A question in relation to Salvage for the CMs.

[BL1P]

First a bit of an intro.

Fleetcarriers.
The ability for Cmdrs to own Fleetcarriers and with it have storage space, also brought with it the ability to create Collections of items.
Therefore some Cmdrs have become collectors of both the Legal and Illegal items within the game.
They/We are collecting all or some of the Items which cannot be bought at the normal markets in the game.

Some will collect all the Rare's, Some will collect all the Salvage items or all the non buyable ores. Some everything.

To know if an Item is Legally available we, or at least I, use the Fleetcarrier Market info. This could be a mistake.
What I have found is there are a quite few Items listed in the Fleetcarriers Market that should be Available legally (Not Stolen) but which are not as far as I can tell. Though I do seem to remember that some of the items used to exist in the game, outside of stealing them from an NPC.

These are the Items mentioned above:-

First the missing Legal Salvage (NOT STOLEN) Items these Items have disappeared over time and no longer seem to be in the game Legally only by stealing from NPCs in one form or another :-

AI Relics
Ancient Artefact
Antimatter Containment Unit [[ EDIT : (recently found via the hyfords update) ]]
Data Core
Diplomatic Bag
Encrypted Data Storage
Fossil Remnants
Gene Bank
Prohibited Research Materials
Rare Artwork
Rebel Transmissions
SAP 8 Core Container
Space Pioneer Relics
Time Capsule
Trinkets of Hidden Fortune

Also listed under salvage but which seem more of a Science Sample category are the two following Items :-
Pod Tissue,
Anomaly Particles.

Then there is one missing item which was given via missions but now seems obsolete :-
Telemetry Suite

Then there are a two odd items not listed in the Fleetcarriers Market legally nor are they listed in the Fleetcarriers Secure Market. Yet you can get them.
These are Political Prisoners and Hostages, they can both be obtained and stored.

What I am asking CMs to do is, if you could look into why some of these objects are no longer in the game, then maybe look into getting them re-added, as very rare findable Salvage or as very rare Mission Rewards for Cmdrs please. That would be great.

Spoiler: Suggestions for later :-

Create more Items players can collect, make them rare and make then non exploitable, (meaning you cannot log to menu over and over to obtain many of the Items).

I would like to propose some sort of Collector/Salvage Role for Cmdrs, and espcially would like it if there was some form of Collection Storage on the FC.
So that a Cmdr can add an Item/s to his Collection via the FleetCarrier. This being seperate from the standard storage.

It would also be very nice if Odyssey Items, Samples etc were part of the Fleetcarriers Collections. So that the Odyssey game play can be part of the Collecting Cmdrs already do. At the moment nothing in Odyssey lends itsself to the Collectors Role and yet it would be perfect for that. With Biological Samples, Fossils, Rare Mineral, Ancient Treasure, Alien Items, etc, all being things we could find on foot.

Ultimate goals being a Museum Module on a Fleetcarrier or a Rented Location
at a station, where you have all the Cmdrs Collected Items as a Display that you and others could walk around.
An Auction house for collectables, where Cmdrs bid on items.

 

[BL1P]

Ok cool, One down from the list above.

Because of the Hyfords cache unlocking after 4 or 5 years, or what ever it was.
Anti Matter Confinement was found.
Details in this post :-

Questions for experienced Salvagers.

Bootleg Liquor! Rare find.. So far random surface POIs only Enjoy!

forums.frontier.co.uk

Thanks Adel and Factabulous
And maybe thanks a Dev ?

 

[Stephen_WS]

Hi @sallymorganmoore and all,

After the discovery of Legal Antimatter Containment Units at Fort Asch (recent Hyford storyline expansion) I wanted to add a response to this post, and hopefully add to what the OP has written.

I too have been amassing a collection of commodities on my carrier, Dreamstrider, and I am very aware there is a number of commanders creating their own collections.

The fact is however, as Commander BL1P has highlighted, there are some commodities (mainly salvage but with a few exceptions) that are in extraordinarily high demand by commanders but simply are nowhere to be found.

As mentioned, a number of the now unattainable salvage items were once present in the game, and remembered by commanders thinking back to the time before carrier introduction. It would be interesting to know if these items being missing is the result of closed game loops (either abandoned or waiting for reintroduction) or are the casualty of the changeover from strong/weak signal sources to the USS's we have now in the game.

The main problem with these missing items is that treasure hunting, search and salvage is a huge game loop for many players in Elite that they cannot come to some sort of 'finishing' stage on. The fact that some of these items are non-existent results in enormous unfulfillment of a very interesting and rewarding experience in the game.

There is also another risk to this rarity factor. There have been recent issues concerning duping in Elite. If a player logs in who has not for a long time with a ship stocked with goods in extreme demand for collectors (SAP 8 cores, Wolf Fesh, Telemetry Suites , etc.) the sudden reintroduction of these items in the game world might prove too much of a temptation for dupers who wish to prey on the wants of the galaxy's commodity collectors.

I'd hate for this to happen, and hope that some of these commodities make either blunt/sudden or interesting/plot-oriented returns into the game.

Also, thanks are once again in order for the fixing of megaships and installations (in Odyssey), allowing piracy and salvage to have a much needed injection of excitement, but I implore you to look over the salvaging and treasure hunting aspects of the game and realise they still need some TLC.

o7

 

[Brrokk]

I'm waiting for the CG where a famous junk-collecting explorer wants obscure items and is willing to pay huge prices for them.

 

[Adel]

Indeed, a simple "yes it exists in game" or "no it's no longer available" state for these items could be great.
Just 2 things:

• anomaly particles are broken (something to do with the "rumoured" state of codex that never appaered).
• megaship/installation hacking is NOT FIXED in Horizons (we have to wait the merge at, at least, the end of the year...).

 

[simulacrae]

The Collector… This is the one reason i would want a fleet carrrier - a place to keep all my trinkets without having to carry them around everywhere…

 

[Stephen_WS]

Indeed, a simple "yes it exists in game" or "no it's no longer available" state for these items could be great.
Just 2 things:

• anomaly particles are broken (something to do with the "rumoured" state of codex that never appaered).
• megaship/installation hacking is NOT FIXED in Horizons (we have to wait the merge at, at least, the end of the year...).

This would be a good first step, but something more imaginative and interesting to the salvage gameplay loop could be devised rather than a forum or out of game notation.

Thanks for elucidating on the megaships in Horizons, I have amended my post with reference to Odyssey for further clarity.

o7, good hunting.

 

[GroG79]

Meagaship Looting: Still lots of cargo staying inside the cargo bay

On the salvage:
I am fine with salvage being unobtainable. Cause why not?

 

[Stephen_WS]

Meagaship Looting: Still lots of cargo staying inside the cargo bay

On the salvage:
I am fine with salvage being unobtainable. Cause why not?

I counter your "why not?" with: why?

If we were talking about a commodity that, for lore or BGS reasons, is no longer obtainable (such as some rare commodities now being illegal in their home system) I would understand, because there is a presented reason for these commodities.

The idea of something being in the game, tagged in the commodity list, but then inexplicably vanishing in an update or over time suggests it has been missed, bugged or removed.

There are lots of players who would love to see these items and have lore/mechanics around them.

o7

 

[cmdr milesred]

I don't see anything on your list that can't be found
I have many of those on my carriers.
The ones I don't yet have, I have seen, just not the right time to grab them., yet. and that's only 2 items on that list.
telemetry suite, have not seen since the last time fdev messed around with mission rewards. Not worth mentioning unless we really want them to mess with mission rewards again. I don't, it always leads to many weeks of no or useless rewards till they get it almost right, again. current useless leftover rewards from last effort = limpets
limpet is not a reward, its punishment.
Maybe its just me, but Piracy can and should(does) lead to rewards otherwise unseen.
Also, there are many USS's you have apparently not yet seen.

Some of your words are confusing.
What is legal?
Legal is defined by the law givers in each system and in certain space around certain structures.
It is a near meaningless word in this game.
find - how does not and should not matter.
collect if safe or able to do so.
some items as we know can only be found by those with the right imagination.
meaning, back to the word legal..
being a pirate will get some of those items
being a killer will get you some of those items
if some of these particular items were too easy to get, what would be the point.?

I think the only one missing is the telemetry suite, good riddance to it. We don't seem to need it for missions or engineers any more
like the others you could only get from missions
Articulation motors
Micro-weave cooling hoses
modular terminals
nanobreakers
neofabric insulation
telemetry suite

it would be nice to see these gone too. but some are still in use.

 

[GroG79]

I don't see anything on your list that can't be found

Please show us where to find them. As we all fail to find legal ones. And part of the list in not in-game at all.

 

[BL1P]

I don't see anything on your list that can't be found
I have many of those on my carriers.
The ones I don't yet have, I have seen, just not the right time to grab them., yet. and that's only 2 items on that list.
telemetry suite, have not seen since the last time fdev messed around with mission rewards. Not worth mentioning unless we really want them to mess with mission rewards again. I don't, it always leads to many weeks of no or useless rewards till they get it almost right, again. current useless leftover rewards from last effort = limpets
limpet is not a reward, its punishment.
Maybe its just me, but Piracy can and should(does) lead to rewards otherwise unseen.
Also, there are many USS's you have apparently not yet seen.

Some of your words are confusing.
What is legal?
Legal is defined by the law givers in each system and in certain space around certain structures.
It is a near meaningless word in this game.
find - how does not and should not matter.
collect if safe or able to do so.
some items as we know can only be found by those with the right imagination.
meaning, back to the word legal..
being a pirate will get some of those items
being a killer will get you some of those items
if some of these particular items were too easy to get, what would be the point.?

I think the only one missing is the telemetry suite, good riddance to it. We don't seem to need it for missions or engineers any more
like the others you could only get from missions
Articulation motors
Micro-weave cooling hoses
modular terminals
nanobreakers
neofabric insulation
telemetry suite

it would be nice to see these gone too. but some are still in use.

I meant legal not stolen.
If you know of a location of something listed that can be found that isnt stolen, I and many others would be interested in that. Or at least proof of that.

 

[Stephen_WS]

I don't see anything on your list that can't be found
I have many of those on my carriers.
The ones I don't yet have, I have seen, just not the right time to grab them., yet. and that's only 2 items on that list.
telemetry suite, have not seen since the last time fdev messed around with mission rewards. Not worth mentioning unless we really want them to mess with mission rewards again. I don't, it always leads to many weeks of no or useless rewards till they get it almost right, again. current useless leftover rewards from last effort = limpets
limpet is not a reward, its punishment.
Maybe its just me, but Piracy can and should(does) lead to rewards otherwise unseen.
Also, there are many USS's you have apparently not yet seen.

Some of your words are confusing.
What is legal?
Legal is defined by the law givers in each system and in certain space around certain structures.
It is a near meaningless word in this game.
find - how does not and should not matter.
collect if safe or able to do so.
some items as we know can only be found by those with the right imagination.
meaning, back to the word legal..
being a pirate will get some of those items
being a killer will get you some of those items
if some of these particular items were too easy to get, what would be the point.?

I think the only one missing is the telemetry suite, good riddance to it. We don't seem to need it for missions or engineers any more
like the others you could only get from missions
Articulation motors
Micro-weave cooling hoses
modular terminals
nanobreakers
neofabric insulation
telemetry suite

it would be nice to see these gone too. but some are still in use.

This is a misunderstanding, I believe BL1P, and certainly myself, were referring to the versions of these items that are "not stolen", reference was not really concerning illegal because of system government types.

There is also not much call for the items to be found easily, just that they can be found.

In terms of the telemetry suite you say "good riddance" but that suggests that the commodity has no lore value or merit historically in the game, and those things are interesting to many collectors. I don't understand the logic of removing the commodities you have listed when they say something about the game world - as in they are actually interesting items - and how the game mechanics have changed over time.

o7

 

[cmdr milesred]

it was more good riddance to the rewards problem at that time. solving it 99% and losing 1 item was a success considering how long it took to fix.

 

[cmdr milesred]

the clues to how or where are in my post already

a hint, if you like, I know a lot of players that want soontil relics.
easiest fastest way to get them is by piracy.
If you do this, you can study the ships you are pirating, follow them, see where they get them from.
I know they can or could be bought, sometimes a different faction takes over and no more rares from that place
but pirates can always get them, so can you.
besides following them, even when a system like Ngurii is messed up by another faction, you can still get the relics. Just not by buying them from Cheranovsky City.
There is a clear reason why many pirate ships cargo is illegal. not always because they stole it from a ship.
Every station, market or no market, exports stuff. So even when a rares station is now owned by another faction and the rare is no longer for sale, you can still get the items from that station. But you will have to work for it.
By watching the missions board for hours, days, weeks, months...till you see them finally in a mission for you to deliver(or steal)
If you are smart, take note of the current factions states and system state, etc...so you know roughly what it took to make that happen.


I can show you stations where very clearly Narcotics and slaves are illegal to import. Yet they export them.

Next hint is tougher
You need to start visiting USS's that have many of the other goods in them. try NHSS, they are gold mines for very hard to find items.
I got a lot of my hard to find things from them.

 

[Stephen_WS]

All of what you have said is correct, however the OP is searching for and asking for comment on the legal versions of these items, if they exist that is. So piracy, or any other activity that means the item is "stolen" is irrelevant to their questioning.

USS hunting and NHSS scouting is good praxis in the procurement of rare goods, you are correct. I too have a huge amount of goods from those places.

However, it is becoming more and more obvious - after scouting hundreds and hundreds of these signals/POI - that certain commodities are simply not in them.

o7.

 

[cmdr milesred]

that they exist in stolen format means they were once legal

to be clear, I did say follow the pirates, they will lead you to the source.

as for the others, we are talking about things that are extremely rare, finding many of them in NHSS's is a pretty big clue.
They did not come from the thargoid ships.

If I am able to follow pirates
If I am able to find out where a dead ship came from
Why can't others?
Every dead ship has a history and if it was not killed by you, its probably a history you can find.
I cannot be the only person in this game capable of following a trail.
I know that I am not alone.

much in this game is dependent on people interpreting clues and following them till they get an answer that works for them.

That is all this is.

in a case where a rare is no longer available because of a BGS maneuver, you have choices.
you can join the BGS and flip the station back to where it works for you. and sells the rare again.
you can figure out how to clean stolen items. 2 ways that I know of.
you can settle for them being stolen. But from a mission, they are not stolen until you fail the mission, till then they are mission ONLY items.
POINT is, they do exist as not stolen. NOT gone from the game at all. just changed a little.
IF they were gone or otherwise removed, they would not exist in any form, stolen or clean.
What I have said is proof enough for me because I have found the sources.
So can you, if you really want them.

Know that many players make it their job to keep certain things hidden or unavailable in some way.
I for one, am hanging onto a system just because I removed the material trader.
I had planned on giving the system to a different faction, until I saw how hard people were fighting me for its control.
So now, I go out of my way to make sure its not happening. Never, ever. I never wanted the system, did my best for years to make sure I never expanded into it.
Till I was forced to, thanks to a very long war. I booted the invaders and took control by expanding 2 different factions into it, forcing a conflict that would boot the loser.
Keeping rares and other very hard to find items a secret is important to many.
Keeping secrets is a big thing.
Many are still mad at me for pointing out it is a lie that you cannot get bounty vouchers for anarchy factions. - its a very large component of what I do. And it is just as easy as getting normal bounty vouchers.
So much that some went to effort of trying to make it seem like I was crazy, spouting off secrets in the forums....tsk

If any of the things that are wanted are being kept under wraps by other players, you can change that, but it won't be easy.

I have to say, that if any of what I say is not true, fdev would already have stepped in and given you a partial answer.
They have not, nor will they.
Hafnium was once on this list, no longer.
It was always available, if you can take on 3 to federal military condas for 1 ton of hafnium...a serious pain.
now with a dead military conda on a planet, we get all we want.

Similar to the very first one I had 7 years ago. Toxic waste. impossible to find.
Yet I found it every day during my first months.
result = I can get as much as I want because I was lucky once and kept accidentally finding it.
But it does take effort to find it intentionally. and in useful amounts.

If a person has no or poor undeveloped sleuthing skills, they should probably not try and find hard to find stuff, at least till they get better at it.

 

[BL1P]

@cmdr milesred

Which of the items on the list in the original post do you have which isnt marked as stolen ?


Just wondering, I know Time capsules were available for a while but then got removed from that location.
Everything else you have mentioned is not on the list posted.

 

[Adel]

@cmdr milesred

Which of the items on the list in the original post do you have which isnt marked as stolen ?

Just wondering, I know Time capsules were available for a while but then got removed from that location.
Everything else you have mentioned is not on the list posted.

Can you remember where they were pls? It could help to determine the conditions for them to spawn. Were they in space, surface, mission reward?

 

[BL1P]

Can you remember where they were pls? It could help to determine the conditions for them to spawn. Were they in space, surface, mission reward?

Sure not a problem.
It was Algol same place as the Earth Relics. (this info is from the other Salvage thread)
There is or was a Deg 0 double Icon USS that used to appear which you could goto and find the Legal Time Capsule.
I have seen a Deg 0 double Icon USS a few times in Algol recently but it is always 30kly with 40s left on the timer, even if I have just jumped into the system.

Happy hunting I have spent quite a few hours in Algol trying to find that elusive "Deg 0 double Icon" and have searched a few thousand "deg 0s with single icon" in Algol on the off chance it might be there