Planet zoo's stylized choice and what it means to you

[Danny_zoo]

We have discussed so many things in this forum when it comes to this amazing game, yet the stylized choice for Planet Zoo given its audience dose seem like a very underrated discussion. I'm of the opinion that the artist and developers behind Planet Zoo are some of the very best in the industry, meaning that anything related to the way that Planet Zoo looks has been a choice to them, and not a lack of designing ability or technological shortcoming, as this is a thread about visuals.

It is clear, judging by the many arguments about it within the forum that many of you think that many animals found within the game would benefit from added realism instead of the cartoonist look they were given. The lion and mostly all of the other carnivores come to mind as some of the most obvious discrepancies with reality. Outside mods have been able to capture the beautiful and majestic realism of some of this animals in much greater detail than Frontier cared to do, so question is why?

This stylized choice is of course not limited to the animals, it is found through out the game, the most obvious example at least to me are the human characters, they just awful in every way. The choice of design for visitors and staff is such a detrimental aspect of this game, that for me, there has never been another choice but to play with a close zoo. Early on, I do remember one of the videos where a community manager mentioned that they just did not want to spend the additional resources and time in making the humans match the animals and the amazing scenery, so they were recycled for the early Planet Coaster days. I do however wonder if this was the only reason, as the game seemed to have been marketed as very child friendly, and it would be understandable that you would want some similarities with cartoons. However when I have interacted with many of you in this forum and looked thru the thousands of social media and YouTube uploads out there in relation to the game, it seems that almost everyone playing are adults, so what happened there?

I will give you another example, recently I was at a friends house, who has a 6 year old kid, having my laptop with me I went ahead and tried as I usually do to promote the game. The father did buy the game for the child, but he just does not play since it finds it too complicated and formal. On a different opportunity I was boasting about this amazing game to a 19 year old that works in a Zoo and his extremely dedicated to animals and anything nature related. When she got to play the game, while thankful for my recommendation, she did mention her great disappointment that many of the animals looked like cartoons instead of a bit more realistic. I uploaded one of the lion mods, that changed its appearance, and it was an instant game changer to her.

So the questions are, does it bother you that the certain aspects of the game look like cartoons? Why do you think Frontier went with look for the game? Lastly, do you think that this would/should be changed in the future?

 

[Indoraptor27]

I think the cartoony male lion and guests have nothing to do with the target audience. The guests are recycled from PlanCo, which doesn't strive as hard for realism. I wish they weren't, but I don't know if they'll be changed. For the male lion, my theory is at the very beginning of development when it wasn't even a zoo game yet, and more a safari simulator, it was probably one of the first things designed. The team simply wasn't as good at designing animals, and it never was changed. I think besides the guests and male lion, everything else is very realistic. Hopefully they'll change those two, but the game is rated 10+ anyway, and most of it doesn't seemed aimed at younger audiences.

 

[Danny_zoo]

"The Humans in these Games look like that for a good Reason because if they would add too many Details, the Game would lagg way earlier. I think I've heard once that Jurassic World Evolution can have such realistic looking Guests because not every Guest that is really in the Park, is also shown walking around but in Planet Zoo, you can see every Guest that is in the Park"

Urufu1997


I would like to answer this response in this thread. You might be correct, in my estimation the appearance and design choice did not seem to be relevant towards performance, however if you say this is the case, then the solution is in your post. Why not reduce the number of visitors in Planet Zoo, in the videos I have seen of people playing with open zoos, the numbers look completely unrealistic, when the size of their designs is taken into account. Some have visitors walking thru each other, and it looks beyond awful.

Larger zoos do have frequent visitor numbers that amount in the thousands, but that is not what we are able to built with the current limitations of Planet Zoo, most of the zoos that can be built are small in size and number of species, and unrealistic design choices create further clusters of human visitors everywhere you look. Since we are now mentioning technology and game performances, many also attribute the lag in the game to the visitors and the constant jams found within the path system in the game. If either the number of possible visitors is significantly reduced, or as you mention just visually reduced while still being a part of the game (to appease those interested mainly in the financial management aspect of the game) then wouldn't this allow for the visitors to finally look human?

 

[LN]

So the questions are, does it bother you that the certain aspects of the game look like cartoons? Why do you think Frontier went with look for the game? Lastly, do you think that this would/should be changed in the future?

No
It's in the same Universe as Planco. Design Choice made in 2014 probably.
No

 

[Firestar97]

It would be so great if they would change the male Lion a bit. But I think they mentioned once that they don't change it. I hope they change their mind one Day. I don't really dislike the Appearance but I would like it to look more realistic

 

[Danny_zoo]

I think the cartoony male lion and guests have nothing to do with the target audience. The guests are recycled from PlanCo, which doesn't strive as hard for realism. I wish they weren't, but I don't know if they'll be changed. For the male lion, my theory is at the very beginning of development when it wasn't even a zoo game yet, and more a safari simulator, it was probably one of the first things designed. The team simply wasn't as good at designing animals, and it never was changed. I think besides the guests and male lion, everything else is very realistic. Hopefully they'll change those two, but the game is rated 10+ anyway, and most of it doesn't seemed aimed at younger audiences.

Interesting that it was never intended for a younger audience. The scenery in the game is amazing, I have no issues with that. When it comes to the animals in particular some of the carnivores I might be a bit too picky, since I have been creating miniature animal sculptures for years, and I do strive for realism when creating them. As an artist, I'm not sure that I agree with the theory that the game developers were just so off at the beginning of their development. Hear me out, as an artist you do progress significantly depending on your skill level and creativity based on experience, time spent on a project and just as importantly love and dedication for this project. So far that goes in perfect harmony with your theory, however based on some of the work in recent DLCs and even the base game, the level of artistic talent that the developers possess is superb and way above average. Meaning that for an artist of this caliber, capturing the majestic look of a lion or tiger should not be difficult, the complete opposite, because nature is speaking to you.

I'm aware, that the game, especially the base game had many individuals involved, and that it is quite possible that the same individual who created the dingo as an example (beautiful piece) was not the one who worked on the lion. In any case, I do agree with you that a lot it was recycled from Planet Coaster, to save time and resources, and the lion was more than likely one of the first animals produced. I do wish that they revisit some of this early visions and give them due justice, or at least allow outside artists to assist thru modding.

 

[LN]

I wanted to add, I have a strong feeling the people in Planet Zoo and Coaster have very much in common with the peeps in RCT3.
For which I believe they are an improvement of that. But the peeps are not the focus of the game, nor for Planet Coaster or Planet Zoo, so for that reason I believe they look that cartoony/simplistic.

 

[peafowl]

The zebras and male lion lacks realism in my opinion. And to me that ruins some game experience, i havent owned lions, one of my IRL favorites, in game yet for this reason. Really hope they can change them.

 

[Indoraptor27]

The zebras and male lion lacks realism in my opinion. And to me that ruins some game experience, i havent owned lions, one of my IRL favorites, in game yet for this reason. Really hope they can change them.

I don't have problem with zebras. I have noticed that the Bengal tiger model could stand an update, ours are a bit fluffy, but in real life they have very short fur, sort of like a horse's. It would definitely make the ingame Siberians have more noticeable differences.

 

[Danny_zoo]

I wanted to add, I have a strong feeling the people in Planet Zoo and Coaster have very much in common with the peeps in RCT3.
For which I believe they are an improvement of that. But the peeps are not the focus of the game, nor for Planet Coaster or Planet Zoo, so for that reason I believe they look that cartoony/simplistic.

That is an interesting angle, I never played any other game than Planet Coaster, and even that was just to prepared for Planet Zoo. I agree that the human characters are not the focus of the zoo, the very reason why it does not bother me to play with a close zoo. But when I look at the human characters found within Jurassic Park Evolution, or even the upcoming PK game, i do wonder how incredibly amazing it would be to have zoo visitors in this game, that looked and behaved as real human beings. I do understand that for the players that are mostly focused on the management aspect it might not mean much. But for the Planet Zoo audience that loves to create realistic designs having a realistic number of visitors given the layouts of the parks and them looking like actual humans would be an amazing improvement.

 

[marcnesiumHH]

We have discussed so many things in this forum when it comes to this amazing game, yet the stylized choice for Planet Zoo given its audience dose seem like a very underrated discussion.

Imo most of the different aspects of this have already been discussed - that had even started before the release of the Beta. I appreciate your dediction, esp. from a designer's perspective - but I think that you are heavily overstating what Frontier is willing to invest in an already released game.
PZ was a quick and relatively cheap port from Planet Coaster, in the Beta version we still had 1:1 copied text in game settings and sub-tabs. In a condensed version: they took the existing game, cut the coasters, added animals and closely related stuff. Most of the building pieces are just reskins from PC stuff. There had been no (huge) changes to guests, to all this non-zoo related entertainment stuff like ballons etc.
I mean they even already officially said that there will be no changes to snowing in July or guests in short cloths complaining about freezing in the taiga biome. Why would they then be willing to invest in a whole revamp of guest lookings?

TLDR: when it comes to 'realistic' wishes for the current game, yes, they could streamline the different art styles a little bit like the comic looking lion (heavily and frequently critized since release by many players) or like the pretty bad fonts for signs, which do not fit realistic building pieces. But from all what I can draw from their behavior since now, I don't see them doing a whole revamp like other games sometimes do when a new Art Director comes on board.

When it comes to the performance impact by guests (and their poor AI behavior as well) there have been many threads on this forum. Neither has been any reply by Frontier yet nor they - unfortunately - changed anything in the game yet.

 

[peafowl]

I don't have problem with zebras. I have noticed that the Bengal tiger model could stand an update, ours are a bit fluffy, but in real life they have very short fur, sort of like a horse's. It would definitely make the ingame Siberians have more noticeable differences.

I do. Their faces are too short and round compared to real life.

 

[Danny_zoo]

The zebras and male lion lacks realism in my opinion. And to me that ruins some game experience, i havent owned lions, one of my IRL favorites, in game yet for this reason. Really hope they can change them.

I understand exactly what you mean, just as there are many visual stimulants found within the game, that inspire to keep on playing, there are those that act in the opposite way. The lions just to be an easy fix, since I found a mod that looked a lot more realistic, even though all of that is dead now. One animal that really kills it for me in the game is the Orangutan, as their iconic fur is missing, it does not help that it does not behave like an Orangutan, and it mostly seems like a carbon copy of the Gorilla.

This might be a perfect example of why Frontier does not add animals to the game that are not yet ready for it. The Orangutan should have never been release the way it looks and behaves as it just kills the soul of that animal. I do wonder if the fur will ever be revisited, or at least add the real animations of this animal so it behaves properly. Until that day I act like it does not exist.

 

[shirandhak]

We have discussed so many things in this forum when it comes to this amazing game, yet the stylized choice for Planet Zoo given its audience dose seem like a very underrated discussion. I'm of the opinion that the artist and developers behind Planet Zoo are some of the very best in the industry, meaning that anything related to the way that Planet Zoo looks has been a choice to them, and not a lack of designing ability or technological shortcoming, as this is a thread about visuals.

It is clear, judging by the many arguments about it within the forum that many of you think that many animals found within the game would benefit from added realism instead of the cartoonist look they were given. The lion and mostly all of the other carnivores come to mind as some of the most obvious discrepancies with reality. Outside mods have been able to capture the beautiful and majestic realism of some of this animals in much greater detail than Frontier cared to do, so question is why?

This stylized choice is of course not limited to the animals, it is found through out the game, the most obvious example at least to me are the human characters, they just awful in every way. The choice of design for visitors and staff is such a detrimental aspect of this game, that for me, there has never been another choice but to play with a close zoo. Early on, I do remember one of the videos where a community manager mentioned that they just did not want to spend the additional resources and time in making the humans match the animals and the amazing scenery, so they were recycled for the early Planet Coaster days. I do however wonder if this was the only reason, as the game seemed to have been marketed as very child friendly, and it would be understandable that you would want some similarities with cartoons. However when I have interacted with many of you in this forum and looked thru the thousands of social media and YouTube uploads out there in relation to the game, it seems that almost everyone playing are adults, so what happened there?

I will give you another example, recently I was at a friends house, who has a 6 year old kid, having my laptop with me I went ahead and tried as I usually do to promote the game. The father did buy the game for the child, but he just does not play since it finds it too complicated and formal. On a different opportunity I was boasting about this amazing game to a 19 year old that works in a Zoo and his extremely dedicated to animals and anything nature related. When she got to play the game, while thankful for my recommendation, she did mention her great disappointment that many of the animals looked like cartoons instead of a bit more realistic. I uploaded one of the lion mods, that changed its appearance, and it was an instant game changer to her.

So the questions are, does it bother you that the certain aspects of the game look like cartoons? Why do you think Frontier went with look for the game? Lastly, do you think that this would/should be changed in the future?

I would love to give you more than just one like, if it only were possible!

I HATE this cartoony look especially of the guests and even more of the staff. With the animals, I try to use only the not so cartoony ones.
But what troubles me most, is the fact that since the last update the zookeepers make that ridiculous jump in the air, if the animals don't need to be fed. I mean.... what the heck! First it looks so much ridiculous that I could scream (it really hurts my soul!) and second: it's their job to feed the animals, if they don't like so, they should quit their jobs. They should be GLAD to feed the animals!

I found that I, since the last update (that with the jump) I tend even more to only building. I can close my zoos for the guests, I can pick my animals for their realistic look, but I can't lock out the damn zookeepers.

I know they (?) keep telling you that the guest look so cartoony because of the lag - but really: I would rather have more lag if I could have realistic looking guests. They even don't need to be so detailed - but in the right propotions with realistic looking moves, please! And PLEASE, Frontier, ... take out those silly looking hats! They look like a child's nightmare!

I hope, we'll get an update some time in the future, where we'll need less guests to get our franchise zoos going and that there will be an algorithm for the guests, so that not every guest has to be simulated/shown.

 

[Indoraptor27]

I understand exactly what you mean, just as there are many visual stimulants found within the game, that inspire to keep on playing, there are those that act in the opposite way. The lions just to be an easy fix, since I found a mod that looked a lot more realistic, even though all of that is dead now. One animal that really kills it for me in the game is the Orangutan, as their iconic fur is missing, it does not help that it does not behave like an Orangutan, and it mostly seems like a carbon copy of the Gorilla.

This might be a perfect example of why Frontier does not add animals to the game that are not yet ready for it. The Orangutan should have never been release the way it looks and behaves as it just kills the soul of that animal. I do wonder if the fur will ever be revisited, or at least add the real animations of this animal so it behaves properly. Until that day I act like it does not exist.

Planet Zoo could do what ARK does and "TLC" older creatures. That would be a great addition.

 

[Danny_zoo]

Imo most of the different aspects of this have already been discussed - that had even started before the release of the Beta. I appreciate your dediction, esp. from a designer's perspective - but I think that you are heavily overstating what Frontier is willing to invest in an already released game.
PZ was a quick and relatively cheap port from Planet Coaster, in the Beta version we still had 1:1 copied text in game settings and sub-tabs. In a condensed version: they took the existing game, cut the coasters, added animals and closely related stuff. Most of the building pieces are just reskins from PC stuff. There had been no (huge) changes to guests, to all this non-zoo related entertainment stuff like ballons etc.
I mean they even already officially said that there will be no changes to snowing in July or guests in short cloths complaining about freezing in the taiga biome. Why would they then be willing to invest of a whole revamp of guest looings?

TLDR: when it comes to 'realistic' wishes for the current game, yes, they could streamline the different art styles a little bit like the comic looking lion (heavily and frequently critized since release by many players) or like the pretty bad fonts for signs, which do not fit realistic building pieces. But from all what I can draw from their behavior since now, I don't see them doing a whole revamp like other games sometimes do when a new Art Director comes on board.

When it comes to the performance impact by guests (and their poor AI behavior as well) there have been many threads on this forum. Neither has been any reply by Frontier yet nor they - unfortunately - changed anything in the game yet.

Really interesting to read your thoughts in the matter. I honestly was not aware that the issue had been so vastly discussed within the forum (aside from the carton lion) While I understand where most of your thoughts come from, I really do, there seems to be a bit of a contrast in this game. It seems at times that it is the work of two different factions, two teams united on creating a zoo game with two completely different visions of it.

As you well said, something that I have mention before, a lot of material found within the game seems not only to be recycled from Planet Zoo, but have absolutely nothing to do with zoos and what is found there. I wrote in a thread before that while all the shop signs and art does make sense when you are looking at it from a theme park point of view (Planet Coaster) it makes absolutely no sense to a zoo, something like chief beef, cosmic cow, pod pizza, has nothing to do with zoos. Even recently with the vending machines release, they were just generic copies of all of this poor choice of design. They could have released vending machines with animal inspired art on it, or anything else that relates directly to what you would expect to find within a zoo.

At the same time, I see so much talent in some of their work, from beautiful scenery to excellent construction pieces that relate perfectly to zoo building. Not everything is a copy of Planet Coaster, some of it is quite beautiful and even unique to the game. The animals are by far the best creations of their kind in the video game industry, and the piece by piece concept is just beyond incredible. Could it be that the difference in dedication to this game, comes from management? You can not blame an artist if a team lead or manager tells him/her to cut corners and just go with what they have. Sometimes I wish I could pick inside the world of Frontier and see where things go wrong and right for this game. Planet Zoo has so much incredible potential, and it would be a shame if such a talented group of artist are handicapped by imposed limitations. The game is a worldwide phenomenon now, so things could change.

 

[Danny_zoo]

I would love to give you more than just one like, if it only were possible!

I HATE this cartoony look especially of the guests and even more of the staff. With the animals, I try to use only the not so cartoony ones.
But what troubles me most, is the fact that since the last update the zookeepers make that ridiculous jump in the air, if the animals don't need to be fed. I mean.... what the heck! First it looks so much ridiculous that I could scream (it really hurts my soul!) and second: it's their job to feed the animals, if they don't like so, they should quit their jobs. They should be GLAD to feed the animals!

I found that I, since the last update (that with the jump) I tend even more to only building. I can close my zoos for the guests, I can pick my animals for their realistic look, but I can't lock out the damn zookeepers.

I know they (?) keep telling you that the guest look so cartoony because of the lag - but really: I would rather have more lag if I could have realistic looking guests. They even don't need to be so detailed - but in the right propotions with realistic looking moves, please! And PLEASE, Frontier, ... take out those silly looking hats! They look like a child's nightmare!

I hope, we'll get an update some time in the future, where we'll need less guests to get our franchise zoos going and that there will be an algorithm for the guests, so that not every guest has to be simulated/shown.

You are not alone, I think there are so many of us that feel the same way, I'm constantly asking players opinions, and have promoted this game to everyone I know that could potentially be interested in playing. In short most of the feedback is that the game looks beautiful, what is wrong with the human characters looking so off, sadly not many see the shortcomings on some of the animals, but that is understandable.

While I agree with everything you have said, I do worry that sacrificing game performance for enhanced visuals is not a compromise many would be willing to take. But there is really no reason for it to be one or the other, since decreasing the game's visitor count, or keeping that number only for management/finance purposes would/should balance things out. I'm still not sold on the concept that changing the stylized appearance of a visitor/staff does and will impact game performance significantly, I would love for someone with extensive video game technological expertise to expand on this.

In any case, you also mention unrealistic behavior and movements, like the constant running and now jumping, the ridiculous boxes flying over the air etc. Even for me, to whom realism and quality of design in this game is everything, that is impossible to avoid. As you well mention, I can close my zoo, thus keeping visitors out, change the way the game was intended to be played and create my own pathways, therefore negating its biggest design flaw the path system. But the one thing I can not do is get rid of the unrealistic looking staff, and some of the science fiction animation like flying boxes and the likes. In short as many have now suggested, no meaningful change might come at least within this version of the game, our only hope is a Planet Zoo sequel, and even then if those making decisions are not persuaded or replaced, we would end up with the same. A friend from this forum that happens to be completely in tune with the video game world, did mention to me that management at Frontier is extremely stubborn and once they are set on their ways, it is very difficult to look outside the tunnel for them. This same individual mention that they are not keen on bringing outside help and rarely significantly expand their workforce. I do hope that the success of Planet Zoo and overwhelming public demand when it comes to many of these issues does have some sort of consequence in the future.

 

[marcnesiumHH]

The animals are by far the best creations of their kind in the video game industry

Yeah, that's for sure. Still, as we kind of already nailed it down in this thread, it's a pretty safe bet that at least a large portion of the design inconsistency comes from the fact that large parts of PC were just ported to the game and all the animal related things were intended to be more realistic as a goal, in general. Additionally, with a larger team and Frontier also frequently working with external designers, it's a tough task to keep things very consistent.

As an example, there also have been other lion's appearances in the concept phase. Why have they finally chosen a more cartoony look? Who knows.

 

[danny420]

i have zero problems with the "graphical style" of both planet zoo and planet coaster. for me its a special style that always reminds me right aways of these games. i would actually be disappointed if they would completely change the style for the next game.

 

[Indoraptor27]

Yeah, that's for sure. Still, as we kind of already nailed it down in this thread, it's a pretty safe bet that at least a large portion of the design inconsistency comes from the fact that large parts of PC were just ported to the game and all the animal related things were intended to be more realistic as a goal, in general. Additionally, with a larger team and also Frontier frequently works with external designers, it's a tough task to keep things very consistent.

As en example, there also have been other lion's appearances in the concept phase. why thy have finally chosen a more cartoony look? Who knows.
View attachment 187520

Those lions are beautiful! Ours looks like it spends two hours a day grooming. I womder why they chose this one instead of one of those. I feel there is a decent possibility of this being added. Variations started the same way, a thread with a lot of support. Eventually the devs said they'd do it, and they did.