Hide "First discovered by INSERT VULGAR USERNAME"

[fadingtrails]

Ah the slippery slope fallacy, well done. You think it's a slippery slope, some of us think it's level ground.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope!

Yet earlier you warned us of the bugs we'd see "no end of" if they were to implement this...

Ah another non-coder telling us how easy something is, I never get tired of that.

I'm not. I was asking if you were in game development, because you've qualified yourself to speak for Frontier in terms of what's feasible and what's not. You won't answer. It doesn't matter anyway because Frontier don't need you or me to tell them what's doable. They can make that decision for themselves. Don't make it like I would or could force them into doing something that would set the game back. It's a suggestion, not a mandate.

As far as what you signed up for, you signed up for an MMO Space Sim, those first three letters should tell you what to expect, everything from real life in the game.

I.e. anything goes and never mind Frontier's actual TOS which said usernames are in breach of. It's inappropriate in the context of a space sim, regardless of whether or not it's an MMO.

When using such features you must use common sense and good manners, your behaviour, conduct and communications must be considerate to other users and you must not be directly or indirectly offensive, threatening, harassing or bullying to others or violate any applicable laws including but not limited to anti-discrimination legislation based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

Not to me, and apparently not to the others who didn't leap to your defense when I called you on it. And As you say they're assumptions and fairly poor ones IMO, look up Hanlon's razor as to why.

So because it's just the three of us arguing and no one backed me up on this everyone in the world agrees with you?

Except for a major social aspect of the game, where myself and my achievement are hidden, and any emergent game play or player interactions that I might have gained from a player seeing a route I have taken or recognizing me elsewhere in the game lost.

That would be their choice. Remember the freedom you argued for?

Suggesting that you open a dialog with people you disagree with is nonsensical? I'm not going to lie, that attitude is frighting, it's self enforced close mindedness, bullheaded arrogance, "I am right they are wrong" attitude.

I meant that your giving me a history lesson I didn't ask for and telling me what to do when the purpose behind the thread is clear is nonsensical. It's not exactly a disagreement, though, is it, just different people with different views, period.

That's an ad hominem attack, look it up. Although people normally don't imply that my vocabulary is something that they have to go to reference material for, I'll take that as a compliment

I don't have to look it up. Maybe you do, since you've been insulting my character the whole time. And, no, I didn't have to reference anything, I was referring to the fact that you felt you needed to add the definition of 'crack' to one of your posts. Because why should people know the meaning of that word when they need to be told to look up 'ad hominem', right? How is telling you I don't need a lesson ad hominem, Slouch?

The rest of my post was in response to varonica. I guess you were complimenting yourself.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

Ah the slippery slope fallacy, well done. You think it's a slippery slope, some of us think it's level ground.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

Many of these names have been in the game since it came out, if we haven't pitched head forward down that imaginary slope yet we are never going to. To claim that letting a few names you don't like in the game will lead us to hell is the ultimate slippery slope fallacy!

Yes, I suppose denial is often the easiest line of thought, and, if you can add some cutting links or comments then you can feel good too...
well done you!

 

[varonica]

Yet earlier you warned us of the bugs we'd see "no end of" if they were to implement this....

It's an entirely apposite assumption based on experience and observation. There are probably millions of lines of code in Elite, unfortunately from experience and what FDEV have said in the past some of it is not exactly....optimal....coding, take the HUD issue for example, where apparently minor changes affect sections of the game that are seemingly unrelated, it's not unwise to assume that a hasty change to the way the galmap displays names may affect many other parts of the game where usernames would normally be displayed. It's good practice to keep in mind when coding that minor changes can have unexpected and sometimes disastrous effects. That's not a slippery slope, that's good coding practices.

What is a slippery slope is claiming that what you consider to be vulgar and what many people don't will lead us straight to some sort of hell. It was a common argument used in Australia by the fanatic religious right no side in the same sex marriage debate. Allowing same sex marriage would lead to polygamy, incest and people marrying dogs and other animals....and no I am not exaggerating at all, this was actually said. The slippery slope is one where a minor allowance is associated with other things that are not related in any way to that original position to argue against that minor allowance or action. Changes to code leading to bugs is not an unrelated result and is in fact quite predictable, just look at the latest patch and minor changes they did there and the problems that arose because of that. Changing the way names display in the galmap, while you claim it is minor is actually a much more substantial change because the code that is being changed has been used for years and is relied on in many other aspects of the game like the codex and etc. Changing old code that displays names could have a cascading effect through many of the updates that have been applied since.

And no, I haven't done game development in particular, but that's pretty irrelevant to the point because coding is coding, whether it's being used to display a pixel ship in an imaginary universe or access a data in a multi-million set database it's pretty much the same, and you don't go back to change historic code with spending weeks or months testing every single aspect of the code that change might affect, and the older the code the more likely it is to end in a showstopper when you play around with it.

Oh yes, as mentioned already, the slippery slope fallacy is often used by the religious because a) they don't understand it and b) they have no better argument or discussion points. I suggest not using it again or I will have to assume your position is coming from a religious background where words of a certain type are "sinful" just because, so I advise you in advance to avoid that pitfall, it won't get you anywhere.

 

[varonica]

Yes, I suppose denial is often the easiest line of thought, and, if you can add some cutting links or comments then you can feel good too...
well done you!

Ah there we go, fallacy number two, denying the antecedent, and since you don't like me posting explanations of the fallacies you are using I shan't, you can look it up yourself.

And also passive-aggressive, we're on a roll here, I'll have to start cutting back on the amount of alcohol in my game of fallacy bingo.

I think this discussion has lost the plot, I think we should all agree to call it quits, it's not going anywhere, if the OP has a problem with names in the game he is talking to the wrong people, he needs to contact FDEV, posting on the forums will just lead to endless argument and no result.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

Ah there we go, fallacy number two, denying the antecedent, and since you don't like me posting explanations of the fallacies you are using I shan't, you can look it up yourself.

And also passive-aggressive, we're on a roll here, I'll have to start cutting back on the amount of alcohol in my game of fallacy bingo.

I think this discussion has lost the plot, I think we should all agree to call it quits, it's not going anywhere, if the OP has a problem with names in the game he is talking to the wrong people, he needs to contact FDEV, posting on the forums will just lead to endless argument and no result.

Yes, you're right on a couple of points,

It's not going anywhere, it just raises hackles and shouldn't really,
The OP is talking to the wrong people, (though perhaps 'suggestions' lead him to believe it would be read by the right people)
The point has been 'weaved' away from it's original trajectory and kinda got lost (though I still feel it was correct)
And, Yes, many of these objectionable nicknames have been on board for a long time... (but that does not in the least make it acceptable) and unless ED swings the retrospective hammer it's too late.

The point the OP made was kinda reasonable but may be difficult to administer as far as I can see, as it would mean someone (perhaps a new employee) specifically vetting nicknames not just for their spelling but for their perceived and or hidden meaning too... this could be in several different languages adding to the task, so, perhaps you're right there.

 

[SlouchMonster]

I think this discussion has lost the plot, I think we should all agree to call it quits, it's not going anywhere, if the OP has a problem with names in the game he is talking to the wrong people, he needs to contact FDEV, posting on the forums will just lead to endless argument and no result.

Well folks, it's been a blast. o7 XD


P.S ad hominem is a fallacious argumentative strategy whereby genuine discussion of the topic at hand is avoided by instead attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument.

 

[Hacker#451563]

To the OP...

STOP being an SJW killjoy and go back to Tumblr.


I love to see "aljocky" emblazon his/he name across a bunch of barren moons.

 

[fadingtrails]

The slippery slope is one where a minor allowance is associated with other things that are not related in any way to that original position to argue against that minor allowance or action

You were speaking in extreme, unproven hypotheticals. They don't have to be unrelated for it to be a slippery slope. You're making that up to suit your argument.

Oh yes, as mentioned already, the slippery slope fallacy is often used by the religious because a) they don't understand it and b) they have no better argument or discussion points. I suggest not using it again or I will have to assume your position is coming from a religious background where words of a certain type are "sinful" just because, so I advise you in advance to avoid that pitfall, it won't get you anywhere.

That's so ad hom. This has had nothing to do with religious beliefs. Why resort to threatening speech? And it was Skip's argument you said was fallacious. How can you have an honest argument with people if you don't know who said what. Because you can't keep people straight, you're trying to make me look like a religious nut. Talk about fallacies; you don't even know who you're talking to.

If a player's username is meant to conjure up images of someone sexually abusing themselves, then that's obscene (if not, then what is). It's a person deciding to give strangers the finger by using an offensive name when given the choice. Religion doesn't come into this in any way.

Ah another non-coder telling us (?!) how easy something is, I never get tired of that. I have done coding in my time, there's nothing more irritating than people asking for something "easy that will only take you a few minutes to do," that's how deadlines get pushed back and cost overruns happen.

And no, I haven't done game development in particular, but that's pretty irrelevant to the point because coding is coding...

You've projected your past grievances onto this suggestion so you can have a go at people. I never said it'd be easy; I said I wasn't going to take your slippery slope argument for fact.

Has anyone asked you to defend Frontier's supposed interests? Who are you to speak for them and tell people what goes and what doesn't in terms of coding? It's for them to say, and them alone. You talk like you know all about what it took to build this game.

The point the OP made was kinda reasonable but may be difficult to administer as far as I can see, as it would mean someone (perhaps a new employee) specifically vetting nicknames not just for their spelling but for their perceived and or hidden meaning too... this could be in several different languages adding to the task, so, perhaps you're right there.

That's not what I've been asking, Skip. And this is the right forum for the thread as it is a feature suggestion: add an option to hide names from the map. If that was the problem it would have been made evident much earlier.

The point is to derail the thread because they either have a problem with people not sharing their sensibilities or with people making suggestions that require coding, the latter of which will of course lead to some kind of bug armageddon.

STOP being an SJW killjoy and go back to Tumblr.


I love to see "aljocky" emblazon his/he name across a bunch of barren moons.

Having a problem with vulgarity being shoved in your face isn't being a SJW. And you will still be able to see the above, so maybe you don't get it.

You can even mock people with Down syndrome in naming your ship if that's the person you want to be.

 

[SlouchMonster]

@fadingtrails

MFW reading your reply to varonica and Hacker#451563

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

You were speaking in extreme, unproven hypotheticals. They don't have to be unrelated for it to be a slippery slope. You're making that up to suit your argument.



That's so ad hom. This has had nothing to do with religious beliefs. Why resort to threatening speech? And it was Skip's argument you said was fallacious. How can you have an honest argument with people if you don't know who said what. Because you can't keep people straight, you're trying to make me look like a religious nut. Talk about fallacies; you don't even know who you're talking to.

If a player's username is meant to conjure up images of someone sexually abusing themselves, then that's obscene (if not, then what is). It's a person deciding to give strangers the finger by using an offensive name when given the choice. Religion doesn't come into this in any way.




You've projected your past grievances onto this suggestion so you can have a go at people. I never said it'd be easy; I said I wasn't going to take your slippery slope argument for fact.

Has anyone asked you to defend Frontier's supposed interests? Who are you to speak for them and tell people what goes and what doesn't in terms of coding? It's for them to say, and them alone. You talk like you know all about what it took to build this game.



That's not what I've been asking, Skip. And this is the right forum for the thread as it is a feature suggestion: add an option to hide names from the map. If that was the problem it would have been made evident much earlier.

The point is to derail the thread because they either have a problem with people not sharing their sensibilities or with people making suggestions that require coding, the latter of which will of course lead to some kind of bug armageddon.



Having a problem with vulgarity being shoved in your face isn't being a SJW. And you will still be able to see the above, so maybe you don't get it.

You can even mock people with Down syndrome in naming your ship if that's the person you want to be.

I misunderstood,
You would like an 'option' in the options to remove the 'discovered by ***' tag to be perhaps replaced by one that says 'Previously discovered system' ?

I have no problem with that!
The only ones I see not wanting an option are the ones who wish to annoy others.
as for the coding time... well I've done my bit of GFA basic too, and a line of code to omit a search for a name is negligible... something the lines of "if then" might do!
But it's ED's game and many of their decisions have been clustered around homogenising the game further.

 

[SlouchMonster]

a line of code to omit a search for a name is negligible... something the lines of "if then" might do!

As a Software Developer, who has games dev experience, this is bio-waste.
It's not one line of code to omit the name.
Its UI changes, for the options and settings.
Its changes to data access methods or new data access methods to get the option choices.
Its dealing with a value which now may no longer exist in a memory location it once did because its wasn't set.
Its dealing with a value which may or may not have been obfuscated and therefore needs to be verified when once it was guaranteed.
and its all the things I can't think of because none of us knows a sweet FA about how the games code goes together.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

As a Software Developer, who has games dev experience, this is.
It's not one line of code to omit the name.
Its UI changes, for the options and settings.
Its changes to data access methods or new data access methods to get the option choices.
Its dealing with a value which now may no longer exist in a memory location it once did because its wasn't set.
Its dealing with a value which may or may not have been obfuscated and therefore needs to be verified when once it was guaranteed.
and its all the things I can't think of because none of us knows a sweet FA about how the games code goes together.

Your last line is the most important one so we should consider the feature asked for and leave it up to ED tell us it can/can't, will/won't happen or ignore us as they usually do!

 

[SlouchMonster]

We are/were considering the feature asked for. However one reason that was given as to why it should/could be implemented was that it would be easy, "one line of code" simple. That point was just plain wrong. I've heard the "its simple" reasoning before, here and professionally. Always from people who don't know what they're talking about. Its like asking to convert an automatic drive car to a manual and sayings its simple because its just one peddle.

Putting it mildly, it's a stupid argument.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

...Its like asking to convert an automatic drive car to a manual and sayings its simple because its just one peddle.

no it isn't!

 

[Zeeman]

Yup. People have been vulgar as long as there have been people. Look up roman graffiti for some gems.
The Hagia Sophia has viking runes that basically say "Halvdan was here".
Archaeologists find artifacts and call them "fertility symbols" but most times I bet they're 'marital aides'.

Humans are rude, vulgar beings ruled by our impulses.

Yup, this.

Mix some concrete in with the morning coco-pops, and harden up. Accept that the world is like this, you can't personally change it, and move along.

Z...

 

[SlouchMonster]

no it isn't!

Oh yes it is!

Clearly you dont understand a metaphor, or cars, or programming.

You missed the point. All together now.
IT'S BEHIND YOU!

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

Oh yes it is!

Clearly you dont understand a metaphor, or cars, or programming.

You missed the point. All together now.
IT'S BEHIND YOU!

You attempting to be clever with an old fella like me won't wash, I'm and ex competition mechanic and currently 'daredevil' roofer/decorator, I also worked in the mental health system for a decade, (that's Engineering, High Risk, and Psychology) I don't care about your self professed programming claims or your silly jabs to try for a rep point somewhere, you already admitted you don't know what the programming would involve, so the only reason I see you still posting is because you don't know where to end it.

Now reply again... for the playground!

 

[zombieapocalypse]

Am I the only one who doesn't see the value in the 'Discovered' and 'Mapped by' tags? They're the ED equivalent of "First!" comments on Youtube.

Wouldn't it be enough to know 'someone' was there before us? Finding out I'm following in the footsteps of player 'AlanFluffyCrack' does nothing for my immersion.

Please allow players to hide these player names and save themselves the obscenity.

Who knows, 1000 years in the future, names like this might actually be witty and edgy?

 

[SlouchMonster]

You attempting to be clever with an old fella like me won't wash, I'm and ex competition mechanic and currently 'daredevil' roofer/decorator, I also worked in the mental health system for a decade, (that's Engineering, High Risk, and Psychology) I don't care about your self professed programming claims or your silly jabs to try for a rep point somewhere, you already admitted you don't know what the programming would involve, so the only reason I see you still posting is because you don't know where to end it.

Now reply again... for the playground!

I don't care about your silly self professed engineering, high risk and health care claims. My point was the change would not be 'simple' and not "one line of code".

And anyway my dads bigger than your dad.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

I don't care about your silly self professed engineering, high risk and health care claims. My point was the change would not be 'simple' and not "one line of code".

And anyway my dads bigger than your dad.

My dad's well dead!