If I wanted a 'radio-tuning' game I would have rather bought an old radio.

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The thing is, unlike Engineers, we had 4 years of one system that never got changed, not even tweaks, and then they threw the whole thing in the trash and introduced a completely different paradigm.

Focused completely on the people that didn't go exploring in the past. The more you use the fss after (trying to) accepting it even it reeks of matching nothing but complaints with the old system more than anything else.

Also, this is possibly subjective, but one could think that the pillar of spaceflight deserves more respect specifically in out of bubble exploration than it is now. Turning the full intention off rather than just extending it is inelegant.

By game logic.. if you've simply honked to reveal the blobs have you not discovered them in theory even before using the fss? The could have pretended that the light based god scopes dropped a magic orbital seed to claim your discovery instead of the taking it out on the ads.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

Focused completely on the people that didn't go exploring in the past. The more you use the fss after (trying to) accepting it even it reeks of matching nothing but complaints with the old system more than anything else.

Also, this is possibly subjective, but one could think that the pillar of spaceflight deserves more respect specifically in out of bubble exploration than it is now. Turning the full intention off rather than just extending it is inelegant.

Possibly more subjective than the first line? Pardon me completely here, but either I am absolutely exhausted, or what you are trying to say is completely unclear to me.

What I think I'm reading is that the prior four years were focused on non-explorers. I'd say true, at least up to the point where the Generation ships and alien (both Guardian and Thargoid) planetary features were added, though this wasn't really much more than simply something to actually find. But the next part of this first line, I just cannot make sense of what you're trying to communicate.

I'm guessing at the second line, inferring from what I'm not grasping from the previous, that you are of the opinion that the new system is somehow disrespectful of exploration outside the bubble? Maybe? Just looking for some clarity here.

If I'm close though, I'm going to disagree. I tried the old way, I couldn't, simply couldn't do it. I'm trying the new way and I can't seem to stop doing it. What does this mean?

 

[sollisb]

Was out messing on one of my other accounts last night, guardian BPs, materials, data, and ever elusive USSs.

Prior to 3.3, I'd sit in SC waiting.. Waiting, ever waiting...

Post 3.3 I can scan the entire system and move on within 5-10 mins.

Is the FSS better? Hell yes. Would I ever go back to using the ADS? Hell yes!

Both have their place, for different folks, but like Mooka? said... The decision has been made. We have what we have.

We can cry all we wanna cry, and It won't change a thing except eat us up inside. Better to get used to the radio and carry on.

There are many other broken things requiring more attention than 'a nice to have back'.

BGS is so bad Humpty Dumpty is looking in great shape in comparison.
Combat missions/Res sites are just silly broken
Missions system is up there with BGS
MC has just been ignored
Guilds/Squadrons need lots of work
Chat is just whacky. I can't seem to get it to work at all.

The removal of the ADS, while not possibly a great idea is not game breaking, nor enjoyment breaking (to me) so, I say lets put effort into more important things.

On relations to sales. Elite is so old now, nothing taken out will effect sales. Something added may garner a few sales.

I'd be inclined to think Elite as a game, has had its cake. But it still remains a graphical tour'de'force in VR and will remain so.

I'm also inclined to think we're being allowed make extra credits to allow us to stay and buy the next inch of ideas, whatever they may be.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Pretty sure I posted this since around the time of 2.2:



Yes, absolutely, it was a VERY long time coming. Why? They'll never tell us that. But it did finally come. Those, like me, who absolutely despised the systems that were, waited quite a long time, but endured what was, until what is arrived. Is it really so unreasonable to ask those who loved what was to give things a go the way they are for a while? That whole "walk a mile in someone's shoes" business. We walked plenty of miles in yours already. 6.02*10^23 of them.



I won't disagree - a dedicated Focused Feedback would have given us the chance to generate this 160+ page thread a while ago, and possibly even gotten an Official "No, we're changing it the way we want" reply back then. BUT there was still a Focused Feedback with a huge, wide open area to offer up any feedback on any feature, at any time, and quite a few exploration feedbacks were given. They still made a decision and stuck with it, though there were some changes made based on that feedback - such a body counts, migraine-inducing flickering, and a good few other issues as well. Wouldacouldashoulda but didn't.

And no, they did not "throw the whole thing in the trash", they just changed it. They changed it a lot, but it's still there. I still bind my Discovery Scanner, now no longer Advanced, to my second trigger button. Still hold it to honk when I drop into a system - nothing's changed there at all.

I just get my data a different way now, and I happen to like how that is. I still get that you might not, but here are my shoes, start walking.

If the feedback can be on anything at all, then it isn't focused, is it?

Do you ever wonder WHY we didn't have an exploration Focused Feedback? Do you think it could possibly be that at the time the originally planned to have one, they still didn't have the faintest idea what they were going to do? I mean, if the FSS was all planned out back in July, then they could have told us about it in July. Instead we got nothing until the reveal which suggests that the FSS amounts to a whole 3 months of work.

 

[Burke]

The removal of the ADS, while not possibly a great idea is not game breaking, nor enjoyment breaking (to me) so, I say lets put effort into more important things.

On relations to sales. Elite is so old now, nothing taken out will effect sales. Something added may garner a few sales.

I'd be inclined to think Elite as a game, has had its cake. But it still remains a graphical tour'de'force in VR and will remain so.

Those of us that liked the old honk i suspect were happy to keep playing and supporting this game far into the future. I think its a state of mind, an outlook on the game and the real galaxy. Destroying exploration in the way they have was elites cake. They brought their foot down on it hard. Had the ADS been left in, me personally, this game had years of life left in it. Before the FSS came along i used to worry that they would shut the servers down before i had done enough exploring... now i just dont care. Some victory that is eh?

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

but like Mooka? said... The decision has been made. We have what we have.

So FDev makes a decision and we are all just supposed to accept it and move on?

FDev made a decision to have the ADS for 4 years and people didn't move on. They ed and moaned in the forums and continually badgered FDev into doing something about it. Same with Engineers - Fdev's decision to require commodities was changed by the forums, C&P was introduced because of complaints in the forums. Countless changes have been made by FDev because of feedback in the forums, but those of us who don't like the FSS are supposed to just accept it? Sorry, but that's not going to happen.

 

[M00ka]

If the feedback can be on anything at all, then it isn't focused, is it?

Do you ever wonder WHY we didn't have an exploration Focused Feedback? Do you think it could possibly be that at the time the originally planned to have one, they still didn't have the faintest idea what they were going to do? I mean, if the FSS was all planned out back in July, then they could have told us about it in July. Instead we got nothing until the reveal which suggests that the FSS amounts to a whole 3 months of work.

Personally, my thoughts on why there wasn't a FF on exploration is quite simple. All other 'trades' have a set way of accomplishing the goal, there was only one way to mine, trade is pretty basic in it's execution etc. But with exploration, heck even the full time explorers can't agree on what exploration should be. Is it getting to somewhere in the quickest time, is it discovering new systems and planets, is it for only those who want to find some unique orbital body or is it for those who are only interested in taking selfies. So how could FD get any form of agreement from such a diverse group, heck everyone has their own idea and concept of what a 'true explorer' is. So you can image what would happen if FD had asked the exploration community what they wanted they would have got a whole lot of different responses and whatever they did was going to upset those whose idea or concept wasn't picked.

 

[Burke]

So how could FD get any form of agreement from such a diverse group,

The side by side compromise. Everybody happy.

Cept the people with a need to take the ADS away of course

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Personally, my thoughts on why there wasn't a FF on exploration is quite simple. All other 'trades' have a set way of accomplishing the goal, there was only one way to mine, trade is pretty basic in it's execution etc. But with exploration, heck even the full time explorers can't agree on what exploration should be. Is it getting to somewhere in the quickest time, is it discovering new systems and planets, is it for only those who want to find some unique orbital body or is it for those who are only interested in taking selfies. So how could FD get any form of agreement from such a diverse group, heck everyone has their own idea and concept of what a 'true explorer' is. So you can image what would happen if FD had asked the exploration community what they wanted they would have got a whole lot of different responses and whatever they did was going to upset those whose idea or concept wasn't picked.

They had an FF for C&P, which is far more contentious than exploration ever was, so I don't think your theory holds water.

And again, OO PP got its own focused threads.

 

[M00ka]

The side by side compromise. Everybody happy.

Cept the people with a need to take the ADS away of course

But you have said on numerous occasions that you would prefer if the new system is deleted and everything is reverted back - please get your story straight!

 

[John Xenir]

"Intelligence is the ability to adapt to change"
Stephen Hawking

 

[Burke]

But you have said on numerous occasions that you would prefer if the new system is deleted and everything is reverted back - please get your story straight!

Cmon now... i have said its perfectly fine with me if that is the case. Its also perfectly fine if its side by side. Infact any outcome that returns my game play is fine by me. Im not going to tell you to read back but try and use common sense.

 

[M00ka]

Cmon now... i have said its perfectly fine with me if that is the case. Its also perfectly fine if its side by side. Infact any outcome that returns my game play is fine by me. Im not going to tell you to read back but try and use common sense.

Common sense left this thread on page 2

 

[Jacques d'Orleans]

Common sense left this thread on page 2

I'm pretty sure that my posts in this thread were made with common sense.
To both parties involved in this discussion, maybe you really should let this thread die, everything was said from both sides and now it's just repeating the same old.
FD won't change it back, the FSS is here, we can argue another ten month about that topic, FD still wouldn't care.

 

[LeoBartlet]

I'm pretty sure that my posts in this thread were made with common sense.
To both parties involved in this discussion, maybe you really should let this thread die, everything was said from both sides and now it's just repeating the same old.
FD won't change it back, the FSS is here, we can argue another ten month about that topic, FD still wouldn't care.

Indeed

 

[Tarman]

I'm pretty sure that my posts in this thread were made with common sense.
To both parties involved in this discussion, maybe you really should let this thread die, everything was said from both sides and now it's just repeating the same old.
FD won't change it back, the FSS is here, we can argue another ten month about that topic, FD still wouldn't care.

But that's how we roll around here! Hotel California has been open since 2014.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

FAO People who want the thread to die:

Posting comments containing the items listed below will trigger a Pavlovian response and result in the thread continuing to live:

1. The thread needs to die
2. FDev have made their decision (and variations on 'suck it up')
3. I love the FSS
4. The ADS was boring
5. You can still honk and fly to planets
6. Anything that Stigbob says

 

[Riverside]

But that's how we roll around here! Hotel California has been open since 2014.

The modes debate is between contributors that all want something at the expense of others.
This one is between everyone having what they want vs schadenfreude.


What they do share is a lack of common ground. There can be no agreement between wanting more players to be happy and those wanting others to be frustrated.

 

[kpmop]

FAO People who want the thread to die:

Posting comments containing the items listed below will trigger a Pavlovian response and result in the thread continuing to live:

1. The thread needs to die
2. FDev have made their decision (and variations on 'suck it up')
3. I love the FSS
4. The ADS was boring
5. You can still honk and fly to planets
6. Anything that Stigbob says

You forgot:
3a. I hate the FSS.
4a. The ADS was awesome.
7. The FSS is a harbinger of the apocalypse - WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN!+
8. *this


+(paraphrased, slightly!)

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

You forgot:
3a. I hate the FSS.
4a. The ADS was awesome.
7. The FSS is a harbinger of the apocalypse - WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN!+
8. *this


+(paraphrased, slightly!)

I can't imagine why anyone who liked the ADS would want the thread to be closed. That seems counterintuitive. But apparently you were right about number 8.