ANNOUNCEMENT January Update - Beta Announcement

[Pralines]

Every planet that I've found thathas geological features has volcanic activity. Every single one for almost 4 years. I've never found a planet w/o volcanic activity to have geological features. You don't have to map a planet to see if it has volcanic activity. Only to find the geological feature itself. After blowing the horn, I usually take a quick glance at the system map and find the volcanic ones that are landable.

every planet with geo has volcanism
but
every planet with volcanism doesn't necessary have geo...

edit : i may have concluded too fast
i have to check if all landable + volcanism ----> always GEO presence,
i doubt it's that simple, because otherwise, FDev wouldn't propose to display probabilities of GEO (if even them can't be certain, how could we...)

 

[Turd Ferguson]

every planet with geo has volcanism
but
every planet with volcanism doesn't necessary have geo...

edit : i may have concluded too fast
i have to check if all landable + volcanism ----> always GEO presence,
i doubt it's that simple, because otherwise, FDev wouldn't propose to display probabilities of GEO (if even them can't be certain, how could we...)

If your intention is to check if ALL planets with volcanism have Geo sites that could take a while...especially if you’re right.

 

[Han Zulu]

​

FSS: Long delay when scanning planets with geological sites

• As it currently stands, in order for the geological/biological sites to be placed on the surface, the entire stellar body must be fully generated (we then know the topography and can place sites where they will be accessible). This can take tens of seconds.
• As part of the January Update, we aim to address this with an alternative process. We have run tests on thousands of in-game planetary bodies and by using this data, we're able to extrapolate the likelihood of geological/biologic sites being present on similar stellar bodies. We then use this data and indicate if the planet is ‘Unlikely’, ‘Likely’, or ‘Very Likely’ to have a geological/biological sites.
• It is not 100% guaranteed that there will be a geological/biological site on the planetary body, but does give commanders a much faster indication of probability. This will enable commanders to quickly ascertain if the planet's worth a visit.
• As this is an alternative way to display information, we would love to hear your feedback on it to determine whether or not it is better than the current process.
• Please note: this will not affect Thargoid or Guardian sites, which will show up instantaneously.

Sounds good to me.

The FSS stats will still show if a planet has volcanic and geyser activity though?

And how to get the locations, I assume you have to use the detailed scan with the probes at the planet?

 

[Han Zulu]

Every planet that I've found thathas geological features has volcanic activity. Every single one for almost 4 years. I've never found a planet w/o volcanic activity to have geological features. You don't have to map a planet to see if it has volcanic activity. Only to find the geological feature itself. After blowing the horn, I usually take a quick glance at the system map and find the volcanic ones that are landable.

Right. Every planet I've found with geo sites have some form of volcanic activity, while not every volcanic has geo sites.

 

[Junagu]

To add my thrupenny bit to the FSS scanner - it's seemed to me with ED and the way that the stellar forge works that, apart from the bespoke locations, all systems are only held as potential - with only such things as the star class contained in the database until a system is discovered by a CMDR. In a way the ED galaxy/universe can be considered in the same sense as cryptocurrency mining. Exploration adds to the overall value of the game-world. When the detail of a system is being investigated it is not unreasonable to expect, imho, that there will be some delay whilst the data is "mined-out" as it were. It's not particularly realistic but in terms of the gameworld there's whole planets being generated and "fixed" into the virtual-cosmos and a few seconds is not that bad a pay-off. From my point of view the kind of player who finds this so irksome that they want to quit might want to reappraise their expectations and motivations which have a whiff of greed about them. Fine to play a greedy CMDR in the game but the porous membrane that divides the game from RL seems to have been punctured in an awful lot of cases and that leads to the debasement of the game for everyone.

 

[Han Zulu]

To add my thrupenny bit to the FSS scanner - it's seemed to me with ED and the way that the stellar forge works that, apart from the bespoke locations, all systems are only held as potential - with only such things as the star class contained in the database until a system is discovered by a CMDR. In a way the ED galaxy/universe can be considered in the same sense as cryptocurrency mining. Exploration adds to the overall value of the game-world. When the detail of a system is being investigated it is not unreasonable to expect, imho, that there will be some delay whilst the data is "mined-out" as it were. It's not particularly realistic but in terms of the gameworld there's whole planets being generated and "fixed" into the virtual-cosmos and a few seconds is not that bad a pay-off. From my point of view the kind of player who finds this so irksome that they want to quit might want to reappraise their expectations and motivations which have a whiff of greed about them. Fine to play a greedy CMDR in the game but the porous membrane that divides the game from RL seems to have been punctured in an awful lot of cases and that leads to the debasement of the game for everyone.

It's not just a few seconds in total, but sometimes 10-20 seconds per planet. Some weeks ago, I was scanning a large system with 60-70 planets and it really gets on the nerves when you have to put a scan on a planet, go and brew some coffee, come back and get the next planet, go and do dishes, come back and scan next planet and go and feed the dogs... And it doesn't pay anything extra to know that there are 23 geological sites and 5 biological on a planet.

Actually, it would make more sense if the FSS just says "anomaly found" or something, and the DSS is to get a detailed scan of the locations and what it is. Right now, the DSS is only to make extra credits but have no function in the game. And it would be just as useful to know from the FSS that a planet is interesting. No need to know how many locations of POIs from it. That's something the DSS should produce, IMO.

 

[Junagu]

It's not just a few seconds in total, but sometimes 10-20 seconds per planet. Some weeks ago, I was scanning a large system with 60-70 planets and it really gets on the nerves when you have to put a scan on a planet, go and brew some coffee, come back and get the next planet, go and do dishes, come back and scan next planet and go and feed the dogs... And it doesn't pay anything extra to know that there are 23 geological sites and 5 biological on a planet.

Actually, it would make more sense if the FSS just says "anomaly found" or something, and the DSS is to get a detailed scan of the locations and what it is. Right now, the DSS is only to make extra credits but have no function in the game. And it would be just as useful to know from the FSS that a planet is interesting. No need to know how many locations of POIs from it. That's something the DSS should produce, IMO.

I've had it work slowly myself and in large systems it does begin to grate but only when I'm locked in to "the grind" in which case we're getting on to other topics, really. I know what you are saying, I think, but would err on the side of immersion/realism - or in other words, if there is any semblance of simulation going on then I'm not expecting to be able to fully discover and map 100s of systems in an afternoon, including all the many lightyears of travel done. It's barmy. I think there's a lot to be said for slowing everything down quite considerably, myself.

 

[Langhorne]

After a few trips into the black, my experience has me wondering why there needs to be any change at all. If the scan was completed in a second or two, then I knew the planet was devoid of both geologicals and biologicals. If the scan kept going, then I knew one or the other (or both) existed on the planet. And, if I was planning to log either one or both, I'd finish the scan. Otherwise, I'd simply start scanning the next planet. The newly proposed method actually gives me the same information I already get from a quick scan while restricting my ability to get the in-depth scan when and if I want it.

 

[Han Zulu]

I've had it work slowly myself and in large systems it does begin to grate but only when I'm locked in to "the grind" in which case we're getting on to other topics, really. I know what you are saying, I think, but would err on the side of immersion/realism - or in other words, if there is any semblance of simulation going on then I'm not expecting to be able to fully discover and map 100s of systems in an afternoon, including all the many lightyears of travel done. It's barmy. I think there's a lot to be said for slowing everything down quite considerably, myself.

Not sure if we agree or disagree.

Just to be clear and there's no misunderstanding, I don't mind it taking time to do things, but I'd like to play the game and take the time, instead of starting background processes I'm forced to wait for. In other words, instead of taking time having the FSS doing the POI scan that hogs CPU, taking time flying to a planet and do a DSS is better. I rather do something and use the time and not have the game play the "hourglass game" to itself while I'm baking or feeding dogs. So flying to a planet and do a DSS, good time waster because it's game play. While zooming in and waiting for a CPU process to finish in the FSS while I watch TV, not a good time waster, since I start process, leave game, forget about game until evening and log out instead of playing it.

 

[Han Zulu]

After a few trips into the black, my experience has me wondering why there needs to be any change at all. If the scan was completed in a second or two, then I knew the planet was devoid of both geologicals and biologicals. If the scan kept going, then I knew one or the other (or both) existed on the planet. And, if I was planning to log either one or both, I'd finish the scan. Otherwise, I'd simply start scanning the next planet. The newly proposed method actually gives me the same information I already get from a quick scan while restricting my ability to get the in-depth scan when and if I want it.

You have a good enough computer. During the distant world 2 journey, I got so frustrated with how slow it was. My computer isn't the fastest or have the best GPU, so it does work harder to resolve this magical numbers in the FSS. A single planet scan took sometimes close to 30 seconds. Doing a system of 50 planets was pretty much the whole morning. I gave up and stopped using it. And what was worse, just zooming in and then out and hopefully skipping the scan resolve process, didn't work, it still runs in the background apparently and slowed the rest of the work quite a bit. So I learned there were ways of speeding it up by doing some tweaks in the settings, and now it's down to 5-10 seconds. Not bad. But currently, I'm sitting here on the forum instead of playing the game because I just finished one big system today, and then get so tired of waiting that I logged out and joined the forum again. When it's more interesting to post on the forum than to actually play the game... oh, well. There are other games I guess.

Now I have to go and do some stuff in the house. Maybe I'll do another jump and scan one other system later today, if I have time...

 

[Deleted member 38366]

On the FSS/Geological proposed changes :

Could we get some Data as to which numerical Probability is indicated by each term? (long thread, if they were posted already please point me to it)

Something like :
Unlikely = 0-30%
Likely = 31-70%
Very Likely = 71-100%

That might help knowing before the Beta launches, so Players know what to expect - and what the terms really indicate when it comes to "how likely is it now to find something or not?".

 

[Han Zulu]

And maybe the planet stats in the system map could also give the probability? So if there are several planets you're interesting in, they're easy to find in the sysmap. Or temporary markers you can set from the FSS.

 

[Pralines]

And maybe the planet stats in the system map could also give the probability? So if there are several planets you're interesting in, they're easy to find in the sysmap. Or temporary markers you can set from the FSS.

if the process runs in the background, the system map could show the real numbers at the end (no need for probabilities)

 

[Pralines]

So I learned there were ways of speeding it up by doing some tweaks in the settings, and now it's down to 5-10 seconds. Not bad

what kind of tweaks ?
the no limit on the fps/vsync or something in the xml config files ?

 

[Han Zulu]

if the process runs in the background, the system map could show the real numbers at the end (no need for probabilities)

Running in the background creates problems on my computer. It slows down the rest of the work. Moving the cursor to the other planets to zoom in becomes extremely jerky and skittish when I zoom out from an ongoing scan. So, no, don't like that. It does it now, and it's even more annoying than to wait out the scan.

The only way is to have Frontier servers do the "scan" and then send the result.

 

[Han Zulu]

what kind of tweaks ?
the no limit on the fps/vsync or something in the xml config files ?

Yeah, the fps, vsync, and I think there was some other things too, but don't ask me exactly what because I just followed some recommendations and it got a little better. Still, any delay beyond 3 seconds is too much in internet standards.

 

[Pralines]

Running in the background creates problems on my computer. It slows down the rest of the work. Moving the cursor to the other planets to zoom in becomes extremely jerky and skittish when I zoom out from an ongoing scan. So, no, don't like that. It does it now, and it's even more annoying than to wait out the scan.

The only way is to have Frontier servers do the "scan" and then send the result.

in your case, the change proposed by FDev is the best solution,
to satisfy everybody, the scan should propose 2 options : rapide, estimated probabilities or slower complete scan
but i'am a dreamer...

 

[Han Zulu]

in your case, the change proposed by FDev is the best solution,

Probably not the best solutions, but it's better. Better would be that it says that there either is or isn't something to find on the planet. Not a huge fan of probability. It could be "nothing" or "geological locations found" or "biological anomaly found". Not some "38.7% chance of rain in the afternoon... maybe" I rather have, either there is, or there isn't something to be found.

to satisfy everybody, the scan should propose 2 options : rapide, estimated probabilities or slower complete scan
but i'am a dreamer...

Slower complete scan? You mean bring back the ADS, but having a button you click and it scans the system for 30 minutes and you get everything? Just click, leave the game and do something else, come back and it's done. Jump to next system, click, leave do laundry, come back and it's done. Jump, click, cook dinner. Jump click, go shopping... Not sure if that's a game we all want to play... because that's a game that mostly plays itself.

 

[CMDR Zedominus]

Please fix the double interdiction bug when in a wing. The only workaround for this is dropping out when you get the message over comms that you're about to be interdicted and then hope the pirate that's after you drops in to attack you. Please look into this.

 

[Burke]

You mean bring back the ADS, but having a button you click and it scans the system for 30 minutes and you get everything? Just click, leave the game and do something else, come back and it's done. Jump to next system, click, leave do laundry, come back and it's done. Jump, click, cook dinner. Jump click, go shopping... Not sure if that's a game we all want to play... because that's a game that mostly plays itself.

Firstly stop trying to link that narrative to the ADS. The ADS as a tool made exploration work, its removal has hamstrung the game that many enjoyed. If you cant connect with that its ok but dont smear the ADS if you dont understand what people used to use it for. Secondly, its cool that not everybody wants to play that game. Options and choices and different opinions are good, but try to remember that not everybody wants to play the FSS either. Common sense would have suggested having both options in the game (and 1 year on the FSS is clearly not part of any deeper or more exciting mechanic so there is no excuse) but experienced developers knew better and chose to not only split the community but do so on a adapt or leave basis. Now i personally still hope that eventually something might be done about this and posts like yours are somewhat unhelpful, especially as a passing dev might read it and think it was true.