Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12

[VR Golgot]

lol, Bugsmashers that's an ancient show they did, heh. Wonder if that's even around anymore judging by how much the game changed since then.

Bugsmashers got mothballed at the same time that the Crytek lawsuit accused it of publicising copyright code without license.

(Which was a bit daft, as Crytek had given away their code for free at one point during their lowest ebb )

(I didn't realise this but Mark Abent who headed that show, now a lead gameplay programmer, is a modder made good. Which isn't a cuss necessarily, as he worked on HL mods of great renown, and many devs are modders-made-good. But it is interesting to see him parsing code-in-construction for a giant behemoth of a game so assuredly.)

 

[Ebob]

Its a strange claim. The most likely reason was due to engine limitations, trying to keep planet sizes relatively small. They knew they still needed to do even bigger planets and couldn't have earthlikes be the same size as gas giants.

But Stanton Star is 1:1. The engine CAN do objects of that size.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

from: http://imperialnews.network/2016/08/gamescom-day-4-coverage/

from: https://starcitizen.tools/CitizenCon_2018_Keynote


TLDR; Travel times. Can't speed up quantum because it has to stay sublight in lore.

I don't get those arguments. QT speed could be increased to counter for larger planets and bigger distances.

Look at ED, you can travel between distances larger than those in SC in less time than in SC. You can get down to planet surfaces of full sized planets in less time than it takes to do so in SC with their smaller planets.

Smells like cow excrement to me.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Bugsmashers got mothballed at the same time that the Crytek lawsuit accused it of publicising copyright code without license.

(Which was a bit daft, as Crytek had given away their code for free at one point during their lowest ebb )

(I didn't realise this but Mark Abent who headed that show, now a lead gameplay programmer, is a modder made good. Which isn't a cuss necessarily, as he worked on HL mods of great renown, and many devs are modders-made-good. But it is interesting to see him parsing code-in-construction for a giant behemoth of a game so assuredly.)

Wasn't it bugsmashers that showed off code with something like 10 layers of nested if statements?

 

[VR Golgot]

TLDR; Travel times. Can't speed up quantum because it has to stay sublight in lore.

Any game that builds its game tech to the spec of in-game lore they wrote first would be in for some nasty surprises. And doing things very very wrong...

Luckily it's probably you who's wrong about this EB, and the lore has likely been massaged to fit the tech. Which would be perfectly sensible ¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[Agony_Aunt]

But Stanton Star is 1:1. The engine CAN do objects of that size.

No it isn't. It isn't even 1/6th size.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qUfRv9l5aI

 

[Viajero]

Ah yes, must be an excuse! - which totally can't be it since there's a 1:1 scale well, "earth sized" Gas Giant in the game!

That gas "giant" is around 1/12 times smaller than your regular Jupiter. With essentially zero features or gameplay to explore in and around it unlike the much smaller solid "planets" in the system, except a unique fixed location at Orison. The rest of the planets in Stanton are tiny at around 1/6th to 1/10th of real 1:1 scale as well. If CIG was technically and reasonably able to do it they would have easily updated the lore to be able to claim the magnificent feat of 1:1 scale long time ago.

 

[thistle]

But Stanton Star is 1:1.

1:1 with what?

 

[Ebob]

I don't get those arguments. QT speed could be increased to counter for larger planets and bigger distances.

Look at ED, you can travel between distances larger than those in SC in less time than in SC. You can get down to planet surfaces of full sized planets in less time than it takes to do so in SC with their smaller planets.

Because ED has a magic frameshift drive that can somehow travel at multiples the speed of light. You can also get down faster because there's no atmosphere or an extremely light one not impeding your speed.

Quantum drive

A quantum drive is an engine type based on manipulating the quantum medium. It allows ships to cross vast distances of open space in a reasonable time.

starcitizen.tools

It's also the fact that they can't increase the speed much or it would most likely break the game. You see, in ED you're not really traversing at those speeds, the game "fakes" the FSD. This becomes apparent by the instance change you undergo when dropping out anywhere. In SC on the other hand, you're actually travelling the speed at which the Quantum Drive goes, no fakery. I'd imagine they'd run into server issues and even worse desync if they'd speed it up more.

 

[Ebob]

That gas "giant" is around 1/12 times smaller than your regular Jupiter.

Yes, but larger than Earth. This proves the engine can do earth sized objects.

With essentially zero features or gameplay to explore in and around it unlike the much smaller solid "planets" in the system, except a unique fixed location at Orison.

And how does this matter? Moving goalposts here, we're talking about pure size.

 

[Zieman]

It's also the fact that they can't increase the speed much or it would most likely break the game. You see, in ED you're not really traversing at those speeds, the game "fakes" the FSD. This becomes apparent by the instance change you undergo when dropping out anywhere. In SC on the other hand, you're actually travelling the speed at which the Quantum Drive goes, no fakery. I'd imagine they'd run into server issues and even worse desync if they'd speed it up more.

True dat.
But E: D way is more clever, to circumvent technical limitations.

 

[Factabulous]

Good to see SC is starting to get to the 'gameplay' vs 'immersion' fights we hold so dear in ED land Must be getting close to release

 

[Viajero]

Yes, but larger than Earth. This proves the engine can do earth sized objects.

And how does this matter? Moving goalposts here, we're talking about pure size.

Not really, no. All it proves is that CIG can not even do earth size bodies with actual surface gameplay features to explore in and around it (except just a unique station in a fixed location at Orison). Hurston tiny size has just been made to fit CIG seeming technical limitations in the rest of the system dwarf planets. If CIG was technically able to do 1:1 scale bodies they would have done it long ago for all bodies including solid planets, claim the success of that fidelity and then simply retcon the lore where needed.

 

[Ebob]

No it isn't. It isn't even 1/6th size.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qUfRv9l5aI

Well then I must have misread something. But the calculation he does at the end does show that they're "well within" the star, which they are. And it then comes out that it is 1/6 scale? And even then it proves my point, they can do objects as large as that. It's no engine limitation.

 

[Ebob]

Not really, no. All it proves is that CIG can not actually even do earth size bodies with actual gameplay features to explore in and around it (except just a unique station in a fixed location at Orison). Hurston size has just been made to fit CIG seeming technical limitations in the rest of the system dwarf planets.

Which isn't what I was talking about in the first place. The engine can do earth sized bodies, that's all this was really about. Since you first proclaimed that it could be some kind of technical limitation. And now you're moving the goalposts by introducing gameplay factors on these planets.

If CIG was technically able to do 1:1 scale bodies they would have done it long ago, claim the success of that fidelity and retcon the lore.

And who are you to proclaim that?

 

[VR Golgot]

Yes, but larger than Earth. This proves the engine can do earth sized objects.

But doesn't prove it can support 1:1 gas-giant sized objects in the game world, which would appear to be the point . (Let alone star-sized objects, as covered in other posts).

I'm not sure why you're so resistant to the idea that SC may have opted for scaled solar systems in part due to tech reasons. It really wouldn't be that big of a deal.

(Outside of the silly buns fights that Factabulous alludes to there )

It's not so much a question of what the engine can support, as what the game in total can support. And whether they've made design decisions as a result ¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[varonica]

Well then I must have misread something. But the calculation he does at the end does show that they're "well within" the star, which they are. And it then comes out that it is 1/6 scale? And even then it proves my point, they can do objects as large as that. It's no engine limitation.

Obviously did. What he said was, if the star was 1:6 scale they should be inside the star at 116,000klms, they weren't inside the star, therefore the star isn't 1:6 scale, it's much smaller than that.

 

[Ebob]

Obviously did. What he said was, if the star was 1:6 scale they should be inside the star at 116,000klms, they weren't inside the star, therefore the star isn't 1:6 scale, it's much smaller than that.

They were. The map showed them inside the star, it's just that CIG never expected anyone to go there and so there are no mechanics of burning up or anything rendering while inside.

 

[Dooguk]

The "star" is probably at 1/10th scale, the same as the planets are. The moons are 1/6th.

 

[varonica]

It's also the fact that they can't increase the speed much or it would most likely break the game. You see, in ED you're not really traversing at those speeds, the game "fakes" the FSD. This becomes apparent by the instance change you undergo when dropping out anywhere. In SC on the other hand, you're actually travelling the speed at which the Quantum Drive goes, no fakery. I'd imagine they'd run into server issues and even worse desync if they'd speed it up more.

No, really, don't tell me you are actually arguing that in SC you really are traveling at 0.2c, whereas in ED you aren't traveling at multiple C! In neither game are you traveling at all, and instancing has nothing to do with traveling around in the solar system.

You can, if you have the time and fuel, take off from a planet in ED and fly to another planet however far away it is, instancing is to do with players not system assets in the solar system. The changes in mode aren't leading screens, I can see stations on the planet surface from 50+klms up as I glide in and it's still sitting in exactly the same place as I exit glide a few klms above it. The change from glide to normal flight isn't an instance change, instance changes happen in the background, you don't even know they are happening most times.