Engineering is even worst than I thought

Crank Larson

Crank Larson
BlackSpaceCowboy said:
2. I went to pin some blueprints and was shocked to find that I can only pin one blueprint per engineer. Why?

3. I pinned a blueprint, gathered some materials, then did grade 1 and was shocked that it didn't unlock grade 2. I have to go to the engineer to unlock grades.
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Doesn't take much to shock you, does it? :D​

Why do they want players to travel to the engineers again to upgrade? Why not just one visit and the rest can be done remotely? It seems that they just want to make the process as painful as possible.

Engineers could be a fantastic part of the game. I would love experimenting with different builds and engineering upgrades to make specialized optimized ships. But the process is so cumbersome that it makes it impossible. And this causes people to stay away from Open because they're not engineered enough to compete.

Is there much community support for overhauling this tedious process and making it fun to experiment?

Allow us to pin as many blueprints as we want
Allow us to unlock levels in remote workshops
Unlock all the engineers
Make it easier to find required materials
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I don't agree with any of your suggestions. I like the "new" engineering system. I'm more than happy to fly to visit the engineers - after all, this is a game about flying your spaceship. Materials can be traded at brokers, so whether one is particularly difficult to find or not is irrelevant. Just get the ones you can find and trade them.

I started a new account recently. To take it on DW2, I needed to upgrade the FSD. Getting the FSD to G5 with experimental took me two evenings (about four hours), and I enjoyed every minute of it.
 

EternalSorrow

E
Crank Larson said:
Doesn't take much to shock you, does it? :D​



I don't agree with any of your suggestions. I like the "new" engineering system. I'm more than happy to fly to visit the engineers - after all, this is a game about flying your spaceship. Materials can be traded at brokers, so whether one is particularly difficult to find or not is irrelevant. Just get the ones you can find and trade them.

I started a new account recently. To take it on DW2, I needed to upgrade the FSD. Getting the FSD to G5 with experimental took me two evenings (about four hours), and I enjoyed every minute of it.
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Grindlovers are the minority. And I think, even them could like enlivening of the material salvage process.
But no one of them says "hey, it's nice, but i'd like to see it even more fun". That's one of the reasons why nothing changes.
 
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Crank Larson

Crank Larson
EternalSorrow said:
Grindlovers are the minority. And I think, even them could like enlivening of the material salvage process.
But no one of them says "hey, it's nice, but i'd like to see it even more fun". That's one of the reasons why nothing changes.
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Does anyone actually enjoy "Grind"? I didn't grind for any of my engineering. The four hours it took me to upgrade my FSD was involved in playing the game and doing different things until I had the materials I needed to unlock the FSD. I've done a fair bit of credit grinding in my time, but fortunately have no need to do that anymore (and with core mining now introduced and exploration rewards increased significantly, I doubt I'll ever need to again - it took me two [enjoyable] mining trips on my second account to buy my A-rated AspX).

If something becomes a grind, do something else for a while. It's not like there is any shortage of options in E: D.
 

The Replicated Man

T
BlackSpaceCowboy said:
I'm sorry if everyone already knows this. I had not played much at all in the past two years before Chapter 4. I've been playing a lot lately because the game is so much better after Chapter 4.

1. I thought there were about 10 engineers. There are 24 most of whom have to be unlocked?

2. I went to pin some blueprints and was shocked to find that I can only pin one blueprint per engineer. Why?

3. I pinned a blueprint, gathered some materials, then did grade 1 and was shocked that it didn't unlock grade 2. I have to go to the engineer to unlock grades.

Why do they want players to travel to the engineers again to upgrade? Why not just one visit and the rest can be done remotely? It seems that they just want to make the process as painful as possible.

Engineers could be a fantastic part of the game. I would love experimenting with different builds and engineering upgrades to make specialized optimized ships. But the process is so cumbersome that it makes it impossible. And this causes people to stay away from Open because they're not engineered enough to compete.

Is there much community support for overhauling this tedious process and making it fun to experiment?

Allow us to pin as many blueprints as we want
Allow us to unlock levels in remote workshops
Unlock all the engineers
Make it easier to find required materials
Click to expand...

Not sure if you remember but engineering used to be much much harder. We should thank Frontier for doing what they have done so far to make it easier on us to do engineering. Should it be made easier? I am not sure. It's part of the journey of Elite. Kind of a rite of passage for some.

The same could be said about Novice CMDRs flying Anacondas (Fresh from the latest credit exploit) who have no idea what they are doing and have poor outfitting choices.
 

aRJay

aRJay
EternalSorrow said:
Grindlovers are the minority. And I think, even them could like enlivening of the material salvage process.
But no one of them says "hey, it's nice, but i'd like to see it even more fun". That's one of the reasons why nothing changes.
Click to expand...

The trouble is not that people don't want more fun but that there are more opinions on what would be more fun than there are people on the forums.

The current engineering is better than the original and acquiring the materials can be a chore even a grind if you must get it all done by two days from yesterday, if your play stile is more relaxed then it happens as it happens.
 

EternalSorrow

E
aRJay said:
The trouble is not that people don't want more fun but that there are more opinions on what would be more fun than there are people on the forums.

The current engineering is better than the original and acquiring the materials can be a chore even a grind if you must get it all done by two days from yesterday, if your play stile is more relaxed then it happens as it happens.
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I understand, that new G5 ship could be acquired in evening or two, but the process is very passive and not involving. If "Flying the ship" does mean "flying in the void and nothing else", that's a really bad concept.

I've liked this game much more in pre-engineering times, even with the slower progression it was much more fun, because of the reasons I've described on the previous page.
 
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EternalSorrow

E
Replicant said:
Not sure if you remember but engineering used to be much much harder. We should thank Frontier for doing what they have done so far to make it easier on us to do engineering. Should it be made easier? I am not sure. It's part of the journey of Elite. Kind of a rite of passage for some.

The same could be said about Novice CMDRs flying Anacondas (Fresh from the latest credit exploit) who have no idea what they are doing and have poor outfitting choices.
Click to expand...

I'm not going to thank incompetent developer, who have firstly implemented an ugly RNG-based concept, and replaced it by "normally" grindy variant later. You can call it how do you want ("passage", "journey" ), but grind is grind.

And, as I've already said, grind is not an issue. The issue is a ruined balance and significantly reduced build variety after the Engineeres were introduced, as the p***ed combat.
 
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Stigbob

Stigbob
EternalSorrow said:
I'm not going to thank incompetent developer, who have firstly implemented an ugly RNG-based concept, and replaced it by "normally" grindy variant later. You can call it how do you want ("passage", "journey" ), but grind is grind.

And, as I've already said, grind is not an issue. The issue is a ruined balance and significantly reduced build variety after the Engineeres were introduced, as the p***ed combat.
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Engineers didn't unbalance anything, harmless sidey v ganker wing was no different before.
 

Ving

V
m0rl0ck said:
Its a horrible game mechanic that caters to the worst in human nature and its much, much better than it used to be.
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Engineers are the reason I no longer play the game. It really is one of the worst game mechanics ever invented. Such a shame. I still love the Elite engine and flight model, but my only involvement now is replying to threads about how bad a decision Engineers were :)
 

eqinox

E
Oss133 said:
This is a game about flying a space ship from a to b. If you don't like that bit, you're out of luck.
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Flying the space ship, including combat, landing, docking and all that is amazing. I don't just like it, I love it.

It's the gamey, grindy, repetitive RNG mechanics involved with Engineers which is so bad I hate it. Currently it's tolerable, but it still detracts me from the flying part. If the flying part wasn't as amazing as it is, I'd never start ED again.
 

Crank Larson

Crank Larson
eqinox said:
It's the gamey, grindy, repetitive RNG mechanics involved with Engineers which is so bad I hate it. Currently it's tolerable, but it still detracts me from the flying part. If the flying part wasn't as amazing as it is, I'd never start ED again.
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You're looking at this the wrong way. Engineers don't detract you from flying, they give you yet another excuse to do so!
 

EternalSorrow

E
Crank Larson said:
Indeed. There never was balance. Some ships are better than others, and that will always be the case (though not always the same ship :) ).
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There was. You're probably playing this game not so long.

Stigbob said:
Engineers didn't unbalance anything, harmless sidey v ganker wing was no different before.
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Exaggerated example is not an argument. You're wrong.

I can clearly say, that it was possible to kill a CMDR on a Python - best combat ship in the game - on a Viper. Now it's not, due to the mindless stacking gameplay and 101 other causes I've described in threads related to combat. Engineering and stacking combo excludes skill element from combat almost completely.
 
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Stigbob

Stigbob
eqinox said:
Flying the space ship, including combat, landing, docking and all that is amazing. I don't just like it, I love it.

It's the gamey, grindy, repetitive RNG mechanics involved with Engineers which is so bad I hate it. Currently it's tolerable, but it still detracts me from the flying part. If the flying part wasn't as amazing as it is, I'd never start ED again.
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An engineered ship is more fun to fly no need to G5 anything.
 
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