2.2's Instant Ship and Module Transport - Yay or Nay?

[warbaby2]

if Star Citizen were to make choices like this they would have a real issue with their community.

True... also, you can say about Christ Roberts whatever you will but he is an obsessive purist when it comes to simulation. A "convenience feature" like this would never fly with him.

...that could also be the reason the game might never come out, of course.

 

[mossfoot]

I just wanted to approach this issue briefly from the perspective of lore - and the need for in-game lore and fiction lore to mesh (albeit not exactly).

For those bringing up 3D printing as a "lore" explanation for instant transport, ask yourself if you're cool with that existing in the Elite novels or any other Elite stories that come in the future (comics, animated, live action). Does that sound cool, or stupid? Or does having your ship taxied over sound better? Think of the ramifications that has in a story and story world.

When it comes to game mechanics and lore, you have to balance out what you see in game with what exists in lore.

In game when you eject, you instantly appear back in your ship. But in lore you are rescued, your RemLok checked out in Medical, you sign a release form and insurance forms, grab a beer and wonder what you did wrong, then get back in your ship. You are not dropped out of a clone vat into your new ship. Not a single book allows for this.

Writers have to balance existing tech in game and how it works with how it has to work in fiction. I talked about the Mass Effect novels a long time back, which managed to incorporate things like personal shields and medigel into the novel but it did not work the same as it did in game (shields provided some protection, like a flak vest--medigel could save your life, but not make you 100% in two seconds after a serious gut wound). If the stories worked the way the game did, it would have been stupid and taken away from the world, adding nothing, even though it's in-game accurate.

So while I fully agree that ships and standard parts are manufactured on stations (using licensed blueprints from various manufacturers) the idea of "teleporting" your ship this way (including unique one of a kind Engineer upgrades) breaks with the feel of the fiction world to far too great an extent. Imagine how that plays out in a story. The idea of purchasing an identical stock model with A-rated parts is fine, but not a customized ship. There is far too many problems and questions this raises.

From a fiction point of view this is never going to happen, any more than the whole "clone" nonsense that keeps coming up like a bad penny. So you have to find a way to reconcile the in-game lore with the fiction lore.

What bearing does this have on the argument for or against instant teleportation? Not much, actually. I'm just saying that if we have instant ship transport as a function in game that does not mean that is what happens in the lore. It's always going to be sent over the old fashioned way. You're just being spared the time it takes to wait for it to arrive, just like you don't have to wait for a rescue ship or get cleared by a doctor before going into your next ship.

Now, continue on with your pros/cons arguments

 

[stephen_usher]

I think that ensuring that ships can only be sent to places they could reach as configured is more important than arguing over instant vs some time, or push vs pull. If you can call up a ship bristling with weapons that could not be bought and configured in a local spaceport, and could not get there under its own steam, then there is a major problem whether or not it arrives instantly or after a little while.

The problem is that I've found a flaw with this idea. Module storage and transfer creates a neat loophole: Store your ship as a long-haul version and swap modules at the destination. The ship in its stored configuration could make the journey, but once the modules have been swapped it wouldn't be able to, and it would only slow the person down by a couple of minutes.

 

[Tacyon]

Holy Thargoids batman ... 234 pages in two days ... can we say ... HOT TOPIC (not to be confused with hot pockets)

I didn't read all 232 pages but did the first 10 or so and I agree, ship transport is a welcome and good thing. Instantly, ah, not so much so.

The sci-fi idea I had prior to seeing the details was for some sort of autonomous flight control method (ship's computer?) that would be very detrimental to humans (or any biological material) and would allow for faster and more efficient movement of hulls. A computer never sleeps. Will navigate the most efficient, unlimited range route. And never make a mistake flying into a star while recharging their ocular input devices [where is it]. This could also cover no crew or cargo along for the "ride". Fuel and maintenance consumptions could also account for the costs and would scale with type of hull and distance transported. Other than just saying it costs "X" amount and here you go.

 

[BigBANGtheory [VR]]

I'm pleased transfer is coming, I think there should be:
1. a cost
2. a time latency for it to happen

The main thing is transfers are coming... next autopilot reward for Elite Trade rank? pls, pretty pls, pretty pls with a cherry on top...

 

[MickyG1982]

I'm pleased transfer is coming, I think there should be:
1. a cost
2. a time latency for it to happen

The main thing is transfers are coming... next autopilot reward for Elite Trade rank? pls, pretty pls, pretty pls with a cherry on top...

Autopilot is never coming... (It simply isn't needed like it was in earlier games)

 

[Wolf Starslayer]

Do we need a rename 'Elite : Martini - any time, anyplace, anywhere, '

 

[Alec Turner]

From today's newsletter ...

If you desperately want to change into your Anaconda, but then realize you’d otherwise miss a key Elite Racers event if you don’t get your Eagle, then you can now head over to Starport Services, and have the ship transported to where you are via the Shipyard menu.

 

[stephen_usher]

Instant? Huh? Why would they make them instant?

'Thought the "science of ED" was am all-important thingy that Brabers loves the most?

Indeed, in one stream, DB "The game is based on as much realism as possible" then Sandro chirps "Gameplay trumps realism every time." These two are not singing from the same hymn sheet, obviously. I'm sure someone in the press somewhere will pick this up and it will hurt reputations somewhere.

 

[Vallion]

It's cute to see people are quitting already over something that may break your little fantasy world.
It's a game.

 

[Mephane]

Yeah, but they won't do this. It would work for people like you and me who plan and are efficient with their time. But the casual players aren't just impatient, they are also lazy. They will default to the least action possible. And even with a timer, the least action possible is to fly everywhere in your fastest ship and then sit around and wait. If the purpose of ship transfer is to make the game more accessible, then they will never add a timer because that means that casual complainers will be waiting more. Complaints of there being "nothing to do" in Elite will actually increase because that is how lazy people will use this feature.

They opened pandoras box with ship transfers. Now we know why they waited so long to do it. Immersion vs Human Laziness. They've probably had this discussion for months, and we are having it for a few days.

I would suggest that for a casual player, is is generally more convenient and efficient to stick to a multi-role ship like the Cobra, AspX, Python etc, and not to prepare a fleet of specialized ships in the first place.

 

[Enderby]

Do we need a rename 'Elite : Martini - any time, anyplace, anywhere, '

I always wondered what the difference between 'anyplace' and 'anywhere' was!

 

[Deleted member 115407]

It's cute to see people are quitting already over something that may break your little fantasy world.
It's a game.

Don't feed the trolls, people.

 

[warbaby2]

Indeed, in one stream, DB "The game is based on as much realism as possible" then Sandro chirps "Gameplay trumps realism every time." These two are not singing from the same hymn sheet, obviously. I'm sure someone in the press somewhere will pick this up and it will hurt reputations somewhere.

The only thing I think of is: DB does the marketing talk and Sandro does the dev talk... I just don't know where the impression came from that this was a good idea gameplay wise.

 

[Enderby]

The only thing I think of is: DB does the marketing talk and Sandro does the dev talk... I just don't know where the impression came from that this was a good idea gameplay wise.

Those lads should get together and have a chat sometime.

 

[Mephane]

Indeed, in one stream, DB "The game is based on as much realism as possible" then Sandro chirps "Gameplay trumps realism every time." These two are not singing from the same hymn sheet, obviously. I'm sure someone in the press somewhere will pick this up and it will hurt reputations somewhere.

I have realized with 2.1 that Sandro acts with utter disregard to David's vision (which many of us bought into when backing the game in the first place), and David just doesn't seem to see this.

 

[Kled7]

Yeah, but they won't do this. It would work for people like you and me who plan and are efficient with their time. But the casual players aren't just impatient, they are also lazy. They will default to the least action possible. And even with a timer, the least action possible is to fly everywhere in your fastest ship and then sit around and wait. If the purpose of ship transfer is to make the game more accessible, then they will never add a timer because that means that casual complainers will be waiting more. Complaints of there being "nothing to do" in Elite will actually increase because that is how lazy people will use this feature.

They opened pandoras box with ship transfers. Now we know why they waited so long to do it. Immersion vs Human Laziness. They've probably had this discussion for months, and we are having it for a few days.

One mans "your lazy in a video game" is another mans "I have kids and RL to take care of"

I want to agree with you on the topic that instant is a silly idea. But you do realize that by playing a video game and spending time on the forums we are the DEFINITION of lazy?

Don't turn this into a casual vs hardcore debate. That path leads to nothing.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

Odd. I haven't logged on since they made the announcement of teleportation for cash. Didn't initially think it was a game breaker. My gut is saying otherwise though.

Gonna have to give it more time. Maybe see how expensive they make it. Immersion is dead now. But maybe they can still salvage game balance if they pin down the costs?

Same for me, not that I have done some ragequit "not gonna play!" thing, just couldn't motivate myself. Maybe I can again, probably can, dunno.

I realise its kinda silly, tough I'm for the first time really don't know If I have a future with the Game. If had ask me not that long ago if i'm gonna buy season 3 you would have gottan a quick and clear "Hell Yeah!" now I don't know. I kinda suspect more stuff like is gonna come and while it will be fun game it wont be what I want. (And no, I'm not predicting doom, I know if I'm not gonna buy any more season it doesnt matter for FD business)

 

[znôrt]

The only thing I think of is: DB does the marketing talk and Sandro does the dev talk... I just don't know where the impression came from that this was a good idea gameplay wise.

sandro does the 'design' talk. alan is a producer. devs are usually not exposed to the public for a reason, unless in tightly controlled environments. they know too much and are too prone to tell the truth due to deficiencies in appropriate pr filters.

 

[CMDR Robyn Highart]

Don't feed the trolls, people.

Thanks for that I was about to