About the new proposal on how the FSS should show more efficiently info about planet POI's

[VR SenseiMatty]

FSS: Long delay when scanning planets with geological sites

• As it currently stands, in order for the geological/biological sites to be placed on the surface, the entire stellar body must be fully generated (we then know the topography and can place sites where they will be accessible). This can take tens of seconds.
• As part of the January Update, we aim to address this with an alternative process. We have run tests on thousands of in-game planetary bodies and by using this data, we're able to extrapolate the likelihood of geological/biologic sites being present on similar stellar bodies. We then use this data and indicate if the planet is ‘Unlikely’, ‘Likely’, or ‘Very Likely’ to have a geological/biological sites.
• It is not 100% guaranteed that there will be a geological/biological site on the planetary body, but does give commanders a much faster indication of probability. This will enable commanders to quickly ascertain if the planet's worth a visit.
• As this is an alternative way to display information, we would love to hear your feedback on it to determine whether or not it is better than the current process.
• Please note: this will not affect Thargoid or Guardian sites, which will show up instantaneously.

Here is my feedback and alternate proposals:
Fly to a planet without being sure of what we'll find is a step back @Stephen Benedetti, the FSS was introduced to avoid loss of time and players are now complaining about the long loading time, so a solution the forces us to go to such planets and maybe find out that there's nothing interesting is an even bigger waste of time.

We need a solution that allows the system to take the time to generate info and at the same time the player is not forced to watch the screen and can continue to scan the star system or do something else like fuel scooping for example.

FDEV proposed solution is not complete garbage.. I would rework it as one of the following alternative solutions suggested by me and other CMDR's that gave their feedback to this thread:


ALTERNATIVE 1:
1. Immediately show if it's ‘Unlikely’, ‘Likely’ or ‘Very Likely’ (as you presented)
2. Only when the CMDR has completed the scan of the system and the game has generated all planets surface info, the ship computer sends a message in the COMM panel (Up-Left UI) with a list of the planets with confirmed surface POI's. If no planet has POI's the message will inform about the negative result.
This message should be generated only when there is at least a ‘Likely’ or ‘Very Likely’ planet in the system. If they are all unlikely no message should be generated.


ALTERNATIVE 2:
1. Immediately show if it's ‘Unlikely’, ‘Likely’ or ‘Very Likely’ (as you presented)
2. Create a new tab in the navigation menu (left UI) where all ‘Likely’ or ‘Very Likely’ planets are listed. This page is very simple... Body name and type of surface POI. If no POI, the planet is removed from the list and not shown anymore.
3. So the CMDR can continue the scan with the FSS and review this information later while the game generates the surface data required.
4. When the generation of the planets is complete, the information about Geo/Biological POI's is updated in this new navigation tab for the CMDR to be reviewed, so we don't need to go back into the FSS and remember which planet we have to check again.


ALTERNATIVE 3: Suggested by @Kzak
Keep the current system with the loading time, but the FSS should mark and highlight planets that likely have geo/biological signals. So during the surface generation loading time the player can continue the system scan in the FSS and go back to check these planets again later without the need to memorize all of them.


ALTERNATIVE 4: Suggested by @Drelthar
Keep the basic scanning as it is and add a new simple game mechanic that takes place when a planet is likely to have POI's. This new game loop gives the time to the FSS to generate the planet information and allow the players to discover by themselves if the planet has or not POI's and what type.


ALTERNATIVE 5: Suggested by @Gauntlet
Keep the current system and add a graphical identification to all planets that have bio/gelological POI's in the system map once they have been scanned and resolved. Something similar to the blue circle that identifies the landable planet. It could be a specific symbol for the biological POI and another one for the geological one.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

Ooo... tens of seconds... wow...

Maybe it's just me, but this hasn't bothered me up to nearly half-way around the rim of the galaxy.

I just don't seem to mind that it takes a little time for topography and geology to be generated, in fact, it makes it somewhat believable that this information actually takes a few (tens) of seconds. However, I suppose I'll be even less bothered by it taking even less time, but it seems, at least to me, that we already know if a body does or does not contain geological or biological sites long before we actually reach the planet - this is shown during the initial FSS scan.

The proposed change would fall where here? During the initial FSS scan where sites are indicated? Somewhere else? I do agree, it would be more of an annoyance to have a body labeled "Very Likely" only to prove to have no sites when I get there, especially if it is a particularly empty body. That was one of my largest turn-offs with the old style Exploration, so much wasted time to find nothing.

 

[Kzak]

AFAIK it already works like that - you can use the FSS to zoom in on a planet, starting the generation process to see if there's POIs there, and you are free to check other planets in the meantime, starting the generation process for them as well, then return to the first planet and see if it has anything interesting.

 

[Babellon]

I would be most happy if they'd fix the scan scope bouncing away from objects I'm trying to scan and the spontaneous rotation of the overlay while I'm moving the scope to a object.
Having it tell me the results of the scan faster, cool, but if I'm fighting with random rotation and bouncy scope 'faster resolution' isn't going to make it better. All 3 would be just perfect.

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

AFAIK it already works like that - you can use the FSS to zoom in on a planet, starting the generation process to see if there's POIs there, and you are free to check other planets in the meantime, starting the generation process for them as well, then return to the first planet and see if it has anything interesting.

You have to remember which planets and check those again later in the fss. I find it a bit annoying

 

[Kzak]

You have to remember which planets and check those again later in the fss. I find it a bit annoying

If the planets are properly marked with the probability of POIs sorted on type, it should be less of a hassle. Not a perfect solution, but better than what we have now.

 

[dannysquid]

Might it be better to keep it the same but give you something to look at while it's happening? I find the FSS a bit visually dull, so having lots of motion graphics happening as the planet is scanned -- topography detail increasing, ice caps indicated, highest mountains/deepest canyons listed etc... might make it feel like less of a drag to wait.

 

[Mengy]

I agree that Frontier's proposed solution of marking a planet "unlikely, likely, or very likely" is not a good change. The entire point of the new FSS was to give us more detailed information so we could make better decisions, but FD's proposal would take us back to NEEDING to fly up to a planet and now launch probes just to find out if the planet is interesting or not.

Not acceptable, IMHO.

We need a third alternative, or in if lacking that then just leave the long scan times in place. I'd rather have more info available than less.

OR like Kzak mentions above, mark the planets with POI's better so we can go back and check them out in the FSS to see what the POI's are. Currently I write them down on paper while I continue using the FSS (so I'm not sitting there watching a spinning wheel for 20 seconds).

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

If the planets are properly marked with the probability of POIs sorted on type, it should be less of a hassle. Not a perfect solution, but better than what we have now.

Yes it could be a third alternate. I will add it later to the OP I'm on phone right now

 

[Bob McBobblehead]

I would just keep what FDev have suggested and add an extra level of zoom that would initiate how the current geological scans work.
Zoom into planet, get the unlikely, likely and very likely instant result, then the player can decided to zoom in again to initiate a proper a long scan or zoom out.

 

[Red Anders]

I'm fine with FDev's proposed solution. After almost chewing my face off in a system with 70-odd bodies, anything would be a significant improvement on the current system.

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

I'm fine with FDev's proposed solution. After almost chewing my face off in a system with 70-odd bodies, anything would be a significant improvement on the current system.

70 bodies would be a nightmare with the new fdev suggested system. Imagine that 15 out of 70 bodies are likely. Of these 15, 2 have bios and 3 have geos. The remaining 10 have nothing. But you don't know anything about any of them until you fly there. Will you really fly to all 15 to find it out?

 

[Masta Squidge]

Am I the only one here that took it to mean it would quickly report that, then allow you to remain looking at the planet to finish the scan (if its "likely")?

Like, they literally didn't say it would revert to needing to fly to the planet.

 

[Mengy]

Am I the only one here that took it to mean it would quickly report that, then allow you to remain looking at the planet to finish the scan (if its "likely")?

Like, they literally didn't say it would revert to needing to fly to the planet.

No, Stephen literally stated in another post how the new system would replace the current one, no more FSS scan at all. Under the new mechanic you would need to fly to and probe every planet to tell for certain whether or not it had any surface POI's on it.

 

[Stealthie]

I propose that they get the current system working properly.

As has been said, the sole purpose of the current system is to remove the need to physically visit planets to find out what's there.
Any alteration which forced players to visit planets would completely undermine the purpose of changing from the disco' scanner to the FSS.

It's kind of worrying that FDev seem to need this explaining to them.

 

[myothershipisacobraiv]

I think they want to get rid of the generation process and either run it after you've finished probing the planet or run it during the probing process. This kills the framerate hitches that can result from scanning lots of moons with geo sites really fast.

As far as I understand things, now it just does a quick statistical check in the FSS, and spits out the traffic light.

I possibly don't care about losing the number in the FSS as long as I don't lose the composition scan in the FSS. Sometimes you're looking for Antimony or something and if you see a world that has 4.0% Antimony, you want to see if it's got 45 geological sites.

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

Am I the only one here that took it to mean it would quickly report that, then allow you to remain looking at the planet to finish the scan (if its "likely")?
Like, they literally didn't say it would revert to needing to fly to the planet.

No, he didn't say that...
He actually said this:

This approximation will help to identify the likeliness of the geological/biological site, but for a full confirmation, you will have to get closer to the planetary body and scan it using planetary probes.

 

[Deleted member 38366]

The possibly smartest solution IMHO :

All required Body Info on a Target System is being preemptively de-seeded & cached as soon as a Hyperjump into another System is initiated.

Upon entering the System, FSS is already able to display instant Data on most Bodies, only bodies remaining can require a few additional Seconds.
Performance is maintained by limiting the de-seeding process to a sensible limit of parallel Operations (only a factor for Systems with alot of Volcanism)

This already yields a minimum of nearly 20+ Seconds of free time that can be utilized.
Surplus time is gained after arrival, possible Fuel Scooping and usually during initial FSS Operations.

-------------

That is the equivalent of triggering the start of the time-consuming de-seeding via FSS during the earliest possible moment already.
Even when not all Data has been obtained by the moment the CMDR has arrived in the new System, opened the FSS and hit the first Body with Geologicals, the process to attain the data has already started.

This has the benefit of still getting all Data as fast as possible while still getting precise Information instead of creating "Thanks for flying 515.959Ls and mapping this Body - but sadly there's nothing here. Please try again elsewhere." moments.

I'd personally 100% prefer the reliable Data over what will ultimately feel like RNG (or like a 100.000+ Ls lottery). Yep, definitely wouldn't want that.

 

[Mengy]

It's kind of worrying that FDev seem to need this explaining to them.

Honestly I'm a bit shocked they proposed this change at all. It makes me wonder whether or not FD really understands the exploration gameplay loop.

I'm also a bit surprised so many people seem to like the proposal. To me it seems so much incredibly worse. Like bad enough to make me consider giving up Elite exploration, that's how much I dislike it.

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

Honestly I'm a bit shocked they proposed this change at all. It makes me wonder whether or not FD really understands the exploration gameplay loop.

I'm also a bit surprised so many people seem to like the proposal. To me it seems so much incredibly worse. Like bad enough to make me consider giving up Elite exploration, that's how much I dislike it.

Finding rare biological evidence on planet is already difficult and rare (except for the more common Bark Moud). If I have to visit each planet in search of it I will also simply give up
Considering also that many of these are on gas giant moons that are many in numbers and it's very time consuming to visit all because of the big gravity well of the gas giant.