Ship interiors never going to happen.

[DemiserofD]

Ok, just to put an end to this debate about ship interiors - what the intent was, or even if they really meant to include them at all:

I used to use this video as evidence for those people, much like the poster above and others like them in this thread, who said Space Legs itself would NEVER come because either Elite was NEVER a legs game, or the concept is WAY too hard to develop, or it was NEVER the intent of the DEVELOPERS, only phony losers who couldn't just accept the game for what it is and they should just leave and let the REAL fans keep playing. Others in this thread tried to point to the simple statement of Braben in that video about the future from 2012, and that should be enough. Well it seems it's not, so here's a much more compelling one from 2014, one that demonstrated the intense desire of the dev team to include not just Space Legs but also ship interiors:

For anyone who doesn't want to watch, they include 16 clips of different team members (including a couple repeats - Braben twice), where they're all describing their most ANTICIPATED FUTURE FEATURE. Of the 16, 11 require Space Legs. But guess what else? Of the 11 Space Legs features, SIX of them require INTERIORS.

Pay special attention to Jo Taylor at around 2:00 who states outright that they designed each and every ship meticulously to include interiors, and they actually show you a little demo they did of a mocked-up interior.

It was never about PRACTICALITY it was always about IMMERSION!

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yd-m9AR7mY


So if you want to say that Frontier won't do it because they either let it go, or don't have the resources, or don't have the money, or will abandon difficult features going forward, fine, believe whatever you want. But don't ever say they didn't intend to do it, or that they only saw it as a practical implementation forced by other design choices. They wanted to do it because it's WHAT THEY WANTED TO PLAY.

And then time passed, features were implemented, they realized that some of those potential features weren't worth the dev time they would take to implement.

Specifically, they realized that ship interiors would not provide a significant amount of actual gameplay content, and they wisely decided not to implement them.

Look, don't take what I'm saying the wrong way; if I could snap my fingers and get ship interiors tomorrow, I'd do it.

But the reality is, if we get ship interiors, we must sacrifice something else; something that took an equal amount of dev time. If that is to be the case, I would much rather have that dev time focused on something that actually has real potential for significant gameplay, not something that most players will almost certainly ignore after the first five minutes.

 

[SpongeJim]

And then time passed, features were implemented, they realized that some of those potential features weren't worth the dev time they would take to implement.

Specifically, they realized that ship interiors would not provide a significant amount of actual gameplay content, and they wisely decided not to implement them.

Look, don't take what I'm saying the wrong way; if I could snap my fingers and get ship interiors tomorrow, I'd do it.

But the reality is, if we get ship interiors, we must sacrifice something else; something that took an equal amount of dev time. If that is to be the case, I would much rather have that dev time focused on something that actually has real potential for significant gameplay, not something that most players will almost certainly ignore after the first five minutes.

All the same arguments used by Space Legs detractors for years, as if they were insiders at Frontier. They said things like "they OBVIOUSLY want atmospheric planets" or "they OBVIOUSLY want explorable gas giants" or "they OBVIOUSLY want to implement more land vehicles". You have no idea what they will do in the future, nor do I. But we both know from the ACTUAL EVIDENCE what game they WANT TO PLAY. That will always be the best evidence of what they will do until proven otherwise. Whatever you're thinking is next might be your preference - and it might even happen - but don't try to project that onto FDev when you have no idea.

 

[askavir]

This is exactly the same discussion we had for these past few years over space legs. People pointed out it's been in the plan all along since the beginning (and reiterated by the devs after release), other people cover their eyes and ears "blah blah there's nothing to do blah blah plans change".

The outcome will most likely be the same as well, so I'm good.

 

[Dextio]

So negative man. Just give them time. If it comes out, great, if it doesn't, it doesn't. No use getting salty about such things.
They're a limited studio trying to get the essentials done for a continual e2e space sim. They've been working on the basics since they came out, which is great, because this stuff isn't simple. If it was, star citizen or something like it would've come out long ago. Frankly, it's amazing they have done what they've done. They are just finding out how to incorporate first person into this game.

Frontier knows ship interiors are important, and everyone wants them, but sh*t takes work. There are lot of ships out there. Also know that once they come out with this feature, every ship they develop/release will involve a whole new interior design, they must also maintain it, which consumes that much more dev resources (resources that you would otherwise want on other things)

 

[KiruHoshino]

The ship interiors give to the players a lot of multicrew opportunity. You can hire npc crew members who can help you in your journey. Crews of various professions. Mechanic, pilot, gunner etc... If your ship get a damage in a space fight you can give a command your crew member how repair the ship. So the game isn't about having to run back and forth on your empty spaceship yourself. The crew fills it with life. They can walk down the corridors, relax in a lounge room. You can think about it. There are many possibilities.

 

[babelfisch]

Except that they were officially announced, not just talked about during the Kickstarter. It wasn't "that might be nice", it was, "we will be doing this".

No, that's not how it was. Nothing was really officially announced during Kickstarter.

 

[DemiserofD]

All the same arguments used by Space Legs detractors for years, as if they were insiders at Frontier. They said things like "they OBVIOUSLY want atmospheric planets" or "they OBVIOUSLY want explorable gas giants" or "they OBVIOUSLY want to implement more land vehicles". You have no idea what they will do in the future, nor do I. But we both know from the ACTUAL EVIDENCE what game they WANT TO PLAY. That will always be the best evidence of what they will do until proven otherwise. Whatever you're thinking is next might be your preference - and it might even happen - but don't try to project that onto FDev when you have no idea.

The principal difference being, Space Legs outside your ship actually adds new content. Space legs inside do not.

I'll admit, I'm shaky on the fps combat thing. It's a BIG shift in direction for Elite, and could easily go wrong. I'm worried. If it goes bad, the whole company could be shaken.

But at the very least, I'll admit that it does have huge potential for additional gameplay. Gameplay that is different from what we've seen thus far, true, but gameplay nonetheless.

Ship interiors, by contrast, do not. Every realistic aspect that ship interiors could potentially have exploited, has already been automated years ago.

If they can find something to do with interiors, bully for them. But I find that unlikely. And the LAST thing I want is ship interiors added purely to sate the masses, with no function or concept of what it's actually meant to be USED for.

 

[SpongeJim]

The principal difference being, Space Legs outside your ship actually adds new content. Space legs inside do not.

I'll admit, I'm shaky on the fps combat thing. It's a BIG shift in direction for Elite, and could easily go wrong. I'm worried. If it goes bad, the whole company could be shaken.

But at the very least, I'll admit that it does have huge potential for additional gameplay. Gameplay that is different from what we've seen thus far, true, but gameplay nonetheless.

Ship interiors, by contrast, do not. Every realistic aspect that ship interiors could potentially have exploited, has already been automated years ago.

If they can find something to do with interiors, bully for them. But I find that unlikely. And the LAST thing I want is ship interiors added purely to sate the masses, with no function or concept of what it's actually meant to be USED for.

This is again you simply projecting your own experience, desires and limit of imagination onto the entire world of game players, developers, designers and Braben himself. You should probably watch the video, it seems you didn't. You don't even need to imagine the possibilities, several posters on this thread have already described them to you. I see you are either ignoring them, skipping them, or figure it's not in your interest, and that's fine. But please don't project your own limits and narrow desires onto everyone else, it's tiresome.

 

[DemiserofD]

This is again you simply projecting your own experience, desires and limit of imagination onto the entire world of game players, developers, designers and Braben himself. You should probably watch the video, it seems you didn't. You don't even need to imagine the possibilities, several posters on this thread have already described them to you. I see you are either ignoring them, skipping them, or figure it's not in your interest, and that's fine. But please don't project your own limits and narrow desires onto everyone else, it's tiresome.

Oh, don't worry. I've watched every video people have suggested I watch.

What are the proposals they actually mention? Braben proposes seeing the damage from the inside, and being able to repair it. This was replaced by repair limpets and AFMUs. Someone else mentions zero-g combat, but that's got nothing to do with ship interiors. They mention boarding, but boarding is rendered completely irrelevant by the simple virtue of existence of the self destruct button.

And that's it. That's all they propose. All the other suggestions have to do with leaving your ship, not faffing about inside it.

I don't like being the bearer of bad news. I don't like breaking people's hopes. But what people need to realize is that they're projecting an idealized daydream of the reality they would actually experience, which is nowhere near as realistic or enjoyable as what they imagine.

My only goal is to be pragmatic about these things, and to achieve the most enjoyable gameplay experience that is realistically possible. And ship interiors, at the current juncture, just don't fit with any sort of realistic predictions of actual content.

If I could snap my fingers and get ship interiors, I would. But I'd much rather spend that snap on something more worthwhile.

 

[Maolagin]

This is exactly the same discussion we had for these past few years over space legs. People pointed out it's been in the plan all along since the beginning (and reiterated by the devs after release), other people cover their eyes and years "blah blah there's nothing to do blah blah plans change".

The outcome will most likely be the same as well, so I'm good.

Pretty much where I come down too. Frontier wants Elite to be around for the long haul, and they accomplish that by continuing to add content. Now that they've laid the groundwork of walking around interiors, I'd imagine that if Elite sticks around long enough, they'll eventually start expanding what you can walk around inside.

But it'll be a while yet, I should think. Elite ships are big, and the interior of an Anaconda is going to be the size of a large game level, all on its own, before you even get to the part where players are reconfiguring the internals willy-nilly. It is, to reverse a metaphor, fairly high-hanging fruit.

 

[[PS4] Filthymick420]

you seems to be very angry about ED, Frontier and Braben.
Why don't you take a break and forget about this game? your life would be much better.

I love the game. I just don't like being lied to. Do you like being lied to? No one does.


What I like more than ED though, throwing gas on the fire

 

[Angus]

No, that's not how it was. Nothing was really officially announced during Kickstarter.

Wrong. Check the FAQ.

 

[Pcolapat]

People have been playing EVE online for 18 years. This game is a youngster compared to EVE. Games like this have long lifespans. It will come. It will come and will be grand.

 

[DemiserofD]

Wrong. Check the FAQ.

I don't see anything in the FAQ about ship interiors.

 

[Lysette]

People have been playing EVE online for 18 years. This game is a youngster compared to EVE. Games like this have long lifespans. It will come. It will come and will be grand.

yeah, but EVE online gets updates all the time and they are free - given that in the end you have to be subscribed to enjoy the game long term. But EVE is changing all the time and they have nearly perfect balancing of all the ships, plenty of ships as well (358 iirc) and tens of thousands of modules to fit your ships with. it has a real player driven economy - a game like this can go on for many decades, because it is maintained very well (rarely ever encountered a bug) and despite it's age it doesn't get old. Nearly everything is produced by players and destroyed by players - this makes industry and pvp two sides of the same coin - they go hand in hand - a genius approach to have peaceful players together with PvP players in the same game and both are mutually beneficial to each other.

But both games - EVE and as well ED - are still run by their original creators - both passionate visionary people. Where these games will go when these key figures won't be there any longer is quite questionable. EVE resp. CCP is owned by Pearl Abyss now and what they will do in the end with it, we will have to see.

 

[CMDR Maxus]

How would you interpret what he said?

Honestly id interpret it as someone who is trying to sell the game as is. If it was a feature he'd be talking it up, because in the end he is trying to market the game in the most appealing way.

 

[Lysette]

Seems we are getting station interiors without game play related to it - and you expect ship interiors - good luck with that.

 

[babelfisch]

Wrong. Check the FAQ.

I guess you refer to this part:

"Can I leave the space ship?

Yes, but not in the initial release. The core release of the game focusses on the ships and space. We'll then be working to expand the game. This includes exploring your ship and space stations. The potential content for Elite is huge,so we're keeping a sensible strategy to add to the game in stages."

You are right, somehow missed that one over all these years. I just remembered Brabens videos which are full of 'if' and 'maybe'.

 

[Lysette]

those station hubs are not "exploring stations" yet - that is just a different kind of interface to the former UI system, including on-foot related stuff. This is nothing like what exploring the station would mean.

 

[askavir]

I guess you refer to this part:

"Can I leave the space ship?
Yes, but not in the initial release. The core release of the game focusses on the ships and space. We'll then be working to expand the game. This includes exploring your ship and space stations. The potential content for Elite is huge,so we're keeping a sensible strategy to add to the game in stages."

You are right, somehow missed that one over all these years. I just remembered Brabens videos which are full of 'if' and 'maybe'.

Years after that, in newsletter #32 (quoted here under "roadmap" https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/wiki/Space_Legs) that was sent at the time of ther initial release of the Horizons expansion, FD reiterated that in the future we would be able to walk the interior of our ships, starports and planet surfaces, in an article to promote the sale of lifetime expansion passes. "Major new features will include planetary landings and even walking around inside ships, stations, and planet surfaces with time".

As FD is following their plan, I'm pretty convinced ship interiors will be added at some point in the future. I actually had more doubts about planet surfaces, and yet here we are on the verge of getting them.