3D visual tweaks to UI

[Alcovitch]

Hello,

Not sure if this is the best place for this thread but I don't see anywhere else on the forums that discuss 3D in general.

This list of suggested UI fixes applies to all types of 3D, Oculus or 3DTV play.


Comms and Info panels: We should be able to adjust their depth plane or set them to be the same depth as the fuel and system info panels

Landing Guide: This ui piece has issues for me. The target plane is not in 3D it's flat. It should be at the same depth and angle as the radar screen it replaces. Also the ship icon during this UI should be 3D as well. Right now it's a 2D sprite. Replace it with the 3D ship icons from the Starport Services windows.

Ship & Shield icons: This ui element looks ok except again the ship itself is flat. Please replace it with the 3D ships that you find in Starport Services menus.

Super-Cruise: I'll try to explain myself as clear as possible on this one. The vertical lines that scroll to the left and right of your cockpit while in Super-cruse look cool but they have depth queue issues. They appear to be coming from outside your ships canape and travel inside. Their depth queues show that they should pass BEHIND canape pillars yet they pass in front of them causing a visual anomaly that's uncomfortable to look at. The way I understand how this UI element works in game is that it's a hologram created by your ships canape windows, thus they should only be visible through the glass and not the canape pillars. Either that (which would be better) or make their depth queue pass in front of canape pillars to avoid the visual issues. Hope you guys understand what I mean by this.


The game looks awesome in 3D but some of these minor issues would go a long way to making the experience that much better. The little details matter in 3D.

Thanks.

 

[Malic]

Comms and info panel I agrees with. Being able to move those around would be nice. For example, the fuel scoop display in the Eagle feels too close and big, while is perfectly out of the way in the viper for example.

All of your other points I am not sure of though. The landing guide, ship and shield icons and the super cruse velocity line, all mine are in 3D.. One of the things I do when i get a new ship is really just explore the cockpit by positioning my tracking camera on a tripod and moved around and have gotten *in front of* them, so they are all in 3D. Even during landing i have tried to stand up and look down on the landing pad from the cockpit.. the landing display is in 3D too.

 

[Alcovitch]

Comms and info panel I agrees with. Being able to move those around would be nice. For example, the fuel scoop display in the Eagle feels too close and big, while is perfectly out of the way in the viper for example.

All of your other points I am not sure of though. The landing guide, ship and shield icons and the super cruse velocity line, all mine are in 3D.. One of the things I do when i get a new ship is really just explore the cockpit by positioning my tracking camera on a tripod and moved around and have gotten *in front of* them, so they are all in 3D. Even during landing i have tried to stand up and look down on the landing pad from the cockpit.. the landing display is in 3D too.

It's hard to explain but they aren't 3D.

The Landing Guide hologram: The ship appears to be a paper cut out moving in 3D space. it's not an actual 3D representation of your ship. Why? The Starport Services menus have fully 3D models of your ship. Why not use that inside the cockpit? Also the docking target (the pad that has a bullseye that's red and turns blue when you're lined up) is a flat plane (which is fine) but it's vertical for me and not angled like the radar plane.

The Super-Cruise motion vertical lines are 3D, but they have wrong depth queues. The depth says they should be BEHIND canopy pillars (the sections of the ship that hold the different pieces of cockpit glass together) but they pass over them. Basically the game's separation tells your brain they should be obstructed by the pillars ( because they appear to be physically behind them) but then they are rendered over them causing a miss match and it causes eye strain. It's something you cannot see at all in 2D.

Not sure I made myself clear with that description but if it's still confusing a simple screen grab and photoshop job of "current image / how it should be" might make it clearer to understand.

 

[robdood]

OP, you're not using Oculus, right?

 

[777Driver]

OP, you're not using Oculus, right?

I don't think he is, am not seeing those problems with the DK2

 

[robdood]

Well indeed, I appreciate the points but if you're at a static camera position, seeing 'depth' on small objects like the hud elements is pretty tricky, surely! All of that stuff is 3d as far as I remember from my early standing up experiments in the rift!

I kinda like the mind bending nature of the supercruise motion lines, too. Though you may feel it's 'impossible', it's a bit like seeing those painted on adverts / etc the put on sports fields, a trick of the eye, if you get me.

 

[Alcovitch]

I don't think he is, am not seeing those problems with the DK2

I'm not. but I don't see how the oculus changes things like supercruise lines being hidden by canopy pillars. they don't.

You're saying that in the oculus rift, that if you follow the path the super-cruise vertical lines take, they get obstructed by canopy pillars? They should be hidden when passing behind a canopy frame (non glass) because their depth information puts them outside the canopy and not inside. Know what i mean?


if the ship icon where your shields was actually a 3d model and not a flat paper cut out in 3d space then you'd see it. Look at the top of Starport Services, under "Ship Analysis" the icon representing your ship that you can freely rotate is 3D. Now compare that to the ship icon where your shields are. You are saying that they appear the same?

Oculus rift still uses seperation information.

 

[Alcovitch]

Well indeed, I appreciate the points but if you're at a static camera position, seeing 'depth' on small objects like the hud elements is pretty tricky, surely! All of that stuff is 3d as far as I remember from my early standing up experiments in the rift!

It's not, actually. For example, I can clearly tell the 3 blue rings that represent my ships shields are in 3D. They have depth to them, but when I look at my ship in the middle of the shield rings, it's completely flat. Like a cardboard cut out. I can see that it's actually at a different depth then other UI elements etc, but the ship has zero depth. The front of the ship and the back of the ship appear at the same depth making it look like paper.

 

[777Driver]

I'm not. but I don't see how the oculus changes things like supercruise lines being hidden by canopy pillars. they don't.

You're saying that in the oculus rift, that if you follow the path the super-cruise vertical lines take, they get obstructed by canopy pillars? They should be hidden when passing behind a canopy frame (non glass) because their depth information puts them outside the canopy and not inside. Know what i mean?


if the ship icon where your shields was actually a 3d model and not a flat paper cut out in 3d space then you'd see it. Look at the top of Starport Services, under "Ship Analysis" the icon representing your ship that you can freely rotate is 3D. Now compare that to the ship icon where your shields are. You are saying that they appear the same?

Oculus rift still uses seperation information.

Nope, just saying it looks fine in the rift, get one and try it yourself. I thought this was the VR forum?

 

[Phier]

Nope, just saying it looks fine in the rift, get one and try it yourself. I thought this was the VR forum?

If you don't have a rift odds are you think this forum is for how the game looks/plays. That mistake happens all the time here.

 

[Malic]

Yeah with a rift you can see all around it and it does have depth.

 

[Alcovitch]

Nope, just saying it looks fine in the rift, get one and try it yourself. I thought this was the VR forum?

Oh, I'm sorry, point me to the forum section for "Non Oculus Rift users that use the in game SBS option"

You didn't answer my question tho. Do the Super-Cruise scrolling lines disappear behind canopy? Oculus Rift doesn't change game code.

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If you don't have a rift odds are you think this forum is for how the game looks/plays. That mistake happens all the time here.

I didn't make a mistake. I'm well aware of what the Rift is and 3D in general. There is no other section to discuss 3D issues with the game. And, since VR still uses the 3D info in the game engine, this is the only place to discuss it.

My thread wasn't about how the game looks/plays. It's about issues with elements of the UI being inconsistent in 3D.

Figured I'd make a thread about em and hopefully they'd eventually get fixed.

 

[Alcovitch]

Yeah with a rift you can see all around it and it does have depth.

View attachment 9958

View attachment 9959

Okay. Does the ship actually have depth to it? or does it just change perspective when you move around it. Because for me, it looks just like that in 3D. it moves and changes perspective when my ship moves but it never appears more then a flat image changing to represent a different perspective on a flat 2D plane that's forced to face "the camera" all the time.

 

[robdood]

So being the nerd I am, I had to check this out this morning before heading off to work..

It's hard to tell if there's actual depth to it on the Rift (mainly cos of the low resolution and when I checked I want really looking for that!) but there's definitely something off about the ship / shield display and the landing hud.

Yes, they appear 3D in terms of if I stand up, I can see the top as the screens above illustrate. But! When you lean in / move around the hud, the ship display rotates in a false looking way. If you hold still and only pivot your head left and right, the ship appears to rotate (which it shouldn't, it's angle relative to me should not change when I look left / right!). The same "false" rotation does not affect the locked target side when it shows a system / planet though. Very weird!

Now I can't unsee it, thanks Alcovitch!




I took a video to show it in real time, but unfortunately the fake rotation just isn't noticeable in 2D!

http://youtu.be/sx0rcesQzn0

As for the supercruise lines, yes the depth is the same in the rift, they look far enough away to be outside, but are shown in front of the canopy columns. It does not bother me though, I actually think it looks trippy and cool!

 

[Malic]

Okay. Does the ship actually have depth to it? or does it just change perspective when you move around it. Because for me, it looks just like that in 3D. it moves and changes perspective when my ship moves but it never appears more then a flat image changing to represent a different perspective on a flat 2D plane that's forced to face "the camera" all the time.

As I said before:

"Yeah with a rift you can see all around it and it does have depth."

When you compare it to the power distribution bars next to it, in the look down view, you can tell that PD holo display is 2D in the one plane but at that angle, you can tell that the top edge of the holo display is closer to you. The ship itself is still 3D.

Maybe it is the thick line that borders it that is playing tricks with whatever you are using to see a 3d image, possibly the rifts translational movement allows us to see it due to the small motions side to side and up and down.

Do you have something like trackIR or facetrack to get translation only?