Question for Open players who don't like PVP/ganking... help me understand

[Rat Catcher]

I know what you mean, it's hard to watch your friends get attacked just because they are known associates, but my 'known associates' understand and in some cases that's why they choose to side with me Emergent content, meaningful PvP. These are the consequences, it's splash damage.

Good comment

My main has been attacked and blown up - part and parcel of having a Reaper Tag (and I did have to chase them around for a few minutes to get their attention!), my other 2 accounts have had 'interest' shown in other parts of the nebula... no worries.

Events in the nebula have been fun though, even if what used to be a quiet anarchy system is no longer quite so sedate - as I do PvE on all of my accounts I have no issue doing simple missions in fast ships

 

[Screemonster]

You don't get to tell me where to go, nobody does, and if you CHOOSE to punish me for minding my own business, hurting no-one, in systems of my choosing, then it's on you, just as a random ganker CHOOSING to shoot me for whatever reason he uses to justify it is on HIM, and you can save your sermonizing for somebody who cares, because I most definitely don't.

This is my issue with the whole thing, tbh. I remember back in the day, dropping into Wyrd, a bunch of guys from SPEAR were there, and I was able to take that as a sign that I, a clean CMDR, was not going to have to worry about gankers that day. When they weren't around there were pretty good odds of least one triangle hanging around in supercruise with malicious intent.
They also used to stay out of BGS conflicts as it was explicitly not the business of their mission. Individual squadrons might take sides in individual wars, but that was their business and not that of the coalition as a whole.
Something's changed since then in the way they present themselves and it leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I used to trust them.

That's why I like negotiating. It cuts out a hell of a lot of grind Avoids quite a lot of the splash damage too.

It solves a lot of problems if everyone's willing to be reasonable. Sure, it's easy for me since I'm out in the sticks, I'm not sure if any of the PMFs remotely near me are still active and I'm not seeing any evidence that any of the procgen factions are being supported, but I at least try to fling out a hi when I see someone's carrier parked in a system I'm looking at.

 

[CaptainPugwash]

In Elite to reliably kill someone who know's what he's doing is functionally impossible except in special circumstances due to balance.

When my wing of four blew up one of our SPEAR enemies some time ago - who was alone - it only worked because that CMDR made a grave
misjudgement on the armament of one of our CMDRs, who had several scramble lasers fitted and shut down the FSD right in the moment.
Otherwise he would've been able to get away even under fire from a whole wing:

The defense stacking in this game is ridiculous, fights between well built mediums take 10-15 minutes.
So in order to kill your enemy, you HAVE to gank in the sense of "gang-killing" aka bring overwhelming numbers.
A full evasive 4 pip engine FdL can have 300 mj of shields "only", you still can't hit it before it wakes out.
The defense stacking is just that bad, especially for shielded builds, where several effects don't work (like scramble, killing pp/fsd).
This all is related to "G5'd murderboats" tho.
A 3D shielded Asp to pop is usually easier then blowing up NPCs, because NPCs generally at least try to evade.

Balancing overwhelming numbers is made difficult by the game infrastructure.
Sometimes you can't reliably instance depending on hardware, internet provider, etc.
Also blocking makes the whole instancing even worse.
If you have several people in the same timezone and on similar/close internet providers, it's much easier to instance.
That's why you often have 4 to 1 odds, because one side simply can't bring more together, while the other can.

This is all independent from the C&P system.
The current iteration and our conflict "drama" by the way shows one of the mistakes to make the status "wanted" apply to a ship.
We always complain SPEAR is hunting clean CMDRs who for them are criminals, but not for the game's ruleset.
If FD would've decided to keep bounties on the CMDR, we wouldn't have much of this discussion about hypocrisy.

Thanks for that, and I agree on all points. In fact there are plenty of players with no engineering as they didn’t buy horizons, and I would say that a casual base game player in a non engineered T6, 7, or 9 is gankable by a single ganker.
My suspicion is that frontier has kept the balance so much in favour of the defender to cater for this end of the spectrum. I’m not saying a better C&P system would make this end of the spectrum immune from being killed, but it could at least make it less viable for the attacker via higher (trackable) bounties and an ATR that can follow the aggressor all over the galaxy. This would in turn allow the balance to be geared more towards the attacker.

 

[Sylow]

Surely you upstanding citizens would use a KWS on somebody before opening fire, right? So if I'm a peaceful CMDR with no bounties on me, and I most certainly am, I have never fired upon anyone unless they fired upon me, I have nothing to fear from you, right?

I kind of would have expected the same from somebody claiming to be good and protect people. Not checking somebody like that for me is in the same boat as "pirates without a cargo hold".

Sure, one utility slot used for a KWS is one less SB stacked up, so indeed a combat disadvantage. But that's the price you pay, i would guess.

Of course, that's all theoretially speaking. The way the game works, i very much see that the game works in favour of the "evil" side. You want to gank, you just go somewhere, any random target will do. You want to be lawful, you not only have to be at the right place at the right time, but also be lucky to end up in the same instance as the criminal.

It's not like Spear is the first group trying to be "uber special police". The other groups i was aware of who tried also had good ships and pilots. But actually finding the target, even if they knew exactly in which system it was (and even knowing WHERE in the system he was) turned out to be a problem. The instancing barrier is high in this game.

Most of history was written by the winners, who naturally will have painted themselves in a positive light.

That's true for RL history. In games, history is being written by those who:

• Spend more time writing postings.
• Have one member who is better in writing than the rest.
• Can turn the most interesting twists on the story and make it most entertaining to read.

In RL being on the loosing side takes away critical resources. In the game, nothing like that happens.

Just like i remember some old time in SWG. I was part of an imperial base busting team. We found a rebel PvP base and were spotting when checking its vulnerability time. So when we attacked, the rebels stood ready to fend us off. So our team of 9 people (two of them Jedi) stood outside of a fully operational base, turrets and minefields included. Our informers reported the base to be crowded with people.

We still decided to push the attack. We managed to take down 7 of them before going down. They loudly celebrated their "glorious victory" on the games forum, and all who were along also were proud of their participation. Which made it easy for us to pin down the numbers: 24 Jedi and 8 Non-Jedi. So their team of 32 people, behind a minefield and covered by defensive turrets, lost 7 men when fending us 9 off.

You can imagine who was admired and who was the laughed at in the forums after the numbers were known. In RL history, we'd been dead and merely a small note in the "Imperial attack was repelled" report. On the games forum, we built the reputation of tough guys instead.

It might seem off topic, but actually, a games PvP for many people is about building a reputation. And doing so in a game is very different from any RL thing.

 

[Danquememe]

But actually finding the target, even if they knew exactly in which system it was (and even knowing WHERE in the system he was) turned out to be a problem. The instancing barrier is high in this game.

I'd like to point out that there are law-abiding bounty hunters who find a very decent measure of success. One of them streams regularly on Twitch as he does so. He mostly sticks to high traffic systems - the same ones gankers inhabit - and he operates almost exactly like a ganker does.

With one exception, of course: he KWS scans every ship he pulls, and if they don't have any bounties, he lets them go.

He also pulls PowerPlay enemies and engages them, since they are "fair game."

He has few rules other than that; they need to be Novice rank or higher. The size of the bounty doesn't matter. 200cr bounty? He'll pull you.

He of course goes for the biggest bounties that he can find, and he will use a wake scanner to try to chase big bounties down (unlike gankers which don't bother). He does a light roleplay about having 5 kids to feed. It's pretty entertaining, honestly, especially when he has to deal with a group of gankers coming after him.

But it's all in good fun, of course.

 

[Deleted member 121570]

I'd like to point out that there are law-abiding bounty hunters who find a very decent measure of success. One of them streams regularly on Twitch as he does so. He mostly sticks to high traffic systems - the same ones gankers inhabit - and he operates almost exactly like a ganker does. so he operates completely differently to a ganker.

FTFY

Good of you to explain all the ways he differs, too!

 

[Danquememe]

FTFY

Good of you to explain all the ways he differs, too!

Oh, I'm a big fan. I just meant that what he's actually doing - the mechanics of it - are functionally identical to what a ganker does. He parks in systems, scans new arrivals, pulls them, and then - rather than just going guns blazing immediately, like a ganker - he does a KWS scan. Then goes guns blazing - if they have a bounty.

The point of course is that what he's doing is like 98% the same as what a ganker does, but since he also does the KWS scan, it's somehow totally OK.

I'm not disparaging him by saying that, nor saying there is a double standard in play. There isn't; that last 2% makes 100% of the difference.

But it is an interesting observation, and I always laugh when he's like, "Welp you've got a 200cr bounty, time to die. My kids gotta eat."

I just enjoy it, honestly!

And I have a KWS that I use in my "bit" from time to time, too. It's fun! Sometimes though, the targeted pilot is informed that because he doesn't have a bounty - i.e. isn't "Wanted" - he has to die. Because we can't have un-Wanted pilots in this system. It's goofy, but hey. I'm a bad guy!

 

[Deleted member 121570]

Never seen him - I tend to avoid combat vids as I find them usually boring. Sounds like some fun patter though

 

[Danquememe]

Never seen him - I tend to avoid combat vids as I find them usually boring. Sounds like some fun patter though

He streams on Twitch.

Usually draws a pretty solid crowd, too. I've been following for a few months now and always enjoy. We are in-game friends, too, and I've had him scan me for bounties from time to time, as well as engage in skirmishes. He has a few interesting builds that are pretty well optimized to his "line of work." I always enjoy facing them because they're a unique challenge. And I'd be lying if I said that keeping my bounty up in the millions wasn't mostly intended for his benefit. Because his kids gotta eat!

This is my approach to PVP in this game; I love the lawfuls, because they keep things exciting for me. I like the gankers, too, because they are elements of chaos and unpredictability. This is the "larger world" of the game that I've referenced before, the one that opens up to you when you're finally able to get your head above the humdrum of grinding for credits or mats or whatever. For me, it's where the game gets really fun.

 

[Deleted member 121570]

I agree that grind always sucks, but there's no need to do it. Some folks just like being bored I guess!
I don't really see gankers as chaotic or unpredictable though - quite the reverse tbh.
A few are ok though - that bounty hunter dude needs to feed his kids.

 

[TheVirus]

I'm so glad I stumbled across this post. I think you'll be too.

D'anquememe, you and I had an interaction just the other day. By interaction I mean, you destroyed my ship instantly as I was leaving the engineer in Deciat.

This is my story, take what you want from it.

Was I salty at the time? Yes.
I'm a relatively new/returning player, Mostly Harmless some would say. I purchased the game a long time ago, played it a few times, and hadn't touched it since. My friend just picked up a VR headset and I convinced him that we should try Elite Dangerous together.

Upon returning to the game I noticed that I had left myself a decent amount of credits from the labors of my past void opal mining experience. Just barely enough to treat myself to a Krait II and get back into the game.

The past few nights I had logged on for a few hours and ground out some missions. Mostly passenger sightseeing missions as I figured the exploration data would help with engineering efforts. I scrape together ~12 mil in efforts to upgrade my ship so I can better help my friend get his start in the game.

So the night comes when my buddy and I are supposed to start playing together. Excitement is high. I'm on the comms with him as he's going through the tutorial missions and I'm explaining to him what I can about the game. There's a lot to wrap your head around if you've never played a game like this.

Still explaining the game to my buddy, I head to Deciat as I think I can upgrade my FSD a little. I get to the engineer's settlement and upgrade. Sweet. After a breakthrough with my navigation tutorial, my friend and I make plans to meet up in a system nearby the newbie zone. I launch from the settlement and head out.

This is where you're a part of my story.

I'm just about to engage supercruise and my ship inexplicably blows up. I tell my friend what happened and the conversation goes something like this:
"Oh no! What do you lose?
"About 5 million credits."
"Do you have a bounty? What does he get? "
"No bounty, and I don't know, not much I think."
"Does he get penalized?"
"Probably, but he probably has the bankroll to eat up any penalty."
"Then why would he do it?"
"Because it was fun?"

The game offers me a rebuy for just a little under half my total credits to start at the same engineer settlement I was destroyed at. Great. Thanks.

I launch hoping to get the edge on you and fly, I don't know, somehow faster. I then begin to get barraged by your friend ramming into my ship. Confused at to why this isn't triggering a security response and not looking to lose the rest of my past few nights efforts of credits, I log from the game into Solo mode. I see that I have a new friend request. A player who has the trappings of a discount Insane Clown Posse member.

This brought my night and my friend's night to a halt.

Am I still salty? Hmm. No? I just wish the game was better.
I've read a few pages of this post and it's changed my mind in a few ways, and I think you're decent and logical (MUCH to my surprise lol). To give you my honest opinion based on the snippets I've read:
1. I'm glad you found friends in a rather peculiar and great for story-telling way, but that's not for me and I'm sure it's not that way for many others. I don't want to be friends with you. I don't want to be friends with others who skew the actions of griefing new players to be enjoyable or for their benefit.
2. The game lets you attack me, a mostly harmless player at an engineer frequented by new players. Should that really be your hunting ground?
3. You say that 5% rebuy makes for no penalty to players. Perhaps, but it wasn't to me, and it won't be to many other new players. It represented hours of missions on my part, to what? A few seconds to you?
4. I feel like you didn't really make you post to see the other side of the story did you? I feel like you just wanted to pitch your own justification while getting support of other players like you.

In conclusion, I just wish that there was a bigger reward/bigger penalty for you. I very much like PvP, and it's an experience I'm looking forward to when I'm ready. But I view what you to be doing more along the lines of griefing. What was the plan that night? To keep destroying my ship until I was back in a sidewinder?

Anyway. What I've learned from this post is the consensus of the community tells me that this game is either not for me, or that I should just play privately. I was hoping to organically meet new players in the galaxy and share awesome experiences, but this wasn't one of them.

 

[ACowForAllSeasons]

I'm so glad I stumbled across this post. I think you'll be too.

D'anquememe, you and I had an interaction just the other day. By interaction I mean, you destroyed my ship instantly as I was leaving the engineer in Deciat.

This is my story, take what you want from it.

Was I salty at the time? Yes.
I'm a relatively new/returning player, Mostly Harmless some would say. I purchased the game a long time ago, played it a few times, and hadn't touched it since. My friend just picked up a VR headset and I convinced him that we should try Elite Dangerous together.

Upon returning to the game I noticed that I had left myself a decent amount of credits from the labors of my past void opal mining experience. Just barely enough to treat myself to a Krait II and get back into the game.

The past few nights I had logged on for a few hours and ground out some missions. Mostly passenger sightseeing missions as I figured the exploration data would help with engineering efforts. I scrape together ~12 mil in efforts to upgrade my ship so I can better help my friend get his start in the game.

So the night comes when my buddy and I are supposed to start playing together. Excitement is high. I'm on the comms with him as he's going through the tutorial missions and I'm explaining to him what I can about the game. There's a lot to wrap your head around if you've never played a game like this.

Still explaining the game to my buddy, I head to Deciat as I think I can upgrade my FSD a little. I get to the engineer's settlement and upgrade. Sweet. After a breakthrough with my navigation tutorial, my friend and I make plans to meet up in a system nearby the newbie zone. I launch from the settlement and head out.

This is where you're a part of my story.

I'm just about to engage supercruise and my ship inexplicably blows up. I tell my friend what happened and the conversation goes something like this:
"Oh no! What do you lose?
"About 5 million credits."
"Do you have a bounty? What does he get? "
"No bounty, and I don't know, not much I think."
"Does he get penalized?"
"Probably, but he probably has the bankroll to eat up any penalty."
"Then why would he do it?"
"Because it was fun?"

The game offers me a rebuy for just a little under half my total credits to start at the same engineer settlement I was destroyed at. Great. Thanks.

I launch hoping to get the edge on you and fly, I don't know, somehow faster. I then begin to get barraged by your friend ramming into my ship. Confused at to why this isn't triggering a security response and not looking to lose the rest of my past few nights efforts of credits, I log from the game into Solo mode. I see that I have a new friend request. A player who has the trappings of a discount Insane Clown Posse member.

This brought my night and my friend's night to a halt.

Am I still salty? Hmm. No? I just wish the game was better.
I've read a few pages of this post and it's changed my mind in a few ways, and I think you're decent and logical (MUCH to my surprise lol). To give you my honest opinion based on the snippets I've read:
1. I'm glad you found friends in a rather peculiar and great for story-telling way, but that's not for me and I'm sure it's not that way for many others. I don't want to be friends with you. I don't want to be friends with others who skew the actions of griefing new players to be enjoyable or for their benefit.
2. The game lets you attack me, a mostly harmless player at an engineer frequented by new players. Should that really be your hunting ground?
3. You say that 5% rebuy makes for no penalty to players. Perhaps, but it wasn't to me, and it won't be to many other new players. It represented hours of missions on my part, to what? A few seconds to you?
4. I feel like you didn't really make you post to see the other side of the story did you? I feel like you just wanted to pitch your own justification while getting support of other players like you.

In conclusion, I just wish that there was a bigger reward/bigger penalty for you. I very much like PvP, and it's an experience I'm looking forward to when I'm ready. But I view what you to be doing more along the lines of griefing. What was the plan that night? To keep destroying my ship until I was back in a sidewinder?

Anyway. What I've learned from this post is the consensus of the community tells me that this game is either not for me, or that I should just play privately. I was hoping to organically meet new players in the galaxy and share awesome experiences, but this wasn't one of them.

Hmmm yes. A good gonk really. Honestly credits are meaningless in this game. A CMDR I gonked a few weeks back was upset about his lost 7m, so I handed him 403m in credits via my FC. He's currently onboard said FC as we return from Rosette Nebula. Just because people blow you up certainly doesn't mean we won't help you in the game itself. But if you don't accept friend requests and at least try to engage, you'll never know. You want to fly in open? You have to be prepared, and clearly you weren't and then made a bad decision worse. Welcome to Open!

 

[M4RTH4]

Hmmm yes. A good gonk really. Honestly credits are meaningless in this game. A CMDR I gonked a few weeks back was upset about his lost 7m, so I handed him 403m in credits via my FC. He's currently onboard said FC as we return from Rosette Nebula. Just because people blow you up certainly doesn't mean we won't help you in the game itself. But if you don't accept friend requests and at least try to engage, you'll never know. You want to fly in open? You have to be prepared, and clearly you weren't and then made a bad decision worse. Welcome to Open!

The thing is that gankers get off relatively scott-free while the gankees get punished for merely existing.
I'd love to play in open, I'd love to meet other people, even if all we say to each other is a simple 'o7' and both of us be on our merry ways.

Death is punishment carried out by wasted time. Death from Environment (white dwarf, NPC, going to sleep right next to a star) is all easily preventable and predictable. Deaths from players, however, are not always preventable nor predictable. Players can regain credits stupid easily, yes, but ain't nobody regaining time. Instead of slight excitement of 'Oh hey, another player! Sup?' instead it's the worry and caution of 'Oh, another player. Please leave me alone and I'll leave you alone.'
That's why the galaxy is as empty as it feels; instead of dealing with lost time, most anyone plays in either a private group, where unconsensual PVP is strictly foreboden, or Solo. No one, no matter what scenario, wants to be punished for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, especially if they had no way of knowing they were in it.

 

[ethelred]

I'm so glad I stumbled across this post. I think you'll be too.

D'anquememe, you and I had an interaction just the other day. By interaction I mean, you destroyed my ship instantly as I was leaving the engineer in Deciat.

This is my story, take what you want from it.

Was I salty at the time? Yes.
I'm a relatively new/returning player, Mostly Harmless some would say. I purchased the game a long time ago, played it a few times, and hadn't touched it since. My friend just picked up a VR headset and I convinced him that we should try Elite Dangerous together.

Upon returning to the game I noticed that I had left myself a decent amount of credits from the labors of my past void opal mining experience. Just barely enough to treat myself to a Krait II and get back into the game.

The past few nights I had logged on for a few hours and ground out some missions. Mostly passenger sightseeing missions as I figured the exploration data would help with engineering efforts. I scrape together ~12 mil in efforts to upgrade my ship so I can better help my friend get his start in the game.

So the night comes when my buddy and I are supposed to start playing together. Excitement is high. I'm on the comms with him as he's going through the tutorial missions and I'm explaining to him what I can about the game. There's a lot to wrap your head around if you've never played a game like this.

Still explaining the game to my buddy, I head to Deciat as I think I can upgrade my FSD a little. I get to the engineer's settlement and upgrade. Sweet. After a breakthrough with my navigation tutorial, my friend and I make plans to meet up in a system nearby the newbie zone. I launch from the settlement and head out.

This is where you're a part of my story.

I'm just about to engage supercruise and my ship inexplicably blows up. I tell my friend what happened and the conversation goes something like this:
"Oh no! What do you lose?
"About 5 million credits."
"Do you have a bounty? What does he get? "
"No bounty, and I don't know, not much I think."
"Does he get penalized?"
"Probably, but he probably has the bankroll to eat up any penalty."
"Then why would he do it?"
"Because it was fun?"

The game offers me a rebuy for just a little under half my total credits to start at the same engineer settlement I was destroyed at. Great. Thanks.

I launch hoping to get the edge on you and fly, I don't know, somehow faster. I then begin to get barraged by your friend ramming into my ship. Confused at to why this isn't triggering a security response and not looking to lose the rest of my past few nights efforts of credits, I log from the game into Solo mode. I see that I have a new friend request. A player who has the trappings of a discount Insane Clown Posse member.

This brought my night and my friend's night to a halt.

Am I still salty? Hmm. No? I just wish the game was better.
I've read a few pages of this post and it's changed my mind in a few ways, and I think you're decent and logical (MUCH to my surprise lol). To give you my honest opinion based on the snippets I've read:
1. I'm glad you found friends in a rather peculiar and great for story-telling way, but that's not for me and I'm sure it's not that way for many others. I don't want to be friends with you. I don't want to be friends with others who skew the actions of griefing new players to be enjoyable or for their benefit.
2. The game lets you attack me, a mostly harmless player at an engineer frequented by new players. Should that really be your hunting ground?
3. You say that 5% rebuy makes for no penalty to players. Perhaps, but it wasn't to me, and it won't be to many other new players. It represented hours of missions on my part, to what? A few seconds to you?
4. I feel like you didn't really make you post to see the other side of the story did you? I feel like you just wanted to pitch your own justification while getting support of other players like you.

In conclusion, I just wish that there was a bigger reward/bigger penalty for you. I very much like PvP, and it's an experience I'm looking forward to when I'm ready. But I view what you to be doing more along the lines of griefing. What was the plan that night? To keep destroying my ship until I was back in a sidewinder?

Anyway. What I've learned from this post is the consensus of the community tells me that this game is either not for me, or that I should just play privately. I was hoping to organically meet new players in the galaxy and share awesome experiences, but this wasn't one of them.

Ouch. That's a rough lesson.

I'm sure if you were to ask we could replace all your lost credits AND give you and your friend training on how to avoid this in the future.

I say this as a non PvPer who would love to see you thumb your nose at these irritants and get away next time (relatively) scot free.

Fly safe 07

 

[ethelred]

The thing is that gankers get off relatively scott-free while the gankees get punished for merely existing.
I'd love to play in open, I'd love to meet other people, even if all we say to each other is a simple 'o7' and both of us be on our merry ways.

Death is punishment carried out by wasted time. Players can regain credits stupid easily, yes, but ain't nobody regaining time. Instead of slight excitement of 'Oh hey, another player!' instead it's the worry and caution of 'Oh, another player.'
That's why the galaxy is as empty as it feels; instead of dealing with lost time, most anyone plays in either a private group, where unconsensual PVP is strictly foreboden, or Solo. No one, no matter what scenario, wants to be punished for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, especially if they had no way of knowing they were in it.

I got to say that I take away something different.

How about we (non PvP Open pilots) start to waste their time by improving at evasion?

Sure, getting bushwacked with vital cargo is a pain, but doing training in an empty ship not only gives you interaction with someone but you know they'll let you survive. Then when it happens for real you'll know you'll be safe(ish)

Sound good?

 

[M4RTH4]

I got to say that I take away something different.

How about we (non PvP Open pilots) start to waste their time by improving at evasion?

Sure, getting bushwacked with vital cargo is a pain, but doing training in an empty ship not only gives you interaction with someone but you know they'll let you survive. Then when it happens for real you'll know you'll be safe(ish)

Sound good?

Sure, lemme just escape interdiction in my fat- trading vessel of a Type 9- oh wait, Type 9 has a hard enough time evading from NPCs, and Engineering exists for a super lasso.

Guess I gotta submit and rely on my shields to- Oh Wait, engineering exists to either bypass shields, deal Super Bonus to them, or destroy them completely while they're up.

Boost and hope I gain dista- Oh Wait Type 9 is slow as molasses drips off a spoon, handles like a brick outhouse, and about half as big as your mom. No escape even WITH engineering. (Bonus Point requirement: Mass locked by a Python)

Lets try a high wak- O̶̧͈̐̏͑H̷̯̺͐̕͜͝͠ ̵̨̹͎̦̀̀̽͘Ẉ̷̰̣̽Ä̷̰̱͘Ỉ̷͉̯̩͕ͅT̶̨̝̹̳͆̋̈́̀̾ my thrusters are gone, leaving me a sitting duck for either mission cargo to be stolen and/or blown up. Nowhere near enough time for reboot-repair before I hear Jefferson screaming 'Eject eject ej-'

What was my crime? I had no bounty upon my ship, Rebuy would have told me otherwise and I'd be on a prison station. Instead, that 5 minutes of flying to a station 4kls away to pick up cargo to fly another 5 minutes to another station is straight up gone. I ain't gettin' that back.
BONUS WASTED TIME: Engineering that Type 9 in general only for it to have no effect on the outcome nor delaying it.

 

[ACowForAllSeasons]

Sure, lemme just escape interdiction in my fat- trading vessel of a Type 9- oh wait, Type 9 has a hard enough time evading from NPCs, and Engineering exists for a super lasso.

Guess I gotta submit and rely on my shields to- Oh Wait, engineering exists to either bypass shields, deal Super Bonus to them, or destroy them completely while they're up.

Boost and hope I gain dista- Oh Wait Type 9 is slow as molasses drips off a spoon, handles like a brick outhouse, and about half as big as your mom. No escape even WITH engineering. (Bonus Point requirement: Mass locked by a Python)

Lets try a high waaaaand my thrusters are gone, leaving me a sitting duck for either mission cargo to be stolen and/or blown up.

What was my crime? I had no bounty upon my ship, Rebuy would have told me otherwise and I'd be on a prison station. Instead, that 5 minutes of flying to a station 4kls away to pick up cargo to fly another 5 minutes to another station is straight up gone. I ain't gettin' that back.
BONUS WASTED TIME: Engineering that Type 9 in general only for it to have no effect on the outcome nor delaying it.

This is where you're terribly wrong. At Sir Ganksalot's Gank Evasion Academy the running test is to survive a full gank ship with all it's frags in a stock Cobra Mk3. And it can be done easily. "Oh I'm in a T9" is a terrible excuse and goes more to you not knowing what to do in this scenario. Escape is an option in stock ships, with even a modicum of engineering it's utterly trivial -regardless of the ship.

 

[Mohrgan]

Ditching attackers gets boring after a while. Once the methods for evading a gank are learned, and practiced, escaping looses it's thrill. I figured that once I was committed to evading attacks, rather than fighting them out, I would just evade all of that in one fell stroke. Private Group.

 

[ethelred]

Sure, lemme just escape interdiction in my fat- trading vessel of a Type 9- oh wait, Type 9 has a hard enough time evading from NPCs, and Engineering exists for a super lasso.
Guess I gotta submit and rely on my shields to- Oh Wait, engineering exists to either bypass shields, deal Super Bonus to them, or destroy them completely while they're up.
Boost and hope I gain dista- Oh Wait Type 9 is slow as molasses drips off a spoon, handles like a brick outhouse, and about half as big as your mom. No escape even WITH engineering. (Bonus Point requirement: Mass locked by a Python)
Lets try a high waaaaand my thrusters are gone, leaving me a sitting duck for either mission cargo to be stolen and/or blown up.

What was my crime? I had no bounty upon my ship, Rebuy would have told me otherwise and I'd be on a prison station. Instead, that 5 minutes of flying to a station 4kls away to pick up cargo to fly another 5 minutes to another station is straight up gone. I ain't gettin' that back.

OK, I see your point but back up there Cowboy.

You ain't told me what you've seen when you jump into a system, get close to he star and then put your six facing it so you can't be interdicted.

You ain't told me what Ctrl B is telling you, or what and how many hollow squares you can see.

You ain't told me the route you're choosing to your destination.

You ain't told me what your outfitting is, you ain't told me you got an escape plan sorted, you ain't told me your high wake system.

Let me tell you if you get to the interdiction, you've already needlessly put yourself at risk.

None of this needs engineering.

 

[Riverside]

I got to say that I take away something different.

How about we (non PvP Open pilots) start to waste their time by improving at evasion?

Sure, getting bushwacked with vital cargo is a pain, but doing training in an empty ship not only gives you interaction with someone but you know they'll let you survive. Then when it happens for real you'll know you'll be safe(ish)

Sound good?

Practice is good yes, experience will help a player to not panic in a time critical situation, it's often indecision that is the deciding factor. Have a plan and know what you are going to do.