Change Imperial hammers to instant fire.

Noobilite

Noobilite
Make imperial hammers so they fire the moment you click the button for snap shotting. This could make them very useful over the normal Rail guns. I thought before I got them this would be how they work. It makes it a little less useful. Could be a good angle on top of or besides the dps increase. Also could help since the nerf to plasma slug and refuelling with premium ammo.

Not sure about what to do with the delay time. Maybe increase the reload a hair. Not sure how much of a difference this would make besides making them more fun to use. The time and heat would be virtually the same. Unless something times up with it based on heat or power use and it smudges some balance issue up. They have so much heat I don't know what else you would use with them besides thermal vent lasers if anything. Although I imagine there are be combos for it. Anyone know what those would be. I would be interested in hearing about them.
 
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Amanojaku

Amanojaku
PP modules/weapons aren't necessarily supposed to be better than their standard counterparts. They are just supposed to optimize certain specialized builds.

Prismatics aren't as good as Biweaves for many builds (but are better on certain builds) and come with a huge power increase that makes any CMDR think twice about using them.

Packhounds are not as good as standard missles in some ways.

Etc...

The only thing I can think of that's probably op compared to the standard is Pacifier frags, but even then standard frags do noticeably more dmg than Pacifoers at very close range, which is the way most ppl use frags anyway.

Imperial Hammers would be op without the "charge up" time.

Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but iirc I saw a video/thread about how before one of the balance updates, Hammers didn't have have the charge up time (or fired at a much higher rate of fire) and they got nerfed because they were melting everyone. So... I doubt they will be buffed again.
 
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Noobilite

Noobilite
That is why I said to add the charge time to the reload time. The only thing that would change should be anything effecting reload times as it would also effect the added charge time. Assuming those are not already modiefied to be the same I don't see how you couldn't adjust the reload bonus just for imperial hammers to make it identical. It would just change the period of fire. Might be something I'm missing. But I would love them to go back to instant fire. I might have been watching older videos to get that idea. They would be much nicer with instant . Kind of ruins the point. If it not single shot then the delay is stupid as it makes it too hard to get the shots lined up.

If it started with instant shots I don't see how it's acceptable they have the delay. They need to go back to their original form. The nature of all those little shots is too unruly without snapshotting abilities. They can be balanced to compensate. You can easily make it have the same DPS or worse. I'm trying to use them on a cutter, I don't see how many other ships can be slower for it to matter. Unless the issue is with faster ships. It sounds like the issue was with the reload and DPS. That is a solvable problem. It would help with heat even and make them more usable instead of only allowing a few shots which would help.
 
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Red Zephyr

Red Zephyr
Rails and hammers are awesome as they are. You really need to get used to that charge up time to get good with them. Making them instant would make rails too similar to lasers, and variety desperately needs to be maintained.

With rails, don't pull the trigger when you're on target. Pull the trigger as you are getting on target, and be on target when it fires. The timing takes getting used to, and they are great weapons once you get the timing down.
 

Deleted member 110222

D
Or you could leave combat decisions to the devs?

How crazy is that?!
 

Deleted member 110222

D
Ezren said:
Some people made a good argument against instant-fire.

You instead made this argument, here on the suggestions board.
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My suggestion is ignore players completely, based on the superior performance, balance and replay value of other games I play where the devs have on some cases gone as far as to pin threads literally saying that suggestion threads will be locked, deleted and possibly lead to forum bans if people persist.

You don't have to agree with it. But by your own words... This is the suggestions board. Thanks for proving my validity for me. <3 xoxo
 

Ezren

Ezren
Un1k0rn said:
My suggestion is ignore players completely, based on the superior performance, balance and replay value of other games I play where the devs have on some cases gone as far as to pin threads literally saying that suggestion threads will be locked, deleted and possibly lead to forum bans if people persist.

You don't have to agree with it. But by your own words... This is the suggestions board. Thanks for proving my validity for me. <3 xoxo
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So were people posting these suggestion threads that you're saying devs would lock, on a forum that was literally titled Suggestions?

I did nothing to validate anything you said, rather the opposite. Go complain on these other forums you seem so eager to enshrine.
 

Deleted member 110222

D
Ezren said:
So were people posting these suggestion threads that you're saying devs would lock, on a forum that was literally titled Suggestions?

I did nothing to validate anything you said, rather the opposite. Go complain on these other forums you seem so eager to enshrine.
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No.

I was going to get into a long winded rant about stuff but you know what?

The information is there. If you can't process what I'm saying that's your problem.

I'll post what I like and feel free to tell me otherwise... But... Hehe. Well the people who need to know what I'm implying here, know.
 

Bashy81

B
Un1k0rn said:
No.

I was going to get into a long winded rant about stuff but you know what?

The information is there. If you can't process what I'm saying that's your problem.

I'll post what I like and feel free to tell me otherwise... But... Hehe. Well the people who need to know what I'm implying here, know.
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You complained about a suggestion thread being posted on the Suggestions board, then tried to swerve the embarassment by damning all suggestions and suggestion boards.

I have a suggestion for you, which I wont post explicitly but the people who know dont need to know because they already know by implication.
 

Deleted member 110222

D
Bashy81 said:
You complained about a suggestion thread being posted on the Suggestions board, then tried to swerve the embarassment by damning all suggestions and suggestion boards.

I have a suggestion for you, which I wont post explicitly but the people who know dont need to know because they already know by implication.
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My problem with the suggestions board and player involvement in general is that it ends up building up stupid hope in said players, and results in damnation when their dreams don't get realised.

I'm a realist.

Most of the stuff players come up with here is fanciful rubbish. That's my opinion and I don't apologise for sharing it.

Now you're right. Frontier are almost certainly never going to listen to my rambling... But that goes for near everything here.

I only make my suggestions because I honestly think a tougher stance by Frontier could help normal players like you and I realise that we're basically meaningless in where this game goes.

This will be my last post in this thread.

EDIT: Turns out I was wrong on that last part. Sorry. I'm a messed up individual charged by emotion. No. I'm not perfect. Far from it.
 
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Noobilite

Noobilite
Red Zephyr said:
Rails and hammers are awesome as they are. You really need to get used to that charge up time to get good with them. Making them instant would make rails too similar to lasers, and variety desperately needs to be maintained.

With rails, don't pull the trigger when you're on target. Pull the trigger as you are getting on target, and be on target when it fires. The timing takes getting used to, and they are great weapons once you get the timing down.
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I'm decent with rails. I just thought they worked differently and spent a month getting them in order to have snap shot rails... 8(

If they originally worked that way would rather have them back that way. They should be able to adjust other stats to get the same results. It would help a lot with hitting stuff like modules. Maybe the reason they don't have them, but they could smudge numbers again. Maybe lower the values for damage based on the increase in accuracy, which can be calculated btw. I would love an instant rail. Plus anything lowering the time a little would make them a little less heat intensive. I think it's a little too aggressive in that department. A tiny adjustment would be nice. The normal rails aren't anywhere near that bad. Unless I'm missing something about the current effectiveness. But the lower damage to modules would lower that also making them a little less deadly but more usable along with slight adjustments to reload and stuff to make up for the difference in ROF bonuses from the shot delay being put into the reload time. Unless that is already equalized. I was having a hard time figuring out the numbers to that to figure out the exact heat.
 
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Noobilite

Noobilite
Like I said, balancing that would give a reason to reduce some values like pen values and whatnot. Making it easier via raising the reload and other values would make it more fun to use and a little weaker for expert shots making that less of a problem as the same time. This could lower it to other weapons and not make it as deadly without things like Super Penetator. Which would be slightly nerfed. Although it might get more shots. You can counter balance stuff to make it work out nicer.

You would need to slightly increase TTK time overall to go wit heat reductions and pen values from heat being lowered. This overall would make it less agressive but make it more convenient over normal rails. It would be a comfort change over an overall DPS change. This could/would invovle lowering DPS, heat, pen value to maintain or lower the current stats and spread out how long it takes to do the same thing basically.

Yes, that would make it like burst lasers. It's native kinetic burst lasers with different engineering options.
 
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Red Zephyr

Red Zephyr
Try engineered focused burst lasers. They are instant with better armour penetration than unmodded bursts and less breach damage than rails. Problem solved.

We mostly use rails for high module damage and cancelling SCBs. The charge up time, making precise shots just slightly tricky, is one of the balances for the result.
 

Bashy81

B
The OP mentioned about wanting to use hammers on a cutter, which is perfectly doable. Therm vent huge LR beam between LR hammers has great hardpoint convergence and the vent nullifies the heat of the hammers.

The advantage over standard rails being less time on target for equivalent damage (a great benefit) and less coming off the trigger to start the rail-charge, meaning more damage quicker from the beam itself. So there u already have 2 significant advantages for the ship you specifically mentioned for use. Not much distributor to spare so slap some frags up-top and youve got a longrange-shortrange build where u just use boost speed & hard-to-mimic flight profile to keep away from midrange orbit fights.
So uh, hammers are pretty handy already if u look at it.
 

Ezren

Ezren
Un1k0rn said:
I'll post what I like and feel free to tell me otherwise... But... Hehe. Well the people who need to know what I'm implying here, know.
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So you'll post what you like, but you don't want other people posting what they like. For example suggestions, on the Suggestions forum?
 

Sylow

Sylow
Hmm. Way to drag a topic into the dirt. Must be X-mas or something. :D

On the topic: sorry, i disagree with changing the hammers like that. In the current implementation they are a unique version of the railgun. The suggestion would basically turn it into the burst lasers behaviour, just with more damage and being able to engineer it differently. (Yea, there'd be some other small differences, but on the core, this would be the proposed change. ) And then, to make up for it being so much easier to use, it would have to be nerfed down in power to also be no stronger than a burst laser.

I see no merit in doing that, as it only would eliminate a unique weapon from the game for limited benefit of having two flavours of burst lasers in game.
 
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