General PMF Removal State for BGS

Recently my squadron has been trying to implement our own PMF. We find a lot of good systems only to be disqualified by an inactive native pmf.

I suggest a new state for pmfs called "disbursement" or "disbandment" This would be a state that is triggered once that pmf has retreated from all systems and is sitting idle at 1% for a certain time period in the native system.

This simple automated system would eliminate any inactive pmf that are just taking up space. Just a thought .
 
no
just no
as pmf's, these are markers for where we were.
you are new
we were here long ago.
if we leave, we EARNED our markers and its far more fitting that they remain.
SOME are reminders to others on how not to behave.
Some are heroic and should be immortalized.
and that this locks new pmf's out of many systems is fine.
Its called History.
Forget it, remove it and guess what, it get repeated.
it'll get repeated anyway, not the point though.

and because for many its a lifetime account, they(we) just might come take our stuff back someday.
so, No.
 
not to mention
I really want to know how people are thinking or coming to the conclusion they are inactive.
only way you can know is if YOU are that same person.
You don't know how many accounts the person has/had or how many people were the creators of said pmf
you can get some of the info, but never all unless you are/were that pmf
 
That's a horrible reason against the argument. What difference does it make if you aren't there to see the "history" it's taking up space. There are many factions that have been considered squatter factions. I've been in this game since it came out. If you want your stuff back then reapply stop taking up space.
 
Yeah, I wish we could remove dead factions... ah well

Edit: I have pushed a few back to only be in the one system, I hope some of them came back for Odyssey 😈
 
that was my point
who says they ARE abandoned
its someone elses stuff.
not even fdev knows if the person or persons are gone forever.
but somehow you know these things.
this thread is how many now on this topic?

and the response is identical every thread.
These were earned by money, by credits, by sweat, by lots of time.
They are Monuments.
And deserve respect.
 
Recently my squadron has been trying to implement our own PMF. We find a lot of good systems only to be disqualified by an inactive native pmf.

I suggest a new state for pmfs called "disbursement" or "disbandment" This would be a state that is triggered once that pmf has retreated from all systems and is sitting idle at 1% for a certain time period in the native system.
This would not free up any significant number of systems.

There are a lot of PMFs which never took system control, but most of the time those systems have since been captured by another PMF.

Currently:
- approximately 15500 systems have at least one PMF present (controlling or not)
- approximately 11300 systems are under PMF control

So you might think implementing this sort of filter would clean up about 4000 systems. Unfortunately, no. Most of the systems with a PMF present but not in control the PMF is non-native and has expanded from a system where it is in control.

The harshest possible "inactivity" filter (incredibly strong compared with your suggestion, massively unfair) would be to remove all PMFs which do not control any systems, even if:
- they are present in more than one system
- they control stations but not the system
- they only just lost control yesterday
- they were only founded yesterday
...doesn't matter: no system control = gone

This filter - which would be so ridiculously harsh that it would for quite some time have eliminated Lave Radio, though they're safe now - would only make another 800 systems or so eligible for PMF addition, because most of the factions it got rid of have already been overrun by another PMF in those systems.

800 systems is nothing, in this context - the normal rate of PMF expansion and addition gets through 800 systems every few months.

A fairer filter - and the one you suggest is not unreasonable in that sense - would free up space in so few systems that it would almost certainly take Frontier longer to implement the filter than it would buy them in time against the pace of system capture.

If you want one of those 800 systems which does only contain an "inactive" PMF, then get yourself added to a rubbish system nearby, expand in, and take it. If the PMF is genuinely inactive ... and there isn't a strongly player-backed NPC faction or Powerplay control group managing the system, of course! ... you should be able to take control quite quickly.





I do sympathise because there is a genuine major problem here - PMFs are taking new systems either by addition or capture (mostly capture) at a rate of 200-250 per month or so. At this rate, basically all systems will have a PMF (an active one, usually) controlling or present in about two years time. The rate of new system population is by comparison non-existent (and there are good reasons not to allow too much sprawl because for the non-PMF parts of the game the bubble is generally already too big) so there will soon be no space left at all.

This has been an obvious problem for some time, but there's no sign of a good solution, and removing inactive factions is so small an effect it barely matters. In the meantime I'd recommend getting your PMF in to wherever is left, and if you want more systems, capture and fight for them.
 
I agree with you there. The problem is the new pmf requirements cannot have any native or non-native player factions and can't have 7 or more present. A lot of systems found either have 7 factions with a player faction and or a native pmf just sitting at 1% for the past month. So whether they have control or not is irrelevant. As long as they are in the system you cannot be placed there.
 
Last edited:
Also by no means am I saying this should be a quick process. I'd say the system should wait 6 weeks at least. If in that time your group wasn't able to get above the 1% mark I'd say your pretty much inactive. And that's after you've lost positions in all other systems.
 
Also by no means am I saying this should be a quick process. I'd say the system should wait 6 weeks at least. If in that time your group wasn't able to get above the 1% mark I'd say your pretty much inactive. And that's after you've lost positions in all other systems.
At current rate that would eliminate all anarchy pmfs in 2 months*ish .


I don't think that would be a good idea: (Removing pmfs)
I vote no to this.
 
At current rate that would eliminate all anarchy pmfs in 2 months*ish .
Yes, this - under the current and especially the post-Odyssey BGS - is a particular problem.

An Anarchy faction can extremely easily just through passing traffic be permanently at 1%. There's some NPC ones out my way that have stayed that way for quite some time and the evidence so far is that Odyssey consequences are making it worse for them.

A non-Anarchy faction benefits much more strongly from passing traffic, so in any semi-busy system is likely to naturally hover around 5-10%. e.g. in https://cdb.sotl.org.uk/systems/61/history no-one is specifically supporting the Independent Agricultural Union ... but passing traffic has kept it hovering safely around the 7% mark for years now.
 
So why would an anarchy PMF be stuck at 1% if the player group is active and working for the PMF? Even if it's anarchy. I do see you point for the npc's keeping inactive pmfs above the 1% mark. And that's a valid issue. But I'm confused on your anarchy point. If you created and are supporting an anarchy pmf actively you should be able to keep it above the 1% mark no problem. Also keep in mind that your example is for a non-pmf. I'm not advocating for the elimination of NPC minor factions just idle PMFs.
 
Meh, not this one again! If you want to remove factions to make room, rather remove those boring procedurally generated ones. Even abandoned PMFs at least tend to have non-generic names.
 
Now that I can agree with haha. There was also a huge boom of NPC faction expansion to a lot of systems pushing the counts to 7 and even 8. Which is so annoying since you cant go to a system with 7 or more factions already established. And trying to work to kick out a faction plus time that with your application is like juggling on a horse.
 
Recently my squadron has been trying to implement our own PMF. We find a lot of good systems only to be disqualified by an inactive native pmf.

It's not your PMF. You have an option to add a Minor Faction to the game but you do not own it and anyone can support it or not.

CMDR Justinian Octavius
 
You can have one "dead" pmf removed by paying with one carrier from one squadron member. Each time. And it's permanent - they can never buy one again.

This is why I get paid the big bucks.
 
So why would an anarchy PMF be stuck at 1% if the player group is active and working for the PMF?
Because there are in the BGS major pressures against Anarchy factions, which have got significantly more severe with the release of Odyssey. Major active Anarchy PMFs are under serious threat right now.

But the point was more the other way round - only an Anarchy faction will drop to 1% long-term through inaction in even a moderately busy system. All non-Anarchy factions can hover well clear of 1% simply through a fairly small amount of passing traffic
 
Back
Top Bottom