That’s their problem. They’re more interested in cherry-picking than actual thorough exploration.
Could or should Frontier enhance the FSS or add in and incorporate an optional ADS-like expansion module?
- Thread starter WR3ND
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Care to explain how you jumped to that conclusion? Iv said it before in one or other of these threads that if i scanned a single planet it was usual for me to scan them all, unless there was clearly some kind of tagging convention in place in which case i would only take one. I used EDDiscovery aswell so my words can be checked, i have many many completed systems of the kind that most people would have no interest in at all. Its wrong to try and cast people who used the ADS as cherry pickers or really any other lable at all because it simply doesnt fit.
Once a FSS/ADS poster, always a FSS/ADS poster.
If it's the one that lasted above 100 pages then yes.
For the record, the FSS made cherry-picking far easier for commonly sought-after bodies, then again, exploration has an element of cherrypicking.
So we’re agreed then. We don’t want the ADS functionality in the FSS.
Everyone would be much happier with it as a separate entirely optional module.
If you enter a system and say “No, not that one”, you’re cherry-picking. Pretty straightforward concept.
Cherry picking systems? I guess yeah, i dont think its a very good argument tho.
Honestly, reading such threads makes me feel like folks are missing the forest for the trees. I'd say that instead of the points that people are arguing about, the main problem is that body identification isn't good gameplay when there's next to nothing after it. It would be much better to have more gameplay with planets and space phenomena, rather than overhauling old tools for the old stuff again. In my opinion, the ADS was a simple, fast placeholder, and the FSS is a rushed, bolted-on minigame to give dead simple gameplay where none was needed, instead of adding more complex gameplay where it is still needed.
But well, here we are, and we don't even know if the "New Era" will even have anything for exploration. Until then, the reason why these ADS-FSS tug-of-wars keep going on are because people no longer expect Frontier to put in anything except the minimum possible effort (if even that). If they ever did more than that, then there could be plenty of good solutions which could satisfy all interests and lay this whole thing to rest. All of them would involve more than a minimal effort though.
Then there are the bugs.
But well, here we are, and we don't even know if the "New Era" will even have anything for exploration. Until then, the reason why these ADS-FSS tug-of-wars keep going on are because people no longer expect Frontier to put in anything except the minimum possible effort (if even that). If they ever did more than that, then there could be plenty of good solutions which could satisfy all interests and lay this whole thing to rest. All of them would involve more than a minimal effort though.
Well, yes. I barely ever played Elite with KB/M (nor gamepad), but going from HOTAS to KB/M for the FSS is much quicker, but it feels terrible. Even that on its own is bad enough.
This has been examined in detail a lot of times, so let me just do the nutshell version. We used to have more information about systems on the first glance, looking up the system map didn't interrupt the flow of travel, the visuals were much better - you saw the galaxy as it was, not with a blue tint and a grid overlaid -, you had a realistic chance of finding rare things and configurations which would take far longer now (how many here have fully scanned tens of thousands of systems with the FSS?), you looked at how planets look to identify them, and not at positions of squiggly lines on a barcode.
Then there are the bugs.
Oh, but they certainly haven't been working on it for a year. More like a couple of months. The plans for the FSS, after the focused feedback section on exploration having been delayed for months - and then only cut down to a single thread - were shown on Sep. 12, and that only had concept art in it. Actual gameplay footage was only shown over a month later, on Oct. 18. The beta was out on Oct. 30, and the FSS was in a terrible state then, especially in VR. So yeah, it was delayed and then rushed.
With luck this one won't run so long then
Im not trying to be funny or disrespectful. Imagine what they might come up with... better the devil you know.
If this got changed once it doesnt seem likely it would be changed again any time soon after so it would have to be what people actually want. Think carefully
Edit: i mean, old ADS but many more things to find.... how could that go wrong?
It’s very much the point though, but when there are 400 Billion systems, a method to quickly assess which ones are interesting does seem pretty useful.
The point being that with the ADS, you’d very quickly pass over bog standard systems with say just 6 Ice Planets.
Obviously, it’s just as easy to do that with the FSS waveform and I’m sure many systems are getting bypassed if they only show Icys on the waveform.
But you chance risking missing something truly unique.
What if those 6 Icys are in a single complex planetary arrangement.
Say a binary pair each with binary moons.
So yup, being able to cherry pick systems is a good thing.
When somebody says "cherry picking" i always thought it meant taking the EL WW ect and possibly the HMCs and leaving the rest. I dont see why cherry picking a system could even be described as a bad thing. The alternative is complete every system you land in. Occasionally even i couldnt be bothered and just travelled on.
That's not what I said. Please don't put words in my mouth.
No I don't want the ADS back in the game. I want enhancements to the current system.
I agree completely. The exploration "update" completely missed the mark, by completely failing to address exploration's real issue. All it did was delay the start of exploration, while exploration itself is still as empty and devoid of content and interesting gameplay as before. No FSS improvements or tweaks are ever going to change this, because body identification was never the real issue. Exploration was a car without engine, and all FD did was change the tires.
Yes I realise, I worded my post badly. currently we have to break out of the cockpit to a separate mode, and from there play AM radio. It would be far more interesting if one could scan and search from the cockpit directly, using the hud itself. I realise it’s probably easier said than done, but we’re talking concepts here
You didn’t say anything about not wanting the ADS in the game in that post.
You said you don’t want the ADS functionality as part of the FSS.
I’m in total agreement with that and have no desire to ruin your FSS experience by putting it there.
A separate module wouldn’t do that so we’d all be just fine doing our own thing.
So you want the ADS functionality in the FSS?
To me, the arguments about 'cherry picking' are irrelevant.
Firstly, there's nothing wrong with it. Since the galaxy is still less than 1% explored (and will probably never be more than a few percent explored - ever), the idea that one should 'investigate' every single system that one drops into just because is daft, no-one in their right mind would do that for very long, so cherry picking on the system level is a very good idea.
Secondly, cherry picking on the body level is frankly also fine. As it happens, in the old system I didn't do it, purely for roleplay reasons. As to genuine body rarity, well I suspect that there are probably tens, if not hundreds of billions of ELW's out there, and many more WW's, so to suggest they are truly rare seems a bit of a stretch. Plenty for everybody to discover, if that's what you're after.
In any case, identifying such bodies in either system is easy. I'd say it's actually easier and more definitive with the energy spectrum, but that's my personal feeling (and experience). As to cherry picking those bodies using the FSS, honestly it's hardly worth it. Ok, if you find a system with a hundred bodies including one very remote ELW then it might be worth just trying to find that one body using the FSS (you could save yourself 10 minutes), but in a system with only 20 or so bodies, might just as well scan the whole system, that'll still take less time than scanning that one body using the old process.
So the FSS for my playstyle is way better, as i am no explorer.
I can still select USS and scan them in SC without resorting to the FSS,
i can also use the FSS to pinpoint valuable USSes for HGEs or such.
When i was out exploring and testing the FSS i liked the utility it adds,
removing the necessity to fly to each body and be close for the old DSS
to work.
IMO the FSS is a good toolbox to further elaborate on,
i am no fan of module creep, but i could see the use of
passive modes, allowing you to automatically resolve
distress calls in the vicinity.
The old ADS was no joy, the FSS combines the ADS functionality and
the old DSS, that is way better and enables more players to exploration,
without requiring a specced fitting.
So far, dear OP, i am unsure how the FSS could evolve further,
as gameplay for every job is stale and lacks complexity.
I'd treat the FSS as what it is, a tool. Exploration is a task.
I can still select USS and scan them in SC without resorting to the FSS,
i can also use the FSS to pinpoint valuable USSes for HGEs or such.
When i was out exploring and testing the FSS i liked the utility it adds,
removing the necessity to fly to each body and be close for the old DSS
to work.
IMO the FSS is a good toolbox to further elaborate on,
i am no fan of module creep, but i could see the use of
passive modes, allowing you to automatically resolve
distress calls in the vicinity.
The old ADS was no joy, the FSS combines the ADS functionality and
the old DSS, that is way better and enables more players to exploration,
without requiring a specced fitting.
So far, dear OP, i am unsure how the FSS could evolve further,
as gameplay for every job is stale and lacks complexity.
I'd treat the FSS as what it is, a tool. Exploration is a task.
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