Newcomer / Intro Type 9, Thrusters, seeking advice

[Jaggid Edje]

So I googled this and didn't get any results (at least on the first page) that directly answer this question (doesn't help that half the search-result-links to official forums don't work due to forum migration).

Background for the question: I use a Krait Mk2 for core mining but wanted something larger for bulk mining when I'm just in the mood to mine lazily. I'm putting together a Type 9 Heavy for the task, in part because I don't have a Type 9 and just want to add one to my fleet. I learned rather quickly that the thing handles in a way that makes it clear why "heavy" is in the ship name.

My Question: Is it worth the loss in Jump Range to use 7A thrusters instead of 7D? I'm getting ready to engineer components and don't want to waste the effort engineering 7D's if more experienced folks indicate the 7a are worth it. I really wish there was a way to test flight each WITH the engineering applied.

I use D class thrusters on all of my ships except combat ones, but my gut is telling me that for this beast A might be a better idea. I'm a rookie at this game, though, so don't completely trust my gut.

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

Have you compared your build with both versions on coriolis?

You're asking about something subjective so it's hard to say what's "worth it" for another person.

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

A T9 @ ~ 1000t will lose around 1.5 ly and gain about 25m/s, going from 7D to 7A dirty/drag drives.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

Have you compared your build with both versions on coriolis?

You're asking about something subjective so it's hard to say what's "worth it" for another person.

I have, and the numerical differences are pretty small. I have noticed when doing engineering to thrusters though, that those small numerical differences really do make a nicely noticeable difference to ship handling. I realize it's a subjective question, but as with any thing subjective where the answer is either "yes" or "no", there's usually a relative consensus of some kind.

I have looked at a few builds posted by others over the last few years and it does seem like this may be something that is near a 50/50 split, seeing as half the builds I've looked at use 7A and the other half use 7D.

I appreciate the response, btw.

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

I have, and the numerical differences are pretty small. I have noticed when doing engineering to thrusters though, that those small numerical differences really do make a nicely noticeable difference to ship handling. I realize it's a subjective question, but as with any thing subjective where the answer is either "yes" or "no", there's usually a relative consensus of some kind.

In this case the T9 is a giant pig (I mean that in the most positive way) so yes, it's pretty negligible either way.

I'd go for the 7As that said.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

In this case the T9 is a giant pig (I mean that in the most positive way) so yes, it's pretty negligible either way.

I'd go for the 7As that said.

I named it "Space Cow" if that gives any idea how I feel about its handling. One of the best things in this game though is how the various ships have a different feel when flying. I absolutely love the cockpit view of it, at least (by which I mean how much of it is window).

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

I named it "Space Cow" if that gives any idea how I feel about its handling. One of the best things in this game though is how the various ships have a different feel when flying. I absolutely love the cockpit view of it, at least (by which I mean how much of it is window).

Apt.

They do a fine job in that regard.
Looking at minimum, optimal and maximum mass vs your ship mass will give you an idea of how well fitted the thrusters are.
If you're below minumum it's worth considering going lower in some cases, but I tend to prioritize real space speed/handling over range.

My exploration Anaconda and Kraits have undersized thrusters, 6A and 5A respectively.
Most explorers go a bit smaller.
I do similar on trade vessels too.
I want some boost and handling.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

Apt.

They do a fine job in that regard.
Looking at minimum, optimal and maximum mass vs your ship mass will give you an idea of how well fitted the thrusters are.
If you're below minumum it's worth considering going lower in some cases, but I tend to prioritize real space speed/handling over range.

My exploration Anaconda and Kraits have undersized thrusters, 6A and 5A respectively.
Most explorers go a bit smaller.
I do similar on trade vessels too.
I want some boost and handling.

Hmm..for that mass part, definitely going to go with the 7A thrusters then. It's pretty significant difference on the optimal and maximum mass, and with a full cargo hold the ship will be pushing the limit if I use 7D thrusters.

Thanks for your help and advice. Going to buy the thrusters and start engineering this thing now.

 

[Bob Lighthouse]

Np and enjoy your cow!

 

[Clicker]

@Jaggid Edje ...when you build, engineer and finally go mining with this ship and decide it wasn't worth the hassle but the cargo space was nice...try the Anaconda...much, much easier to mine, you don't give up too much cargo space (if any), much easier to defend against me pirates and the jump range...well we all know about that, right.

Granted the view isn't as good but, hey, you can't have everything.

Clicker

 

[MK Regular]

Personally, I went with 7D thrusters for my space cow. I haven't had her set up for mining since before 3.3, but I do have her current build saved in Coriolis.

I tried seeing what would happen If I swapped out the 7D G5 Dirty drags for 7As with the same mods. Turns out I only gain a whopping 11 m/s of speed and 17 m/s boost and a few negligible maneuverability increases. In return, I lose 0.4 LY of jump range and I would need to rearrange my power priorities to be able to run priority 1 on 40% power.

While it really doesn't matter what I pick either way, the little bit of paranoia I have says that I MUST be able to run sensors, life support, FSD and thrusters on 40% power so I can escape if someone somehow manages to destroy the fortress of a power plant I have fitted (it also says that I should be able to run the PDs on 40% too so they can intercept FSD interrupt missiles and hatch breakers, so yeah). I don't see myself using 7A thrusters on my space cow any time soon.

 

[Chris Simon]

A cow will be a cow, no matter which thrusters you slap on her.

That being said, I did put A-rated thrusters on mine and did some engineering. Not because the speed would increase all that significantly, but better thrustes don't mean just the main thrusters and the extra bit of... uhm, I'm reluctant to call it agility... responsiveness? Nah, that also doesn't feel right. ... is nice. Particularly over planets. I do a lot of planetside work and every Newton of thrust is good.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

@Jaggid Edje ...when you build, engineer and finally go mining with this ship and decide it wasn't worth the hassle but the cargo space was nice...try the Anaconda...much, much easier to mine, you don't give up too much cargo space (if any), much easier to defend against me pirates and the jump range...well we all know about that, right.

Granted the view isn't as good but, hey, you can't have everything.

My initial play was all trade-oriented and I was so in love with my Python and being able to do outpost missions with her that I never bothered to upgrade to anything bigger. The Type 9 for mining was, in part, because I felt badly for the ship design that I never sought one out for my trade missions. hahaha The only big ship I got early-ish game was a Beluga Liner for passenger missions.

I hit a billion and a half credits last week and just decided I want to get up to having 2 ships for each category of activity; I got a DB to compliment my Asp for exploration, purchased an Orca for a smaller passenger runner and this Type 9 was to add a Heavy for bulk mining to go along with the Krait Mk2 that I use for core mining. I also have an FDL and Krait Mk2 that I use for combat missions.

At this point, trading is the one thing I still only have a single ship for (the Python), so will probably heed your advice regarding the anaconda, but be using it as an armed trader....something I don't currently have. Ultimately I think I want a Clipper for this role, but I haven't grinded rep yet. Price tag on both is hefty enough that I'll need to be doing some work on raising funds again first anyway....all these new ships have really tapped into my finances hard.

Another reason I didn't go Anaconda yet is the price tag. I'm still new enough to the game that I am hesitant to fly anything with such a steep insurance cost. hahaha Soon, soon.

 

[Para Handy]

A while back someone told me that the T-9 had been given a "buff" and was now more useable. So I gave one a go - that account has a rebuy on it now and I keep putting off the clear save.

Moral of the story - never try to play the interdiction mini-game in a T-9.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

A while back someone told me that the T-9 had been given a "buff" and was now more useable. So I gave one a go - that account has a rebuy on it now and I keep putting off the clear save.

Moral of the story - never try to play the interdiction mini-game in a T-9.

LOL, I was curious about that. It hasn't come up for me yet, but I have been mining for a few hours right now though and was thinking it may come up once I head to stations to sell my spoils. I have to at least try the mini game to see for my self, but I'm thinking this ship is more of a "have decent shields, submit to interdiction, then BSR" type ship. I guess I'll find out soon enough, if I ever manage to get this cargo space even close to full.... Big difference in how long I can stay in the belt compared to mining with the MK 2, that's for sure.

 

[Chris Simon]

A while back someone told me that the T-9 had been given a "buff" and was now more useable.

Yeah, but that buff you've heard about was an extra C8 internal.

 

[colprice2002]

I've traded in my bulk miners (both T7 and T9) since the upgrade in mining tools and now I'm using a type 10.
The T7 only has 2 small weapon slot, so core mining is out. The T9 has enough weapon slots, but with a decent cargo of void opals you get some interdictions on the way to your preferred sales point. The mining T9 isn't agile enough to avoid interdiction, nor able to defend itself, nor fast enough to escape undamaged.
The T10 - with A grade engineers drives - is better at evasion and can carry a decent defensive armament as well. As in a fighter bay (if nothing else it acts as a distraction to an attacker and is cheap enough as a throw away) and you have a reasonable mining ship with good defensive ability.

Quite honestly, I reckon that the Krait is excellent for mining, I take ages to get more than 50 tonnes of opals, and it's fast and manoeuvrable enough to be able to escape interdictions unarmed.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

Quite honestly, I reckon that the Krait is excellent for mining, I take ages to get more than 50 tonnes of opals, and it's fast and manoeuvrable enough to be able to escape interdictions unarmed.

It sure is! I love the thing for core mining. I actually had repurposed my python trader originally to try out core mining. When I decided to make a dedicated ship just for it so as not to have to refit a ship each time I did it I opted for the Krait MK2 because I never had the gumption to stay in the ring long enough to actually fill the Python, so I figured why not go a little smaller.

Doing this T9 miner was all about bulk asteroid mining. I'm not going to do core mining in it; I didn't even fit the tools to do so onto it! sometimes I just want to be lazy in the ring and strip lesser valuable materials with mining lasers. The T9 works pretty well for that, I enjoyed the several hours of lazy mining I have done with it so far.

 

[Norwin Palmer]

Doing this T9 miner was all about bulk asteroid mining. I'm not going to do core mining in it; I didn't even fit the tools to do so onto it! sometimes I just want to be lazy in the ring and strip lesser valuable materials with mining lasers. The T9 works pretty well for that, I enjoyed the several hours of lazy mining I have done with it so far.

I was laser mining in a T9 yesterday. I sort of like it for that too, for laid back mining T9 beats Anaconda IMO but T7 beats even T9 for laid back mining. Most Anaconda, Cutter, Python laser mining builds are all about speed, efficiency, jump range, cr/hr, min/max everything which is cool and all but completely misses the laid back pig aspect.

That said I would always go for 7A thrusters in a T9 unless you can't afford them. Either way not a big deal, but in laser mining most all the effort is in locating and prospecting so even that small edge the 7As give makes for a more pleasant experience over hours of play and helps contribute to that laid back feeling without starting to feel frenetic.

 

[Jaggid Edje]

I was laser mining in a T9 yesterday. I sort of like it for that too, for laid back mining T9 beats Anaconda IMO but T7 beats even T9 for laid back mining. Most Anaconda, Cutter, Python laser mining builds are all about speed, efficiency, jump range, cr/hr, min/max everything which is cool and all but completely misses the laid back pig aspect.

That said I would always go for 7A thrusters in a T9 unless you can't afford them. Either way not a big deal, but in laser mining most all the effort is in locating and prospecting so even that small edge the 7As give makes for a more pleasant experience over hours of play and helps contribute to that laid back feeling without starting to feel frenetic.

Thanks for the reply! I did go with the 7A's in the end, and even engineered them a bit (up to G3). Overall glad I did, because as you implied, the locating and prospecting aspect is probably where the T9 is the most painful to use.

I've now mined enough to have gone into the rings and filled this beast to capacity 3 times, and I'm very happy with it. It's doing a fine job in the role for which I purchased it. I still haven't been interdicted in it either.....really curious how tough that minigame is in the thing.