Odyssey - what's the point?

[Winterwalker]

Yes, I’m very surprised. I imagined what David Braben clearly described as his vision of space legs. That is not at all what we got.

A foundation on which to build ...

Looking forward to seeing the (essentially ship related) UI changes .. meanwhile I'm on foot and I don't care, because I'm loving it.

 

[Caydran]

Odyssey seems more like CQC.

Just another shooter mini-game for Elite.

 

[Erei]

A foundation on which to build ...

Looking forward to seeing the (essentially ship related) UI changes .. meanwhile I'm on foot and I don't care, because I'm loving it.

Elite dangerous in its entirety is a foundation of something.
At some point they might want to build something on it ?

 

[Ydiss]

Odyssey seems more like CQC.

Just another shooter mini-game for Elite.

I wish they'd do CQC for EDO...

You're describing one part of EDO, the CZs. It's so much more than that.

The point of EDO is to take the game forward. No matter what new content you may like, in terms of planets, you can't do any of it without doing EDO first. Perhaps it's not the expansion for you but if we're ever going to get new planets, ship and SRV game play alone would not have supported it; there's just so little you can actually do with the interface sat in a cockpit but now we have the ability to get out, it opens up a whole raft of future posibilities.

Oh, and it's fun. There's that. That's the point of games for me.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Yes, I’m very surprised. I imagined what David Braben clearly described as his vision of space legs. That is not at all what we got.

I don't understand this. Have you not been following ED's development?

Remember Powerplay? Remember CQC? Remember multicrew?

I don't think you are that new right? Anyone who has followed ED for any length of time should know that FD have an amazing ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

The only saving grace of ED is there is no other game quite like it by dint of its realistic galaxy and the ships, flight model, etc, as well as for those who have been fans of the franchise since the original it retains the spirit of those original games (at least to some extent).

I still love ED, it remains one of my favourite games of all times, but boy oh boy, some of the decisions....

 

[Mogen Teras]

Anyone who has followed ED for any length of time should know that FD have an amazing ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

I like the way you think.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The lack of integration with either the gameplay or the lore of the space game is frustrating and terminal, until it changes.

You feel like screaming from the rooftops at how terrible this is but its pointless, its all to consoles now. A completely new game bolted onto one station interior as a mission board is.... its so bad its like a last minute uni assignment that you know you left 40% undone and what you have doesn't completely work either... stuffed in the box just to put something in.

...

Can you believe they then have the nuts to go around claiming they didn't know and praising themselves? Thats another level. At least ed lewis didn't have to "do his job" on such a poor showing.

 

[KRONFROMGALVATRON]

As someone with 7k hours, I can empathize to a degree with what you're saying; though, my experience with Odyssey has really been quite different. As you stated, I've done largely everything under the sun in EDH - from large PvP fights down to simple trade for station repair efforts. Up until, I'd say February of this year I was avidly play EDH nearly every other day - with various player groups and so on. But eventually, idk - I petered out (perhaps knowing that EDO was coming soon and I really felt like letting off the gas a bit).

Since EDO released, I'd say I'm on-foot about 70% of the time. I enjoy my gameplay - lots of it is cataloging new organics for Canonn Interstellar through their API plugin, or its spent solo'ing settlements in raids. I'd say you're completely correct that engineering is very optional in EDO - I'm running largely G3 gear, and having no issue wiping out the highest threat CZs/settlements. I'd also agree with you in saying that Odyssey "doesn't really have a point" right now.

But I'd like to remind you, that when Horizons first release - all we were able to do in 2.0 was dock at new surface starports (which had identical functionality to space-born ones), some new missions, drive our SRV around largely blank worlds, visit RNG POI, and collect resources for synthesis. I suppose volcanism was also in there as well on Day 1; but that was excruciatingly hard to find back then. And that was it lol. That was Horizons release. But lots of people had the same complaints about how Horizons felt barren and that there wasn't much to do outside of drive a car for a bit and break up the monotony. The difference here is they gave us a $40 product and we expected a bit more initial longevity. However, if you look back and realize where release Horizons was, technically Odyssey has more active content from the get go than Horizons did on release. Perhaps to them this seemed initially sufficient in retrospect.

If I were you, I'd try and stay patient with Odyssey until we get to the end of June where they stated that they will give us more information about what will be new features will be coming to Odyssey that they've promised are there, and what direction we can expect Odyssey to go in as a whole. We're kind of at a standstill right now because we're missing our console players; so I'd highly imagine that stuff like new SRVs, new ships, new on-foot features, etc. likely won't be a thing until we're both caught up.

So, Horizons really started out super basic. But there we were told that we'd be getting more before we bought it - that it'd be a full season with content.
I think the issue here is that they haven't told us anything more yet on EDO; and it feels like most of us have hit the end game of Odyssey content already.

Yep, good post. Their community manager confirmed on Lave Radio that the efforts throughout the year are not just on fixes, but new feature additions to make Odyssey better and give players more to do as well. I'm having fun with it too, for the first time in a long time, and am fairly confident Odyssey will shape up to be quite good.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Yep, good post. Their community manager confirmed on Lave Radio that the efforts throughout the year are not just on fixes, but new feature additions to make Odyssey better and give players more to do as well. I'm having fun with it too, for the first time in a long time, and am fairly confident Odyssey will shape up to be quite good.

If you listen carefully, those new features are only after console release. He says the same thing about 3 times sequentially and you have to take an average.

 

[Drelthar]

On second thought, what's the point of this thread.

Never mind.

EDIT - right maybe removing my OP wasn't such a good idea, basically the gist of it was that I feel there's a distinct lack of purpose playing EDO content, unlike Horizons (i.e. ships) gameplay loops. There's only engineering of weapons/suits but you don't really need that per se, as I found that even just G2/3 level gear (I'd argue even stock) is more than sufficient for pretty much anything EDO throws at you.

On top of that the time investment vs reward is completely out of whack compared to Horizons, even though (and also because) EDO gameplay loops are meatier now - and yet they feel shallow mini-games bolted onto the main game, with no real synergies between EDH & EDO.

(at least now it's not a wall of text anymore!)

Yeah, the two games aren't really linked in any significant way.

You don't do things on the ground, to achieve something for your ships, or vice versa, and you don't have any missions which involve both the ship and on foot (aside from flying to the location)

They are essentially two games, that are the interactive loading screens for each other.

 

[Vekt Ey'doom]

On second thought, what's the point of this thread.

Never mind.

EDIT - right maybe removing my OP wasn't such a good idea, basically the gist of it was that I feel there's a distinct lack of purpose playing EDO content, unlike Horizons (i.e. ships) gameplay loops. There's only engineering of weapons/suits but you don't really need that per se, as I found that even just G2/3 level gear (I'd argue even stock) is more than sufficient for pretty much anything EDO throws at you.

On top of that the time investment vs reward is completely out of whack compared to Horizons, even though (and also because) EDO gameplay loops are meatier now - and yet they feel shallow mini-games bolted onto the main game, with no real synergies between EDH & EDO.

(at least now it's not a wall of text anymore!)

Upgrading weapons is much more important than upgrading suits, you are absolutely correct.

The biggest benefit from upgrading suits is in the mod slots, while the biggest benefit to upgrading weapons is damage (In some cases TRIPLE damage from G1 to G5)

For my suits, I'm just making them highly specialized in their already existing strengths.

For my Maverick, It's got better backpack and Tool efficiency with further plans for Quieter Footsteps and Night Vision

For my Dominator, it's got More Ammo Capacity to make the most use of the 3 weapons, and better resistances (This becomes really noticeable once you cross into Kinetic resistance instead of weakness), and I plan to add Bonus to combat movement speed and faster shield regeneration.

The Artemis is probably the one that will end up being the funnest, right now I have no mods for it, but I'm going to install an Enhanced battery, enhanced jetpack, longer sprint duration and probably even additional oxygen capacity (it goes from 60 seconds to 300, which lets you conserve more energy cells) but I might get cold feet on that last meme engineering effect and put on something really useful.

If you listen carefully, those new features are only after console release. He says the same thing about 3 times sequentially and you have to take an average.

I'm not shocked, I'd actually be a bit salty if I was a console player, it's bad enough PC players are going to have a pretty big head start with just the minimal content we have now (Honestly, I bet the even trim the Engineering grind right before or right after Console release) but if there was more serious content out there too, like Guardian tech or On Foot AXCZs...

 

[Sysmon]

Yeah, the two games aren't really linked in any significant way.

You don't do things on the ground, to achieve something for your ships, or vice versa, and you don't have any missions which involve both the ship and on foot (aside from flying to the location)

They are essentially two games, that are the interactive loading screens for each other.

Which is a huge shame, as scavenging gameplay should really work both ways. For example, when we find these "intact cargo racks" and can grind out a handful of Materials cannisters, but can only pick them up with the SRV? I'd be happy to only be able to pick up one and carry it back to ship/SRV. And if a cargo cannister is stuck inside something, it would be good to be able to walk out and pull it free.

Or if we shoot up a ship, being able to go EVA or otherwise enter the wreck and loosen a few choice morsels for scooping.

As long as we don't get to repair flat tyres or wipe the windscreens of the ships. Or maybe that will actually be fun? Hmm... I'm conflicted now.

S

 

[here_it_comes]

...could there anything be more repetitive than something static - like interiors?

Walking around on barren planets with literal copy pasta terrain?

 

[Sysmon]

and I have still no idea why. Legs on foreign planetary surfaces is so much more exciting than Ship interior (space SHIP legs LOL nic try ) which is a static one. People are already complaining about repetitive patterns in planetary surfaces - but could there anything be more repetitive than something static - like interiors?

The hard part, I find, is to consolidate wanting the ability to walk around inside our ships with also wanting faster and more fluid game play. Ship legs will either be completely superfluous and pointless, or it will be labelled a "time sink". Of course, if ship legs isn't a bit of game loop spaghetti to keep us entertained, it is just a doll house. We already have one of those in Hole-Me. Do we need more?

Any detail added to the game is going to slow it down. Exploration is (or at least can be) delightfully slow now. I've spent almost the entire time since EDO went live exploring, and I've made it almost 500 ly away from the bubble...

S

 

[Ian Skippy]

EDIT - right maybe removing my OP wasn't such a good idea, basically the gist of it was that I feel there's a distinct lack of purpose playing EDO content, unlike Horizons (i.e. ships) gameplay loops. There's only engineering of weapons/suits but you don't really need that per se, as I found that even just G2/3 level gear (I'd argue even stock) is more than sufficient for pretty much anything EDO throws at you.

Given I am triple Elite and have been flying pretty much small ships only for years, I am not sure what contrast you are trying to paint. Elite Dangerous has been, from the very start, a game almost defined by simultaneously offering loads of freedom and zero purpose. Some basic suits and guns and a decently spec'ed Adder unlock 90% of the gameplay, and you just decide which bits you enjoy. And if the answer is 'none' you play another game. If you are not having fun in the game, the odds have always been slim that you suddenly would have the time of your life if only you'd had a bigger ship/gun/suit/whatever.

 

[Ian Skippy]

The hard part, I find, is to consolidate wanting the ability to walk around inside our ships with also wanting faster and more fluid game play.

These are different players. One the one hand you have the 'Second Life in Space' players. They would love ship interiors and the ability to pick fish for the aquarium and hang paintings on the walls. To others its just meaningless fluff they'd rather do without. The ED community consists of a number of very distinct player groups who have totally different ideas of what is fun about ED and where it should go. From PvE/PvP, Solo/Open, Combat/Exploration, Immersion/goal oriented and so forth. There is no consolidating here, FD can only pick one group over another.

 

[Chaparral]

People for years demanded FD do space legs.

FD did space legs.

Apparently what some people imagined it would be turned out to be not what they imagined.

Is anyone even slightly surprised?

Yeah not space legs. Land legs.

 

[Sysmon]

These are different players. One the one hand you have the 'Second Life in Space' players. They would love ship interiors and the ability to pick fish for the aquarium and hang paintings on the walls. To others its just meaningless fluff they'd rather do without. The ED community consists of a number of very distinct player groups who have totally different ideas of what is fun about ED and where it should go. From PvE/PvP, Solo/Open, Combat/Exploration, Immersion/goal oriented and so forth. There is no consolidating here, FD can only pick one group over another.

More developed crew (NPC) mechanics could overcome that issue. Ships in the Frontier games were multicrew to the point you couldn't get your Asp off the ground unless you hired two NPCs to man it. I learned the hard way that you should therefore not buy your Asp in some Hicksville in the unfashionable end of the galaxy: You can wait a looong time for the 3rd member to show up...

Ship interior gameplay could include a lot of elements, including repairs, service and improvement on the ship, stashing cargo in secret compartments for smuggling, infestation/intrusion/boarding scenarios, love affairs with NPCs of any species (c'mon that's the only reason you played Mass Effect, admit it), painting the walls, feeding the fish, whatever.

Or, a more business-minded player might hire Rimmer and Lister for those mundane tasks and concentrating on flying the ship.

There are always solutions for bridging gameplay gaps. The question is how difficult and fruitful those solutions are when it is time for reality to hit the fan.

S

 

[Winterwalker]

Elite dangerous in its entirety is a foundation of something.
At some point they might want to build something on it ?

I've been thinking about this ...

People say Elite is a mile wide and an inch deep yes? So - while a mile WIDE is not in dispute - let's say each activity IS only an inch deep. You can combine them though. Taking a loose example, you can trade for personal profit, to assist a faction, in support of a power or as part of a community goal .. what about personal profit IN a community goal? Using what they call in maths a factorial, 4 options combined in all possible ways gives 4 x 3 x 2 x1 (24) possible combinations.

How many different activities in Elite? (remember, it IS a mile wide) .. Thargoid pew pew, Thargoid codex, Guardian Tech, Guardian lore, trading, smuggling, piracy, mining, combat zone, resource extraction sites, nav beacon security, bounty hunting, assassination missions, fetch missions, passenger missions, geology, biology, exploration, scavenging, ship engineering .. I'll stop there, there are more, but that's 20.

20! (factorial) is what we like to call a REALLY big number .. 2.4 E+18 inches (deep) to be precise and - since there are 63,360 inches in a mile, ED can i fact be said to be one mile wide .. 38,398,074,624,000 miles deep!


(for sake of interest you break one mile deep at 9 activities)

 

[here_it_comes]

And you believe that every wall, every wallpaper is hand-painted with the utmost care and personally signed by the artist?

Every planet in EDH is unique. It's been done, what's EDO's excuse?

Whereas planetary surfaces have the potential to receive more and more procedurally generated elements in the future.

Stack procedurally generated assets on top all you want, the foundation is still copy pasta.

I think that's pretty unlikely for interiors, where the static element is inherent from the outset.

No one expects interiors to be unique, but the opposite. Sure you wanna make a stand with that unicorn of a strawman?

o7