Any reason why we can't store ships with loaded cargo?

Arkadi

Arkadi
Basically thread title. I think there was some reasoning behind it, but I forgot.

I am just annoyed when I can't change ship, because I have some load, be it limpets or actual cargo.
Right now I was pirating in my pirate python. I got a message from my squadron and want to change to my AX ship quickly. But no. I'll have to get rid of my pirated cargo first, before I can swap ship. It's a littel bit annoying. And I can't see the reason why we can't just store ships with loaded cargo.

The data isn't particularly big. It's just some variables for cargo, nothing data heavy I guess.

Could players abuse stored ships with cargo? Maybe, but honestly what's the difference if someone stores some T9 full with some goods or just loads them one after another. The impact on BGS or powerplay can sure be migitated by some clever coding.
 

SciTrekker

SciTrekker
Arkadi said:
Basically thread title. I think there was some reasoning behind it, but I forgot.

I am just annoyed when I can't change ship, because I have some load, be it limpets or actual cargo.
Right now I was pirating in my pirate python. I got a message from my squadron and want to change to my AX ship quickly. But no. I'll have to get rid of my pirated cargo first, before I can swap ship. It's a littel bit annoying. And I can't see the reason why we can't just store ships with loaded cargo.

The data isn't particularly big. It's just some variables for cargo, nothing data heavy I guess.

Could players abuse stored ships with cargo? Maybe, but honestly what's the difference if someone stores some T9 full with some goods or just loads them one after another. The impact on BGS or powerplay can sure be migitated by some clever coding.
Click to expand...
You kind of hit on it with your final sentence but I personally doubt FD's ability to mitigate BGS and PP exploits cargo storage would open up.
 

Hooplah

Hooplah
There are a few reasons. One per how the game is played. Another storing 300 meta-alloys (yes, knowing the game I could farm them} on a stored ship then selling them to other players with real money transactions using PayPal. Frontier doesn't want to ever get close to this.Good for them.
 
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Arkadi

Arkadi
I see the point in some edge cases for traders emptying markets and creating demands or spamming markets with goods. I thought it should be possible to guard against such behaviour with prohibitive coding. However I understand that issue somewhat.

But limpets? Seriously, they can't do no harm.

It would be a very nice QOL feature someday in a minor updated, so ships could keep limpets, so we don't have to sell them in the munition screen first.

A minor gripe. Maybe I am in a whimpy mood today. But this littel thing kept annoying me for months and years now. It had to come out someday.

edit:
Hooplah said:
There are a few reasons. One per how the game is played. Another storing 300 meta-alloys on a stored ship then selling them to other players with real money transactions using PayPal. Frontier doesn't want to ever get close to this.Good for them.
Click to expand...

On second thought, we can't sell ships to each other, so I don't really see that point. Soemone would have to sell his game-accaunt for this. This wouldn't make much sense, or woud it?
 
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Lightspeed

Lightspeed
I could see it running into a branching tree of problems, though.

Ship stored with cargo (even limpets). Visit outfitting. Store cargo module (problem there) .... sell cargo module (similar problem there).

Visit outfitting in another ship ... load cargo module already equipped with cargo ..........

Imagine the coding issues with that !
 

IndigoWyrd

IndigoWyrd
Yep, ages old issue that nothing short of hot iron to the feet will get addressed. Thing is, I simply cannot conceive of a way to actually exploit stored cargo IF the method of storage is addressed correctly from the beginning.

1. Do not leave said cargo on the ship itself. Instead, transfer it to a cargo bay on said station.

2. Do not store said cargo for free - you are charged for that storage space, at the same cost as the type and number of cargo racks that would be required to store said cargo.

3. Cargo storage fees are assessed weekly. Failure to pay means forfeiture of said cargo. Payments are not automatic, but delivered as a “Pop-up” mission - Pay or Don’t Pay, message expires in 24 hours.

4. Power Play Commodities cannot be stored, no exceptions.

5. You cannot store cargo if you have cargo stored already anywhere else.

6. Stored cargo is an all-or-nothing deal, you can store it all or store none. You can remove it all or remove none.

7. Stored cargo can only be accessed at the station where it is stored.

Now how could this somehow be exploited?

At most you could store what? 794 tons of cargo in one station in the galaxy at a time. You can’t have it moved, can’t just take out part of it, get charged for leaving it there, and lose it if you can’t or won’t pay for it, and you can’t stockpile Power Play cargo.

So how do you exploit this? Do your best here.
 

Arkadi

Arkadi
I could see it running into a branching tree of problems, though.

Ship stored with cargo (even limpets). Visit outfitting. Store cargo module (problem there) .... sell cargo module (similar problem there).

Visit outfitting in another ship ... load cargo module already equipped with cargo ..........

Imagine the coding issues with that !
Click to expand...

Nah, we can visit outifitting with full cargo bays already. The cargo bays are locked now already. This can not happen with code as it is in place already.
 

Hooplah

Hooplah
Arkadi said:
I see the point in some edge cases for traders emptying markets and creating demands or spamming markets with goods. I thought it should be possible to guard against such behaviour with prohibitive coding. However I understand that issue somewhat.

But limpets? Seriously, they can't do no harm.

It would be a very nice QOL feature someday in a minor updated, so ships could keep limpets, so we don't have to sell them in the munition screen first.

A minor gripe. Maybe I am in a whimpy mood today. But this littel thing kept annoying me for months and years now. It had to come out someday.

edit:


On second thought, we can't sell ships to each other, so I don't really see that point. Soemone would have to sell his game-accaunt for this. This wouldn't make much sense, or woud it?
Click to expand...

You need meta-alloys for some Guardian weapon? Pay me on PayPal. I'll friend you then meet me in space just you and me. I'll drop the cargo and you pick it up. Afterwards I'll unfriend you. Simple. That is how it works and I'll never do it.

On the other hand I would fly with a friend showing how to get all the meta-alloys they desire. Thargoids don't always like this so it good to have backup.
 
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Arkadi

Arkadi
Oh, that's how friends do it, without payment involved. Ok, now I get you. Well, hm, it's a pity Frontier has some parental obligations, so kids don't throw away their money for nonsense.
 

IndigoWyrd

IndigoWyrd
Hooplah said:
You need meta-alloys for some Guardian weapon? Pay me on PayPal. I'll friend you then meet me in space just you and me. I'll drop the cargo and you pick it up. Afterwards I'll unfriend you. Simple. That is how it works and I'll never do it.
Click to expand...

Except we actually can do this already. And if you’re genuine scum, you have other friends who are pirates on standby to rob that ship blind, or if you’re the lowest of scum, to just blow them up, right after the transaction is complete.

Human dirt-baggery knows no bounds.
 

Hooplah

Hooplah
IndigoWyrd said:
Except we actually can do this already. And if you’re genuine scum, you have other friends who are pirates on standby to rob that ship blind, or if you’re the lowest of scum, to just blow them up, right after the transaction is complete.

Human dirt-baggery knows no bounds.
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Well being a good guy I do appreciate your version if I was scum with pirates awaiting to collect the meta-alloys. Maybe I should bring my combat Cutter or Corvette and a few friends with engineered torpedoes and missile ships if the destination is known on the Forum. I suggest not knowing the location for any new player wanting a little help. They can PM me. As for you maybe you are the pirate we need to avoid. I look forward to meeting you in another Open play moment.
 
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Stealthie

Stealthie
The most obvious potential exploit, IMO, would be the possibility of just filling cargo ship(s), swapping into a DBX, flying to your destination and then transferring your cargo ship(s) with zero risk.
Course, that could be prevented by making it impossible to transfer a loaded ship.

Personally, I think the biggest hurdle that'd have to be overcome would be tracking cargo between ships.
Right now (IIRC), you can't even take on a cargo mission, eject part of the cargo, pick it up again and then go on to complete the mission.
It'd be a helluva lot more convoluted, attempting to track cargo that's in different ships.
 

IndigoWyrd

IndigoWyrd
Hooplah said:
Well being a good guy I do appreciate your version if I was scum with pirates awaiting to collect the meta-alloys. Maybe I should bring my combat Cutter or Corvette and a few friends with engineered torpedoes and missile ships if the destination is known on the Forum. I suggest not knowing the location for any new player wanting a little help. They can PM me.
Click to expand...

Being a good guy and always expecting the worst from people usually results in me being pleasantly surprised, rather than taken by surprise.

Thing is, only the seller, if nefarious, would need to know where a transaction is taking place, as they could easily communicate this to their friends outside of the game and no one need be any the wiser for it.
 

Krash

Krash
How about just limpets? What's wrong with storing limpets? Would that break the game if I could swap ships and not have to sell off the stinking limpets?
 
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