. And mind you, this way of mining also makes good profit. A good deal more than before the patch.
Of course, currently the traditional way of mining, now supported by abrasion blaster and displacement missile, makes a good deal less money than the new methods. But prices are already falling. The same station, where i sold void opals for over 1.6 millions each before Xmas by now "only" pays 750k per ton. Just before Xmas somebody from FD stated that they consider current prices an odditiy, due to the reset of the BGS and things not having themselves sorted out yet. And alas, the very same thing has happened: prices are falling. And that already happened between Xmas and new year. So unless developers were sneaking into their office on the Xmas celebration days, it must've been automatic mechanics doing that.
So yes. I also think that currently the payments of core materials are very high, compared to traditional mining. But i think that prices will normalize even more. There'll still be the occasional gold rush here and there, depending on how the BGS swings. But in my eyes that's part of the fun. So currently i wouldn't want big changes right now. If core mining is still vastly superior in several weeks, it's a whole different story.
On the whole rest of the thread: yes, i also agree that the PWA is a bit of a strange beast. The whole "lights up depending on new mining features" feels very strange to me. It's a very open and raw game-mechanic tool which makes absolutely no sense from an in-game perspective. But the proposed change from the OP is the other extreme: it would be an absolutely logical tool from in-game sense. But from the view of game design, it would just collide with the prospector limpet, while taking away a tool which supports the new way of mining.
I have no elegant solution for that at hand. So i guess for the time being, the "crude but functional" is better than "elegant but collides with game design".
In contrast, i see two very different ways to go for mining now. The one is what's been described as "motherlode -> motherlode -> motherlode" here more than once. That's a gold diggers way of doing mining now. You head out for the big reward. Just like in old times, where gold diggers disregarded rather big deposits of copper and iron and just were out for gold, the new soldier of furtune disregards stuff like Bertrandine or Painite and only goes for core materials.
But not everybody is a soldier of fortune. The constant worker rather brings his mining lasers, abrasion baster and displacement missile. He doesn't rely on luck as much as the first kind of mining and still makes his profit. And mind you, this way of mining also makes good profit. A good deal more than before the patch.
Of course, currently the traditional way of mining, now supported by abrasion blaster and displacement missile, makes a good deal less money than the new methods. But prices are already falling. The same station, where i sold void opals for over 1.6 millions each before Xmas by now "only" pays 750k per ton. Just before Xmas somebody from FD stated that they consider current prices an odditiy, due to the reset of the BGS and things not having themselves sorted out yet. And alas, the very same thing has happened: prices are falling. And that already happened between Xmas and new year. So unless developers were sneaking into their office on the Xmas celebration days, it must've been automatic mechanics doing that.
So yes. I also think that currently the payments of core materials are very high, compared to traditional mining. But i think that prices will normalize even more. There'll still be the occasional gold rush here and there, depending on how the BGS swings. But in my eyes that's part of the fun. So currently i wouldn't want big changes right now. If core mining is still vastly superior in several weeks, it's a whole different story.
On the whole rest of the thread: yes, i also agree that the PWA is a bit of a strange beast. The whole "lights up depending on new mining features" feels very strange to me. It's a very open and raw game-mechanic tool which makes absolutely no sense from an in-game perspective. But the proposed change from the OP is the other extreme: it would be an absolutely logical tool from in-game sense. But from the view of game design, it would just collide with the prospector limpet, while taking away a tool which supports the new way of mining.
I have no elegant solution for that at hand. So i guess for the time being, the "crude but functional" is better than "elegant but collides with game design".
And the new mining is really fun, especially blowing up rocks!Rule of thumb: As long as you have fun you are on the right track.
That's what happened with the old mining. I believe it was decent payout, then nerfed, and most players abandoned it. The only times I played it was for the zen-like experience of just doing mindless things and making a few bucks. It was easy to do, but not much paid.
Now, it's fun, even when you don't find opals. I just blew up a couple of Bromelite core rocks. Made 160k only ... yay... paid for the limpets at least.
And it was fun to blast them.I agree with that, unfortunately it doesn't. ED is and always worked the other way around which is plain gaga in my book. It's actually working on a 'more grind => higher reward' basis. [wacko] But since credits are very soon very pointless (another aspect I wholeheartedly dislike) there's not much to worry there, other than about some really daft game design. Rule of thumb: As long as you have fun you are on the right track.
There's actually a logic behind the games rewards if you look at it like this: less fun -> more reward.
It might sound crazy, but it actually works.
And the new mining is really fun, especially blowing up rocks!
Dito. For some reason, my ship is called "Coconut Cracker". (Too long of a backstory to explain. ) And whenever i crack a rock, I currently yell "Coconut" just before it blows up. I have insane fun, but i miiiight have to cut down a bit on this. I fear my wife might start hurting herself from rolling her eyes too hard.
Jenner
I wish I was English like my hero Tj.
I do really enjoy deep core mining. It is one of the most fun new additions to the game. I hope FD keep it rewarding and common enough so that players can find crackable rocks with a reasonable frequency. I suppose if anything I'd want them to maybe reduce payouts slightly for deep core mining and buff the other new mining activity.
Why? Why not buff the other new mining but leave core cracking alone?
Why is it that people feel like in order to make one thing better, another thing has to be made worse?
Perhaps add more deep core rocks in replacement for lower top-pay. The deep core mining in itself, for whatever material is so much fun. I just can't make myself stop.
Right now, I'm working on getting the right balance of charges to optimize the output. It's a bit of a challenge still.
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Jenner
I wish I was English like my hero Tj.
Perhaps add more deep core rocks in replacement for lower top-pay. The deep core mining in itself, for whatever material is so much fun. I just can't make myself stop.
Right now, I'm working on getting the right balance of charges to optimize the output. It's a bit of a challenge still.
The only reason I say it might need a slight nerf is that in comparison to other ways of making money it's waaay out there currently. So yes - one solution is to bring everything else up to the same level, yes.
Really I'd just like to see more parity across the board and have less of these gold rushes (so to speak).
Perhaps add more deep core rocks in replacement for lower top-pay. The deep core mining in itself, for whatever material is so much fun. I just can't make myself stop.
Nah. I actually appreciate the "long search, big payout" of the current implementation. It means that even a smaller ship can be successful. I currently actually prefer to use a Cobra MK IV. Not only is it the first time since a long time that i find use for this ship, such a small ship can also fit better between the pieces of rock floating around. It just "feels" better.
Changing the system to give a higher volume of materials at a lower sales price pushes things in favour of bigger ships again. There's enough content in the game which screams "use a big ship" all of the time. I find it very valuable that we finally have content which really encourages smaller ships again.
The only reason I say it might need a slight nerf is that in comparison to other ways of making money it's waaay out there currently. So yes - one solution is to bring everything else up to the same level, yes.
Really I'd just like to see more parity across the board and have less of these gold rushes (so to speak).
See, this is what I don't understand.
A. Why fewer gold rushes? I personally would love a "creative" mode type where I could just fly around with whatever ship I wanted exploring, fighting, or whatever. But at least free flowing credits is one less barrier between me and my goals.
B. If parity is the goal, why not achieve it by raising the lower payout activities to be equivalent with the highest payout ones? Then people would just do what they found most fun, instead of feeling pressure to do what is most profitable.
LOL! PWA = Pulse Wave Analyser! ie: The key new tool giving a heat map of the asteroid field. I'll amend the OP
Thank you sir, very much appreciated!
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
I think the problem is some people want to play a game with a some what robust economy and a plausible BGS and others just want a full blown sandbox where you do what ever you want and have access to all the toys in the game .
I am very much on the robust economy and plausible BGS and you seem to be on the sandbox side of the fence.
I think FD balancing for both of us is impossible and this is my biggest beef with FD tbh. They have not really been clear or honest with the kind of game they are making imo . I would never have helped kickstart the game you want and I am guessing you would never have bought the game I want . Most games are clear about the design goal and so the player base are much easier to please (I don't own Minecraft or any pure sandbox games).
If 2 players who like racing games 1 is expecting burnout3 and the other is expecting iracing then 1 - or both - is going to end up disappointed and I think this is happening here
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FDEV needs to leave it "AS IS". No NERFS, no "BALANCING". The basic jist of this is, people are making money, and the ones too lazy to learn it or do it are crying about it. Does not matter to me if a commander makes hundreds of millions hunting deep cores. Why should anyone else care? It is already "balanced" i.e. They can do it, I can do it, anyone can do it. That is all the balance we need. Quit worrying about what others are doing, and just play the game, or quit playing it.
*III*
FDEV needs to leave it "AS IS". No NERFS, no "BALANCING". The basic jist of this is, people are making money, and the ones too lazy to learn it or do it are crying about it. Does not matter to me if a commander makes hundreds of millions hunting deep cores. Why should anyone else care? It is already "balanced" i.e. They can do it, I can do it, anyone can do it. That is all the balance we need. Quit worrying about what others are doing, and just play the game, or quit playing it.
*III*
I agree.
If you are new to the game (or just old like me) all these terms must be a nightmare. Confusion is more than understandable, as we also have a wave scanner (for the SRV, erm sorry the Surface Recon Vehicle, also called ‘Scarab’) which has nothing to do with the Pulse Wave Analyzer.
Oh, I can only imagine how many times a player has gone to a hotspot and said, "Oh! I need one of those?"... Gone and got one, returned, only then to say, "Oh! I need one of those too?"