I agree 100% with Drew here

[Stigbob]

Doesn't have to. The criticism stands well enough on its own merit imho.

Does it ?, seemed more than a little conspirational to me . Concentrating resources on funky new stuff is a sensible move and a good thing from my perspective not really evidence of anything going wrong.

To be honest with you, as much as I really liked the useless fluffy aspect of those news, like a coating of paint, I always thought it was not viable on the long run, much to Frontier's credit in all fairness. So it is no surprise that they pulled the plug at some point.

I would be very surprised to see it returning in the fluffy form we once had, were you never were quite sure if the news was some random backstory or the hint towards a proper story.

They've been popped onto FC and new era which isn't a permanent thing, once FC's are out maybe they'll be back or maybe after new era. They can always be popped back.

Or maybe not gal-net may have only had three regular listeners, none of whom ever bought paintjobs.

 

[Old Duck]

Do I need to add werewolf to the list of OldDuck conspiracies now ?.

My theory is much more frightening, that like a true Russian sleeper agent, you've been sent here from one of Frontier's competitors to sow discord and mayhem throughout the forum, targeting some of ED's most faithful fans, celebrating all of ED's faults while criticizing every GOOD idea and observation posted in this forum. You argue that we don't need (and shouldn't even have) narrative, yet you also argue that bugs are a good thing because they bring "emergent gameplay". And while I find you comical, it is sad that you have the power to drive noble citizens like Drew Wagar underground with your constant trolling.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

Drew who and what are people agreeing with here?

 

[Rubbernuke]

Does it ?, seemed more than a little conspirational to me . Concentrating resources on funky new stuff is a sensible move and a good thing from my perspective not really evidence of anything going wrong.

FD said that it was either text for fleet carriers in the update or Galnet (i.e. story writers also write the text entries for fleet carriers).

Now- exactly how much text is in the FC update? A GalNet story is about 150 - 200 words twice a week. Is it overloading FD to consider both?

The issue is players thinking stories are in game. So, why not write stories about things like Tier 1 characters, or things that can't be done in game? The Feds and Alliance have elections for example.

 

[Stigbob]

My theory is much more frightening, that like a true Russian sleeper agent, you've been sent here from one of Frontier's competitors to sow discord and mayhem throughout the forum, targeting some of ED's most faithful fans, celebrating all of ED's faults while criticizing every GOOD idea and observation posted in this forum. You argue that we don't need (and shouldn't even have) narrative, yet you also argue that bugs are a good thing because they bring "emergent gameplay". And while I find you comical, it is sad that you have the power to drive noble citizens like Drew Wagar underground with your constant trolling.

Maybe I like the space-ship video game, don't give a monkeys about 'lore' because its a space-ship video game and find all the conspiracy theories of the more obsessive types really hilarious.

Your version is much funnier though .

Tremble before my power.

 

[Stigbob]

FD said that it was either text for fleet carriers in the update or Galnet (i.e. story writers also write the text entries for fleet carriers).

Now- exactly how much text is in the FC update? A GalNet story is about 150 - 200 words twice a week. Is it overloading FD to consider both?

The issue is players thinking stories are in game. So, why not write stories about things like Tier 1 characters, or things that can't be done in game? The Feds and Alliance have elections for example.

This is what they really said :

Greetings Commanders,

We would like to thank everyone who has taken the time to voice their concerns and feedback around the reduction of GalNet articles, as well as sharing with us suggestions on ways that we could utilise existing community groups and content to re-introduce them.

We wanted to expand a little more on the details of what led us to this decision. While the previous narratives that were told through GalNet articles gave an insight into what life was like in the 3300's, they also gave players an expectation that these stories were unfolding in-game, and that commanders could fly out to the system and see or even engage with what was happening (which they could not). This, in part, contributed to our reason to shift the focus of GalNet articles to in-game narratives and occurrences, over out-of-game ones.

However, we also want to mention that the narrative/writing team are not solely responsible for writing GalNet articles, but also a number of other duties that contribute to the creation of Elite Dangerous. With the advent of the Fleet Carriers update and the 2020 release, their efforts have been focused on ensuring that all of the text required for it is done in time. Although they are an extremely talented team, they are a small team, which means that we had to prioritise some content over other content, such as GalNet articles. Although we love seeing the incredible content the community news outlets create, editing and implementing it into the game still demands a degree of focus that we do not have currently in scope for the writing team.

We hope that provides some context to why, at the current time, the plans for GalNet articles are unlikely to change. That said, we have passed this feedback on to the team for consideration and will keep you updated if there are any changes.

 

[Rubbernuke]

This is what they really said :

I don't think you read that correctly:

However, we also want to mention that the narrative/writing team are not solely responsible for writing GalNet articles, but also a number of other duties that contribute to the creation of Elite Dangerous. With the advent of the Fleet Carriers update and the 2020 release, their efforts have been focused on ensuring that all of the text required for it is done in time.

How does this differ from what I said?

FD said that it was either text for fleet carriers in the update or Galnet (i.e. story writers also write the text entries for fleet carriers).

So, again, exactly how much text is in the FC update that requires the total cessation of Galnet? In that, 400 words a week more than the 5000 or so in FC? Is New Era being counted too?

 

[Stigbob]

I don't think you read that correctly:

How does this differ from what I said?

You missed the bit about new era, its not all about FC's.

So, again, exactly how much text is in the FC update that requires the total cessation of Galnet? In that, 400 words a week more than the 5000 or so in FC? Is New Era being counted too?

Maybe you should just read the thing I showed you.

 

[Stigbob]

Exactly what Frontier competitor would that be Old Duck, Space Engineers?

Space Engineers was developed and published by Czech Republic independent developer Keen Software House.

o7....

He's right I've been Sean Murray/Derek Smart/Chris Roberts/someone from the X-games all along. I just can't stand FDEV having such noble fans and am sowing the seeds of their certain destruction by saying I like stuff in the forum.

For inadequately explained reasons.

 

[Rubbernuke]

You missed the bit about new era, its not all about FC's.

Maybe you should just read the thing I showed you.

Noted- but again, 400 words a week more to advance the characters they themselves have established for several months (and they have the lore 'bible' too)? FD don't seem to value lore that highly- I find that odd when games like WH40K make stupid money from having consistent characters and backstories to monetize.

 

[Stigbob]

Noted- but again, 400 words a week more to advance the characters they themselves have established for several months (and they have the lore 'bible' too)? FD don't seem to value lore that highly- I find that odd when games like WH40K make stupid money from having consistent characters and backstories to monetize.

Most players don't value video game lore very highly. Its a mutable thing that alters to fit the game over the years.

W40K is a good example of that I've got the original rulebook from the 80's around somewhere, pretty much everything's changed. They had to do some reversal of changes to genestealers for space-hulk death wing a couple of years back that took them back to how they were in issue one. Made for a better video game but it means the 'lore' is swinging back and forth, and they'll sell a new book and a new range of miniatures probably.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Most players don't value video game lore very highly. Its a mutable thing that alters to fit the game over the years.

W40K is a good example of that I've got the original rulebook from the 80's around somewhere, pretty much everything's changed. They had to do some reversal of changes to genestealers for space-hulk death wing a couple of years back that took them back to how they were in issue one. Made for a better video game but it means the 'lore' is swinging back and forth, and they'll sell a new book and a new range of miniatures probably.

"Most players" - is that opinion? WH 40K lore channels are all over Youtube and several run daily lore dives. For example OneMindSyndicate do hour long videos each day.

From my graphic design days I was always taught that ideas and reasons justify a design, and that without a 'backstory' all you are doing is decoration. I can remember early KS videos where the differences between Fed and Imp ideology was woven into ship design (Imps being manned by lots of slaves, Feds more automation), and that it gave reasons behind why things the way they were. Without that, you lean towards Chris Roberts 'Rule of Cool'.

Story wise with nothing justifying the differences outside of what a player can do, is the galaxy 'living' as the sales pitch says it is any longer? ED has gone from a game with higher level happenings to one thats a closed system (i.e. limited to the BGS for events). If you enjoy flying for flyings sake then I imagine thats fine- but if you fly for a reason or a cause, then EDs going to be empty for a long time.

 

[GavDCook]

Drew's points are well taken but along with these points are several departures from the Elite management team, specifically Michael Brooks and Paige Harvey, both community managers, who have moved on. Michael Brooks has moved on to lead another Frontier project as I suspect his expertise was needed there as game director.

Given the shift away from community management for Elite to other Frontier projects as well as postponements in major content for Elite, coupled with Drew's assessment on FDev's departure from Galnet, (the only source of Elite lore and narrative for this game), one has to wonder what the "New Era" means for this game.

o7....

A point was made by someone on Lave radio I think that a lot the problems in game started when ARX were introduced, that their introduction into the game was far deeper than they thought and consequences of such a major change and impact on the old coding wasn’t anticipated.
I think that the last six months has seen some major changes to the engine to make it run fleet carriers reliably and to make it stable enough to accept the ‘new era’ update which will probably be a bolt on rather than addition to the old code.
I think FDEV are just extremely busy trying to make elite work properly.

 

[Old Duck]

"Most players" - is that opinion?

Funny how people always claim the majority when trying to win an argument. I don't know about "most people", but I care about lore, be it Elite or Overwatch or Skyrim or whatever. That doesn't mean I read every book in Skyrim or every tourist beacon in ED, but I like feeling part of a living, breathing world, which narrative, lore, and good story telling gives us.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Funny how people always claim the majority when trying to win an argument. I don't know about "most people", but I care about lore, be it Elite or Overwatch or Skyrim or whatever. That doesn't mean I read every book in Skyrim or every tourist beacon in ED, but I like feeling part of a living, breathing world, which narrative, lore, and good story telling gives us.

I talked about WH40K because players heavily invest in the lore of the characters and various chapters, because each one is unique and gives a reason for it being the way it is.

 

[Stigbob]

"Most players" - is that opinion? WH 40K lore channels are all over Youtube and several run daily lore dives. For example OneMindSyndicate do hour long videos each day.

Most video game players, yes its opinion. Its the same names as well the perpetually upset are up in arms about gal-net this week, so its not really very convincing. Just this weeks "issue" I can't remember any of them praising it in the past.

From my graphic design days I was always taught that ideas and reasons justify a design, and that without a 'backstory' all you are doing is decoration. I can remember early KS videos where the differences between Fed and Imp ideology was woven into ship design (Imps being manned by lots of slaves, Feds more automation), and that it gave reasons behind why things the way they were. Without that, you lean towards Chris Roberts 'Rule of Cool'.

They stick to that the alliance ships also have their own look. Gal-net doesn't really impact on the games visuals.

Story wise with nothing justifying the differences outside of what a player can do, is the galaxy 'living' as the sales pitch says it is any longer? ED has gone from a game with higher level happenings to one thats a closed system (i.e. limited to the BGS for events). If you enjoy flying for flyings sake then I imagine thats fine- but if you fly for a reason or a cause, then EDs going to be empty for a long time.

Its living, positively jumping sometimes how much you notice depends if you play the BGS or not. The wider story for me is we've pushed back the Thargoid advance into the bubble (and my home system that was fun) and are now struggling over witchhead, I only dabble in that though. The overarching story is still going on but I don't have much time for the Thargoid front since humanities more concerned with ourselves, its a long struggle though so no rush.

 

[Old Duck]

I talked about WH40K because players heavily invest in the lore of the characters and various chapters, because each one is unique and gives a reason for it being the way it is.

Forgive me, but what is WH40K? Sounds like a variant of WD40.

 

[Stigbob]

Funny how people always claim the majority when trying to win an argument. I don't know about "most people", but I care about lore, be it Elite or Overwatch or Skyrim or whatever. That doesn't mean I read every book in Skyrim or every tourist beacon in ED, but I like feeling part of a living, breathing world, which narrative, lore, and good story telling gives us.

Its the best way to undermine noble fans on behalf of an evil competitor or something. Apparently.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Forgive me, but what is WH40K? Sounds like a variant of WD40.

WarHammer 40K

 

[Rubbernuke]

Most video game players, yes its opinion. Its the same names as well the perpetually upset are up in arms about gal-net this week, so its not really very convincing. Just this weeks "issue" I can't remember any of them praising it in the past.

Galnet used to have quite the community behind it back in the day.

They stick to that the alliance ships also have their own look. Gal-net doesn't really impact on the games visuals.

But lore wise I mean- without lore its all window dressing.

Its living, positively jumping sometimes how much you notice depends if you play the BGS or not. The wider story for me is we've pushed back the Thargoid advance into the bubble (and my home system that was fun) and are now struggling over witchhead, I only dabble in that though. The overarching story is still going on but I don't have much time for the Thargoid front since humanities more concerned with ourselves, its a long struggle though so no rush.

For all its marvels the BGS is a closed cycle that does not inject huge variation in things. War is still war whether its the first or tenth time, while Galnet can move outside those bounds.

With the Thargoids, how could you express trying to communicate with them? There is no state for ceasing hostilities with them, finding new clues regards Guardian technology or anything along those lines that Galnet can do.

ED really needs both lore and game working in close synergy, because without one or the other it becomes flat.