Maybe they can afford not to be... 2015 vs 2018
| Accounts | 2015 | 2018 |
|---|---|---|
| Cash | £631,565.00 | £54,144,000.00 |
| Net Worth | £725,546.00 | £59,994,000.00 |
| Total Current Assets | £811,953.00 | £61,037,000.00 |
| Total Current Liabilities | £106,553.00 | £1,332,000.00 |
2-3 Years 100+ devs and this is what we get?
- Thread starter invadershock
- Start date
This was precisely the 'frontier-move-in-mysterious-ways' argument being made again and again in the alpha forums (and mostly to bludgeon any genuine criticism). Of course, there was no magic 'trunk', no super-secret advanced build, nothing to be revealed... The reality was that what we saw in alpha was pretty much exactly what we got. Incredibly, almost every major technical issue was also carried over to release.
In all likelihood, there's nothing else coming. The very most that you can hope for is for them to get the game as it exists at the moment to work properly at some point in the future. I hope they can achieve this.
I don't really understand the arguments that proceed from the perspective that Frontier are somehow morally compromised for being a business. How strange. However, this goes both ways. In return for my money I would hope to receive a working product (and not simply the promise of one). In a different universe a successful launch, critical acclaim and a positive financial performance would encourage Frontier (and others) to invest more time, money and effort in simulationist space games. Win-win.
However, for those that are disappointed in the fundamental game design and lack of content that Odyssey actually offers, the promise of 'it will be fixed' is a relatively cold comfort. This is where many of the 'shut-up-moaning' threads and replies miss the point about the general outcry*. Most people who have spent any time with the game and on these forums have probably learned to temper their expectations over the years. I don't think anyone was really expecting the one-true-spacegame. The fact that Frontier could then set the hurdles so low and still trip over them is genuinely mind-boggling.
It's like having a favourite uncle. Let's call him Uncle Dave. You know he has his terrible faults but you like him a lot. All he needs to do for you today is to not get steaming drunk before the birthday party. He can do that. Right?
Oh. Oh no.
No, Uncle Dave**, I'm not angry... just disappointed.
*general outcry, as in the level of criticism and the broadly negative reception of the the DLC and NOT some of the downright rude behaviour and unpleasant personal attacks on individuals originating on all sides of the argument.
**any replies which attempt to twist or otherwise torturously rework the Uncle Dave metaphor are missing the point ENTIRELY.
I will never understand the mental gymnastics some of y'all will go to, to justify why Odyssey is broken and why we should continue to be grateful to FDev.
As a consumer, it shouldn't be your obligation to be "understanding" of the company making the product. All a consumer should reasonably be expected to do is to simply expect a product that does what it says it can do, and thats it.
I expect a working product regardless of whether the team that made it is only 5 people or 500. If I bought a microwave that has no buttons to actually use it because the company didn't foresee you needing any and now needs to work to add buttons later, should I just sit content with a non functional microwave because the "company is just under stress, be more sympathetic"?
As a consumer, it shouldn't be your obligation to be "understanding" of the company making the product. All a consumer should reasonably be expected to do is to simply expect a product that does what it says it can do, and thats it.
I expect a working product regardless of whether the team that made it is only 5 people or 500. If I bought a microwave that has no buttons to actually use it because the company didn't foresee you needing any and now needs to work to add buttons later, should I just sit content with a non functional microwave because the "company is just under stress, be more sympathetic"?
It's the accountants....
"Companies are run by engineers, then by accountants, then by lawyers, then they are out of business."
As a physicist, I am of the unswervable belief that engineers should never be put in charge of anything.
Life is not an optimisation problem.
Life is not, product design and manufacturing is.
No. It is not.
This is why we get the same tired things over and over again. Engineers are not innovators.
Design is art. Manufacturing is the practical interpretation.
Oh, that is the bullcrap Jobs used to start his little cargo cult, while Woz toiled on making it work and making it useful.
What? Are you saying that Elite Dangerous exists on the same spectrum as Woz and the Apple II?
Also, Jobs wasn't a designer or an artist.
The original Elite most assuredly did when it comes to gaming.
Elite Dangerous though?
Lol, someone needs to take a few business courses.
Reduced to a poor man's CoD Infinite Warfare 2 by accountants and not by genius-level MOS6502 assembly programmers. Now waiting for the lawyers to circle the carcass.
Well, I'm not going to argue with your perception of the game -- but I'm strongly of the belief that many of the faults of Elite Dangerous are precisely because it lacks direction and has been allowed to develop largely on the input of developers / engineers and not by any unifying conceptual vision. Many of it's grindy game systems are strongly indicative of an engineering approach to gameplay.
I'm still not sure what this has to do with Wozniak though (who IS a genius)
I agree. Ive always thought there were plenty of assets in the game. They just dont seem to have the imagination of how to tie them all together for gameplay. Big sandbox, nice toys, no imagination on how to play with them.
How is this helpful? What's your point? It's weird tbh that you all are getting this fired up and emotional to the point you feel like yet another monologue on all these tired points is going to help in any way shape or form.
If you dont like Odyssey, either get a refund and stop playing and go away. Or, contribute in a positive manner so the rest of us can get on with the business of trying to figure out how to make the game better over time. Frontier is listening to feedback and clearly busting hump to make improvements. Insulting them is just poor form.
This toxic complaining stuff just adds noise to the forums. Tbh I wish the mods would move all these posts to one giant "I hate odyssey but I don't know how to provide constructive or respectful criticism" thread.
To be honest, I wish the mods would move all of these posts to the 'I paid £40 for a broken game and I'm happy to take whatever gruel Frontier serve me' thread.
You don't get it though, a lot of us actually find the game enjoyable and are fine with the fact that the things that could use adjusted or fixed are quite likely to be so in the coming weeks. But that in the mean time, we actually enjoy it and find it a real accomplishment of a game. It's not that we are settling for something. It's that we actually think it's good.To be honest, I wish the mods would move all of these posts to the 'I paid £40 for a broken game and I'm happy to take whatever gruel Frontier serve me' thread.
Also, people act like $40 is a lot of money and so a frontier owes us some massive debt. It costs more than $40 to take the family out to the movies. And most AAA games are moving toward shaving fewer than 20 hrs or content. For $40, Odyssey even with a few bugged missions or whatever is actually quite cheap. I'm kind of surprised it doesn't cost more given that it took a team of 100 people years to build. I have 1100 hours in Elite. Most of that pre-horizons. I've got my money's worth. I'm not worried about the $40. But have played 20 hrs of Odyssey so technically have already got a better deal than if I had paid $60 for the new resident evil game which is apparently like 17 hrs long.
Really though. Does this look or feel like a game that took one hundred people years to build?
Everything that is good, immersive or promising about Elite was in the build released following the Kickstarter - which was funded for a modest sum and when Frontier were a tiny company. Everything that has followed has been incrementally iterative. Odyssey is incredibly lazy and doubles down on all of the worst qualities of the game -- the fact that it does this whilst also running at one third of the framerate of Horizons is quite simply the poisoned icing on a cake of death*.
* my hyperbole brings all the boys to the yard.
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