Krait Phantom Cockpit / Exploration Ships in General (Rework Needed)

I’ve begun to wonder if FDev actually wants people to explore or if it’s just a selling point for the game. I’m not complaining out of hate, it’s out of love for Elite. I’m hooked. Ironically, after buying the game and horizons a few years ago, I stopped playing after A few weeks out of pure frustration. I Revisited the game about a month ago and have already put in over a hundred hours (not probably pushing 200). Again, I’m hooked.

I just can’t understand several design choices that seem to go against what they were intended. Exploration ships are awful.

The AspX (even fully fitted) is a pig. It’s awful to fly, it’s ugly as sin. The only thing that’s good about it is the cockpit (one of the best in the game) and he lvl6 scoop.

The diamondbacks are my favorite ships. While the cockpit is slightly more restricted, both fly beautifully when properly fitted. What should have been done is make the ASPs a small ship and the DBX a Medium. The “scout” ships should have been the entry into the “explorer” versions. Both hold different roles and fit these perfectly, the diamondback being a bubble jumping explorer and the Asp being designed for outside the bubble exploration (in theory at least). Again, making the Asp Scout a small ship, with internals matched accordingly and the DBX a Medium ship with a level 5 slot instead of the second 4th, would have made the exploration ship progression make sense. Why buy a scout ship? They make zero sense. I love the Diamondback scout, but after getting an diamondback explorer it is just a waste of a ship as both are small sized.

There are already so many ships in the game that are just useless, can we please get a rebalance to make it worth buying a bunch of different ships for different roads Instead if of ships just being game progression? This is why you only see people flying the same ships. In the end there is only a few ships worth flying, and it makes the game feel watered down. Once you get these ships, you start to realize ship progression is paper thin with most being fluff. I would have loved to keep my DBS for a different role, but the DBX just does everything the DBS did better. There isn’t a purpose to collect different ships in the game which makes the progression stale, and end up being much quicker than expected. Save up, buy the few ships worth buying, and your done. What’s the point in the rest of the ships? Progression. Nothing more. It doesn’t have to be that way and shouldn’t. Each ship should have a role and purpose other than progression into the “next best thing”.


Now onto the post title. Why. Why is there two blaring white lights shining directly into a pilots face on the Krait. I’m flying the phantom as my exploration ship and those lights are just awful. The entire cockpit is blaring white light. I’m assuming the combat version is the same, which makes even less sense. Can we please get a fix to make those lights red, and the cockpit lighting tinted night vision preserving red instead of go blind white? It makes exploration in this ship awful. It’s just a complete eye sore having those two white lights blaring directly in front of your view out the cockpit, and they illuminate the entire inside of the ship (especially at the top highlight those god awful view blocking engines). The engines blocking the top windows are bad, and this cockpit should have been designed being in the center top (not back and below) of the engines, so they only showed in the view when looking to the side, slightly below the seat, and only 1/3 the side view at most. The view is just awful for an exploration ship.

The DBX has good views, flys great, but awful internals.
The AspX has ok internals, great views, but flys like a pig.
The Phantom has great internals, flys well, but awful views.

Why does frontier hate exploration ships. Maybe thats why only .05 or whatever of the game has been explored. It seems the devs are elitists that frown on exploration, and see mining/training as a way to make money to buy combat ships. Why explore? Unfortunately that’s why I bought the game and my messily combat vs almost maxed exploration ranks prove it. I just feel at this point the devs hate explorers.

Hopefully this will get reworked soon, but I’m not holding my breath.
 

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Some interesting observations, illustrating very well how each of us percieve what is right!
The DBX is an amazing little ship, I've covered a few KLy in one of those (& a T6 too) exploring. But the Phantom maybe 250KLy - and I love the cockpit, particularly in VR. Even the two pods are fine IMO and the view from the cockpit is splendid when coming to land.

Let's hope more explorer ships come out, and they meet some of the failings you have illustrated.
 
Some interesting observations, illustrating very well how each of us percieve what is right!
The DBX is an amazing little ship, I've covered a few KLy in one of those (& a T6 too) exploring. But the Phantom maybe 250KLy - and I love the cockpit, particularly in VR. Even the two pods are fine IMO and the view from the cockpit is splendid when coming to land.

Let's hope more explorer ships come out, and they meet some of the failings you have illustrated.

I could deal with the engine pods. All I’m asking for is those two white lights to be made red or turned off when ship lights are off. Out in the he void they are a bright white eyesore. If you have an asp, switch between the two and you will see my point.

I can’t say enough good things about the diamondbacks. My first and always ship love in elite. Even the smaller scoop is tolerable as long as you stay (-ish) in the bubble and plot scoop-stars only. Scoop every jump and scooping only takes a few seconds, even with the limited class 4A. Property fitted, both run so cold, you have to crash them into a star to make them overheat while scooping. They are the perfect bubble jumping ships, and will go down in history (IMO) as some of best ships in a space game. (The earlier X series games had some nice ships too).


I agree with the point you make about ship progression. It is poor.

Have you tried a Dolphin for exploration? I just got one, it’s pretty sweet.

Yes, I had one fully kited out for passenger missions, which I sold to help fund the krait. Passenger missions got on my nerve, and while the dolphin is a beautiful looking ship, I was looking for something more nimble to land on planets out in the void. I wanted an actual exploration ship. I agree though visually, the dolphin is a pretty ship and looks the part for a passenger ship.

My AspX Has become my mining ship. The views help navigating around the tight space of cracked asteroids, and it had enough hardpoints to set up as a full mining rig. I actually like the aspx as a miner, and will continue to use it in that roll.
 
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I certainly wouldn't gripe if the Krait lights were blue :) (or red) - I forgot to mention that!
If we could twist FD's arm to respray the DBX cockpit to make it less tatty.... My DBX jumps 65Ly on a full tank & 1 SRV, 18% or less heat when out in the black, if it had a 5A scoop.... heaven :)
 
I've got a Dolphin I use for near-Bubble exploration. I love it - it's quiet, the boost sound is... unique... and it has a buttload of internals, making it pretty versatile. Highly recommended.

It’s nimble too. Great for landing in tight canyons to explore POI’s. I’m going to drag it around the universe. I took a 30ly jumping Python to Sag A*, going around in in the 50+ Dolphin will be a breeze.
 
It’s nimble too. Great for landing in tight canyons to explore POI’s. I’m going to drag it around the universe. I took a 30ly jumping Python to Sag A*, going around in in the 50+ Dolphin will be a breeze.

Just keep an eye on your fuel and plot courses using fuel scoop stars only. It only has a level 4 fuel tank, where the diamondback has a level 5. When doing 40+ Ly jumps in my diamondback, I scoop every star as I have found waiting can be trouble if you don’t pay attention. Again, just plot fuel star only jumps and you will be fine. I may buy another dolphin to play around with again at some point as I like the looks and it has a pretty open cockpit.

The small fuel tank in the dolphin prevented me from using it for anything outside the bubble. For the size of the ship and purpose (those needyass passengers never stop requesting unscheduled stops...) it really should be a level 5, not 4 as the smaller one really runs out VERY quickly when you have the thing engineered for 40+ ly jumps.
 
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The engines blocking the top windows are bad, and this cockpit should have been designed being in the center top (not back and below) of the engines, so they only showed in the view when looking to the side, slightly below the seat, and only 1/3 the side view at most. The view is just awful for an exploration ship.

I wonder if you know that you have essentially just described the Anaconda's configuration - which is almost universally hated by Explorers. Because you can't see anything, unless you fly upside down. This would also apply to the Corvette.

The Kraits were specifically designed with Explorers in mind, which is why the cockpits are slightly below the ship. So they can see what's under them while Exploring, and also while landing.

Riôt
 
Love the DBS. It's a bit like a long range Viper. The problem is more that the game doesn't provide any role for it than the ship isn't useful. But I guess we can keep getting development that isn't universal like squadrons and fleet carriers.
 
The console version lighting should move to PC, lights are dull...
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I thought they said there wasn’t a difference between the pc and console versions, but even on the PS4 pro, it looks no where nearly as good. That screen shot looks amazing. The PS4 pro looks about half the resolution, which is obnoxious as the PS4 pro can do 4K gaming and at least 1080p / 60 FPS NOT upscaled if the game is properly optimized. You are 100% correct the lights on the pc in your photo above have far less glare. Still would like them red, but those look far better than the PS4 version. I’m sure most people here commenting about why I think they look so bad are on the pc and don’t have to deal with the glare. Furthermore everything just looks dithered and washed out on the console. I get it’s not a pc but there is obvious lighting differences. Lastly, while they call it a hack, you can change your cockpit hud color which also helps, on the consoles we can’t because they refuse to code it, something that should take one person less than a day to accomplish.

I know exactly what the problem is, elitist developers that play on the PC and only published on consoles to make money. No other reason they haven’t added the option to the consoles. They don’t care because they don’t play on a console. Maybe that’s why they are talking about having to go free to play. I love how these companies shoot themselves in the foot and cry “how did it happen”. Elitist devs that don’t care unless it’s the system they play, the version they use, and the ship they fly. It has happened throughout the history of game development and has been the downfall of many developers. Arrogance, self-centeredness, and the attitude “we know better than our paying customers”.


I wonder if you know that you have essentially just described the Anaconda's configuration - which is almost universally hated by Explorers. Because you can't see anything, unless you fly upside down. This would also apply to the Corvette.

The Kraits were specifically designed with Explorers in mind, which is why the cockpits are slightly below the ship. So they can see what's under them while Exploring, and also while landing.

Riôt

They wouldn’t be a problem where they are now if the engines were placed a few feet back, or the cockpit a few feet forward. There is no good reason the engines are so far forward, especially since the game isn’t realistic when it comes to thrusters and planetary landings. There should be high g planets that under powered thrusters prevent ships from taking off from (ie go to the rebuy screen) but that isn’t the case. The game won’t let you get stuck on a planet, which is unrealistic.

If they aren’t going to model things exactly the way they should work in real life, than we can have ships with thrusters that are not sitting so far forward, which I can only assume is because they were meant to prevent your cockpit from being destroyed in a crash, or that they have to be that big for the thrust needed to stop. Either way they are just there to be annoying. Most of these ships cockpits are purely annoying. I get the “realism” factor which they seem to go for (and I very much appreciate which is why I love elite) however if they want to half bake the realism in some cases, than we can get cockpits that aren’t awful. Pick one, total realism and restrictive cockpits or half baked realism with better views. I’d prefer total realism and unrestricted views, using totally enclosed cockpits that have screens (that use external cameras) built into where the glass would be so we go unrestricted views. This is probably the future anyway!

Why do most of the ships look like flying bricks or pancakes? The sidewinder style ships are ugly as sin, most of the combat ships like the vulture/krait have unnecessary restrictive views due to engine placement, etc. These designs were done on purpose.

Eve Online Ships
X Reunion Ships
Homeworld Ships
Wing Commander Ships
Descent Freespace Ships

There is a dev post asking about going free to play. They are obviously not doing stellar as a company. I’m sure it’s not total Armageddon but if they are asking there is a reason. Don’t be a fanboy, I’m not posting this out of hate I’m posting it out of love. It’s constructive criticism. The ships are mostly ugly as sin; flying bricks and pancakes. Probably more realistic than some games, as space ships of the future will probably not look like fighter advanced modern 5th gen fighter jets we see today, but if they aren’t going to model every aspect of the game 100% realistic, than they can back off with the garbage looking ships and overly obstructive cockpits. I have heard people say before “the ships in elite look awful and have terrible cockpits”. If they are asking how to get more players into the game, it’s not a bad start. What’s even worse is many ships have the exact same or very similar (awful) cockpits.

Realistically speaking, most futuristic space ships won’t have cockpit windows, and will be flown looking at a computer screen with an outside camera view. They modeled this perfect in the TV rendition of the book “the expanse” (side note so glad Jeff Bezos was a fan and bought the show; much bigger budget on Amazon!). Is that what you want to see in elite, looking at a character looking at a computer screen displaying an outside view? No, I hope not. Than they can stop going for 100% realism with ship cockpits because none of these are realistic. That being the case they shouldn’t be terrible in the name of realism.

I’m just saying it out of love. Do you want to see it go free to play? No, none of us do. So constructive criticism is far better than fanboyism.

I wish there was an option to turn off all the cockpit lights regardless of ship make/model.

That would be amazing. They already have the ability to turn off/on external lights, why not inside.
 
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Please point me to where this discussion is happening.

Riôt


Post here on the forums regarding free to play.

Edit, earlier today that was pinned and I’m positive had the black dev logo. I found it by clicking on the “developer posts” under search when I was looking for updates on the September update.

I am positive I found it clicking by clicking staff and developer posts in the upper right hand corner of the screen.

Edit 2. Yep. See screen shot attached.
 

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Another that loves the DBX. I practically use it every time I'm doing something my other ships aren't capable of doing, even though my other ships probably would do a better job.

Its sound is amazing, it has a HIGH range, the second best, before the anaconda. internals are great, but it could use a size 5 internal, or make it possible to stack fuel scoops. Speed is decent, it might need an upgrade if it was supposed to be used in combat (playing around with coriolis, the DBX is tough to make efficient for combat). Hardpoints are excellent. The view is not very limited, though I would like to see below my cockpit. Paint jobs are limited, I would like to see more, but I use midnight black.

I love this ship. Especially becauseit's small, and is a good all rounder, except for trading, it doesn't have good internals for that. Let alone mining
 
Post here on the forums regarding free to play.

Edit, earlier today that was pinned and I’m positive had the black dev logo. I found it by clicking on the “developer posts” under search when I was looking for updates on the September update.

I am positive I found it clicking by clicking staff and developer posts in the upper right hand corner of the screen.

Edit 2. Yep. See screen shot attached.

Where in that thread is there anyone from Frontier asking about moving the game to a FTP model?
Where in that thread is Frontier "discussing it?"

That is a thread started by a random person on the Internet, responded to by other random people on the Internet, talking about whether or not the game should go to a FTP model. The only post by anyone actually representing Frontier states that there are currently no plans to move Elite to a FTP model...which is the opposite of what you claim.

Please tell me you have something else - if not, then I must say that your reading comprehension is questionable, and it is causing you to come to conclusions that are grossly incorrect. Regarding one such conclusion - last time I checked, Frontier was actually doing quite well indeed.

Riôt
 
Another that loves the DBX. I practically use it every time I'm doing something my other ships aren't capable of doing, even though my other ships probably would do a better job.

Its sound is amazing, it has a HIGH range, the second best, before the anaconda. internals are great, but it could use a size 5 internal, or make it possible to stack fuel scoops. Speed is decent, it might need an upgrade if it was supposed to be used in combat (playing around with coriolis, the DBX is tough to make efficient for combat). Hardpoints are excellent. The view is not very limited, though I would like to see below my cockpit. Paint jobs are limited, I would like to see more, but I use midnight black.

I love this ship. Especially becauseit's small, and is a good all rounder, except for trading, it doesn't have good internals for that. Let alone mining

It really is an amazing ship. The scout is a great data mission runner too. I use it for ceos / sothis data runs when I need to bang out a quick 20 million just to have money for rebuys / repairs / restocks after my funds get low. I leave one parked at ceos for that exact reason. It’s the ship I’m never going to sell. Cheep rebuy, fun to fly and fits the data running role perfectly. Perfect little ship. My DB explorer again is my bubble runner. 40 ly jump after minimal engineering even fully fitted, runs soooo cold, scoop is slow but as long as you scoop each Star you’re not waiting too long. It’s an amazing ship. It’s just not something I would take to beagle. Yes, it can make it, but it’s a stretch.
 
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