Where is the exploration?

[Stigbob]

Don't know what all the fuss is about, the FSS is loads of fun.

 

[Crank Larson]

Don't know what all the fuss is about, the FSS is loads of fun.

I think that's stretching it a fair bit. I like the FSS, but I wouldn't describe it as being loads of fun. More fun than the previous incarnation, but that didn't really register on the fun scale at all.

 

[Stigbob]

I think that's stretching it a fair bit. I like the FSS, but I wouldn't describe it as being loads of fun. More fun than the previous incarnation, but that didn't really register on the fun scale at all.

I use the FSS, that means its fun or I wouldn't be bothering.

 

[Crank Larson]

I use the FSS, that means its fun or I wouldn't be bothering.

No, that is a logical fallacy. You may find it fun, and that is great. But that is all it means - fun is subjective.

 

[Enderby]

The funny thing about the FSS is that it's so very not-fun. Or, un-fun, if you will.
Take your pick.

 

[Old Duck]

No, that is a logical fallacy. You may find it fun, and that is great. But that is all it means - fun is subjective.

I also find it fun, and if Stigbob and I agree on anything, then like a divine sign in the heavens, it MUST be true.

Now if I can only get Stig to agree that shadows on PS4 are rubbish

 

[Northpin]

I also like more the current exploration model and the FSS than its previous incarnation.

I do have the hate moments, but only in systems with literally hundreds of NHSS.
Luckily one does not find those out in the black, but is utterly annoying if you just want to find some HGEs in a system with Thargoid presence.

 

[Stigbob]

No, that is a logical fallacy. You may find it fun, and that is great. But that is all it means - fun is subjective.

If I find it to be fun then its fun from my perspective, which is the only relevant one to me. I'm not overly bothered about other peoples takes on it since games are indeed such a subjective thing. People should just play the ones they like applying their personal standards at purchase/login.

Having said that I do find the angry ex-boyfriends of the game who hang around moaning hilarious, so its a win either way.

I'm a glass half full person.

I also find it fun, and if Stigbob and I agree on anything, then like a divine sign in the heavens, it MUST be true.

Now if I can only get Stig to agree that shadows on PS4 are rubbish

I agree.

Spoiler: dreadful truth

consoles are rubbish therefore the shadows must be.

 

[Ian Skippy]

I only came to the realization because I tried it first time today. I'm only two weeks into the game and I expected exploration and surveying would be much different really.


the thing I loathe the most is the POIs counter that tells you straight a way if a planet is worthy of investigation or not. That alone takes the whole exploration thing away. By "sensor", I mean something that will let me interpret, even with the possibility of failure, if a planet is worth investigating further or not! The thing is picking up emissions, so give these emissions the form of waves and sounds, give it the possibility of interference... Not a plain text telling me there's geological(56) on said planet, that's plain awful.

It used to be that you pressed a button and that was it. The new system builds on it, but there is certainly room for further improvement. Mind you, many were upset that exploration became more than pressing one button, so progress is... slow.

 

[Riverside]

It used to be that you pressed a button and that was it. The new system builds on it, but there is certainly room for further improvement. Mind you, many were upset that exploration became more than pressing one button, so progress is... slow.

If you thought it was just pressing a button you were doing it wrong

The cash reward for honking without stopping is still in the game btw, plus now you tag the star & any nearby bodies too.

 

[Phil JMac]

I prefer new over old

It's not perfect and I'm still wondering why I've never seen a rumour in the codex

I do feel for the old school explorers - I never did any long explorations when I first got into Elite a couple of years ago but the jump ranges were shorter and there was a bit more danger

People don't like change

 

[SciTrekker]

I would make exploration completely different... but it would be a new game, not the actual ED anymore because it would require a complete regeneration of the star systems.
The game is balanced to achieve a quick gameplay... as quick as possible. In fact we can scan and discover a lot of systems in very short time (I have an average of 20-25 full system scans/hour).

The natural consequnce of this rush is that the cool things that you can find are very (extremely) rare and that the exploration reward is low: if you don't find ELW, WW and Ammonia World the complete system scan value is always lower than 100k credits. So in this game loop you are forced to scan as many systems as possible to make a living out. The fun things is that now with exploration you can make or low rewards or extremely high... there's no in-between.

I would make the game completely opposite:

• The gameplay should be focused more on each star system, rather than jumping and scooping most of the time.
• We should spend more time in each system in order to complete several activities to perform a full scan of the system. It should be a dedicated work with a more various and complex gameplay, but no timesink and repetitive actions (like flying to each planet to scan the surface).
• This additional time is spent playing several activities, not just aiming a probe in the sky. The player should be involved in activities requiring basic scientific knowledge, game experience and personal skills.
• You would only need to discover the main planets. Once the main planets are discovered the moons can be quickly identified (to avoid repetitive actions). The scan of a single planet should take 1-2 minutes (which makes 10-20 minutes for a full system scan with 10 planets, moons included)
• The rare features should not be rare anymore and should be more varied since we would scan less systems: more Biological POI's, Lagrangian Clouds, Magnetic Thunderstorm, Colliding Planets, Ringed planets orbiting close to each other, Dangerous Black Holes, dangerous anomalies, evidences of old civilizations and so on...).
• The galaxy map should give clues where these features are so you know where to go instead of making random jumps here and there. In this way the explorer can enjoy the journey through the galaxy and spend valuable time in each system.
• The value of a full system scan should be increased accordingly to the additional time spent.
• A specific ID should be assigned to each CMDR. Everytime a full scan of an undiscovered system is performed the system will get the following name: Sector Name+Player ID+ 3 Running numbers+3 Letters. Example (player ID SEN981): PUEKEE-SEN981-001-AAA.

But I just want to know where the station is in the small population system so I can deliver this biowaste.

 

[[ kraken ]]

Don't know what all the fuss is about, the FSS is loads of fun.

I use the FSS, that means its fun or I wouldn't be bothering.

Ah... you're serious.

I prefer new over old

It's not perfect and I'm still wondering why I've never seen a rumour in the codex

I do feel for the old school explorers - I never did any long explorations when I first got into Elite a couple of years ago but the jump ranges were shorter and there was a bit more danger

People don't like change

Well... I dunno if to call myself an old school explorer. Sure the way it worked before it must have been awful.

It used to be that you pressed a button and that was it. The new system builds on it, but there is certainly room for further improvement. Mind you, many were upset that exploration became more than pressing one button, so progress is... slow.

It seems to me like exploration became less! You hardly have to fly to the bodies now!

If I find it to be fun then its fun from my perspective, which is the only relevant one to me. I'm not overly bothered about other peoples takes on it since games are indeed such a subjective thing. People should just play the ones they like applying their personal standards at purchase/login.

Having said that I do find the angry ex-boyfriends of the game who hang around moaning hilarious, so its a win either way.

I'm a glass half full person.



I agree.

Spoiler: dreadful truth

consoles are rubbish therefore the shadows must be.

Still, I find so very not fun when the game plays out the game for me. Too bad when at purchase/login such facts are not advertised.



Well, so after two weeks, there continues the quest for a game that I will really like to sink my time into.
Let's tick a few boxes:

• there's depth to it
• doesn't hold your hand
• you need to read an old fashioned manual
• maybe there's even something dangerous, so you need some skill to make it alive out there.
• etc.

I'm sure it's out there somewhere.

But I'll be back to ED now and then to see some cool vistas.

o7

 

[Stigbob]

But I'll be back to ED now and then to see some cool vistas.

o7

Play the games you like is the only sensible choice, hanging around the forums of games you no longer play can be very odd.

 

[[ kraken ]]

Play the games you like is the only sensible choice, hanging around the forums of games you no longer play can be very odd.

Oh, I'm sorry, you didn't understand. I love ED.

Only because a baseline of Frontier's customers wants their game to be a mindless grind-fest, it doesn't mean that they need to have it their way.

As I said, I'll be back now and then for the panoramas, and I might make my voice heard in that the gameplay in this game is not dead yet. If I was to completely quit now, then the devs couldn't help but think that really all of their customers just want to grind repetitive tasks that a kid could script.

I will also keep looking for titles that are what ED promised to be, and that means that I won't sink any more money in the current project until I see it improve. Then, even if I actually was to find what I'm looking for (not easy) and ED hasn't improved in the meanwhile, I might decide to drop ED entirely, but I'm not sure that's going to happen so soon.

If you still find it odd to have me around, you'll have to bear with it, I guess.

 

[Northpin]

I don't really see what's your beef here
Before Armstrong and Aldrin did their thing with the Flag on the moon, lots and lots of people used the era version of FSS and also send probes there. And it were the sixties of the nineteen hundreds not 3304
You cant really expect them to fit in your sidewinder the ESO VLT plus the Atacama VLMA and Spitzer and Chandra and give you some hundreds of scientists for you to coordinate.

I'm just glad I don't have to fly 200000ls to discover some planet, unless I really want to do the actual mapping.

 

[[ kraken ]]

I don't really see what's your beef here
Before Armstrong and Aldrin did their thing with the Flag on the moon, lots and lots of people used the era version of FSS and also send probes there. And it were the sixties of the nineteen hundreds not 3304
You cant really expect them to fit in your sidewinder the ESO VLT plus the Atacama VLMA and Spitzer and Chandra and give you some hundreds of scientists for you to coordinate.

I'm just glad I don't have to fly 200000ls to discover some planet, unless I really want to do the actual mapping.

I'm sure that their version of the FSS didn't do all the work for them. They sent probes, then the probes sent back data, then they analysed the data. Those people were scientists, they probably loved their job and analysing that data must not have always been easy, but I'm sure that they enjoyed doing it greatly.

Now I'm playing a game, where I'm sending probes. My probes are so advanced that the data they send me is not only already analysed and interpreted, it also gives me all exact solutions to everything I would possibly want to know. Do I consider it to be a great a technological advancement? No. These probes are so advanced that I don't see why they couldn't launch themselves. I'm left doing the job of a mindless drone, just supposed to click at things. I'm not exploring anything, you see?



Now, I know where this is going, so: do I want to be a scientist?

No.

I'm playing a game. Where I'm sending probes. It would be lovely if I was left with a game to play, but sadly this game is playing itself and I'm left with the job of a mindless drone, just supposed to click at things. I'm not exploring anything, you see?

 

[[ kraken ]]

I'm just glad I don't have to fly 200000ls to discover some planet, unless I really want to do the actual mapping.

If that planet is too far away, then who said you should bother? Do you realise that you just want your name tag on it so you have it on the whole system? It's just a completionist thing?

Don't you think it would be better if you had to actually investigate that planet from far away, and then take the important decision if it was worth your time or not to go all the way there?

 

[Crank Larson]

I would like to point out that exploring and tagging planets are two different things. To explore a planet, you would need to travel out to it and actually see it and investigate. Otherwise you aren't exploring at all.

One of the reasons that I do like the new FSS is that I don't have to go and visit these far away planets to find out if they are worth the flight. If what I see on the scanner reveals something I want to go and see, then I'll fly out there. Otherwise, I can move on. This enhances exploring as it means that you can just go and look at stuff you are interested in. The scanning part is not the exploring bit. It is simply there to find out whether an area is worth exploring.

With regards to automation, I would love to see some enhancements to the surface scan so that you can save the pattern of probes you use to scan a planet. Then if you find another planet of the same size, you can use the same pattern to scan the planet automatically (just choose it from the list). I don't mind the process as implemented, but it can get tedious after a while.

 

[Northpin]

Well, that's exactly what the fss does, it gives me all the information I need so I can decide if I want to go 200000ls to that planet. Most of the time I don't.
The previous system would had gave you only a nice picture in the system map