About that graphic downgrade for PC because of XBOX

[nexxo]

"Why would Microsoft undermine the Windows PC market"
Microsoft is more than just one company. They have competition within their own brand.

Satya Nadella killed all that infighting ages ago. As a company Microsoft will not do anything that undermines itself.

Especially not on PC games, since that is the only aspect still driving PC sales and development. It certainly isn't business --a ten year old PC can run Office just fine. What drives the market for faster processors, faster graphic cards, 4K monitors, shinier features etc. is PC gaming. What keeps Windows the dominant OS in the consumer sector is its compatibility with a wide range of games. It's why it has DirectX. If the PC market slumps, Microsoft Windows sales slump. So the PC remains Microsoft's baby.

And the Xbox is under the hood just another PC.

 

[Han Yolo]

Its not about logic. Us humans typically have great difficulty accepting that things we do not like happen either by sheer accident or for good reasons. So we make stuff up, whether its the Illuminati, Satan, the Bilderberg Group or evil game devs. That way we can pretend that if only X or Y happened everything would be awesome again. If this helps Han Yolo deal with the nature of existence, I say we just let him. He's safely in his little room behind his computer, harming nobody or influencing anything anyway.

hmmm, I am just writing a little in my spare time. I am not even offended by your attempts to troll me. I just find it sad that you are not actually contributing and instead trying to derail this thread with your sad little comments the whole time. I mean, you too paid money for this, right? So you too are entitled to a product worth the money you paid for. If you choose not to complain about poor quality, then so be it.

Not contributing and yet lingering around just to make that one smartypants comment to negate whatever OP was on about are the first signs of troll. In other words, can't you just linger somewhere else?

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Say they had their "fancy asteroid lighting" code which we saw in beta. The dev's were excited, it looked awesome but it used a "fancypantsian transform matrix" to achieve the super effects at acceptable speed it meant that if a certain combination of factors occurred the code just broke down and looked awful. So they had to use a "bogstandardian ray tracing algorithm" because although it didn't look as cool with sunlight twinkling through the dust, it worked in all situations. That means you can't just "turn it on" for high spec rigs, because it doesn't work in all situation.
:
In engineering there are mathematical shortcuts that you can make if certain conditions hold for example the circumference if a circle subtended by an angle is very close to the straight line distance for small angles. This means that you an make a much faster solving algorithm by making this "shortcut", but it only holds good if the angles remain small. If you encounter a situation where the angles get bigger the maths goes out of the window. Therefore if you have a situation where you might encounter larger angles you can't use the shortcut and nee to use a different approach.
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Sorry for rambling but there really are situations where a promising prototype has to be ditched for a lower spec system because of a part of the performance envelope causes the promising system to fail unacceptably.

you may be right with all that. But FD still says that all this is caused by "bugs" and this I can't believe. They should be frank with us.

 

[Kristov]

They could have written code that would compile for each system, but the sad fact here is that they've chosen not to. Even being super-sarcastical doesn't help here. Sad but true.

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oh, now your argument is about grammar? well played, sir!

They don't NEED to write code that compiles for each system, PC and XBOne are close enough in most cases that simple setting options allow for any hardware issues to be totally non-relevant, fact. Your inexperience with anything to do with coding and graphics is rather obvious, like turd in a punchbowl obvious. The graphical optimizations that are needed for the PC and XBOne versions of the game would be almost identical, same OS base, same DX in use, only difference being that PC needs to be able to deal with nVidia and AMD cards while the XBOne uses only AMD hardware. They can run the same graphical settings up to a certain point without any differences, so you just enable some Ultra high setting options for the PC version that the XBOne doesn't include, simple as that.

HOWEVER, and this is the part YOU keep totally bypassing and ignoring, the MAC version of Elite for OSx, that's a very different critter all together. It can't do the graphics the PC and XBOne can do because it's limited to DX9, and they are DX11 capable now and can go to DX12, but OSx, no go, stuck with DX9(not fully functional), mainly because the 'Nix base for it doesn't support DX11 still. There's work being done on that, but there's also been announcements since DX11 was released that it would be working in 'Nix 'soon', still not happening however, but CodeWeavers is SO close...just buy their product and you might someday get DX11 support in OSx and 'Nix..maybe..

So, doing the Mac port FD discovers that the graphics on the Mac run and look like hell compared to the PC and XBOne versions, and continuity is something FD is, for reasons beyond my comprehension, very big on, SO they 'optimize' the graphics, make sure they all look the same, that's the continuity thing, and we end up with the graphics we have now on PC, which are rather different from what was in the original PC versions of the game. Funny thing about that, no one at FD ever mentions that the Mac version REQUIRES dumbed down graphics due to the lack of full DX support in OSx, they just mentioned issues discovered in the port to Mac...

Your theories on why it was done are a bit...silly...to be nice about it. Not mentioning it was done due to Mac issues, I do get why they wouldn't mention that, it would really annoy all of us PC users, after all, WE'RE the ones getting shafted on the graphics because of the continuity thing, that ain't right. Mac users made their choice, don't punish us for that.

 

[AnnuverScotinExile]

No, semantics, actually. Your opening post accuses Frontier of being liars, which is slander.

Then Zeewolf disagrees with you, and you call that slander.

Which tells me that you haven't reflected on what that word means, or use double standards.



Why would Microsoft undermine the Windows PC market which is, like, its third-largest source of revenue, for the XBox which is one of its smallest? It would be like Apple using the MacBook to undermine the iPad.

Actually, accusing FD of being liars in writing is libel. Slander is oral.

No need for the thanks, glad to be of assistance.

 

[Vasious]

I dont know why people engage.

The OP has clearly stated that either Dev have downgraded the graphics just for the X-Box and are thieves and liars or are denying the downgrade and thus are thieves and liars, and regardless of what you or they post about it if doesn't fit the OPs world view you either a white knight and thus and idiot or trolling.

Previous threads have had pictures posted comparing the graphics and any disagreement with the OP is you wanting to have inferior graphics as there must have been a downgrade that the Devs are lying about.

The same dance over and over again no matter what is presented

 

[Herik]

Yes, I've read it and I must say that I really can not believe him. It's quite obvious that this is because of XBOX and not some bug that just happened. The part where he is on about how the dev-team is listening is just pathetic imho.

Anyway, people can chose for themself what to believe but I for myself feel scammed by FD.

On this I think the same...such a shame.

 

[Helgarth]

Playing the White Knight will not bring back the graphics we PAID for. The devs answer on this matter reads like some cheap marketing bla-bla. Fact is they keep lying to us for reasons unknown. Can't help it but that's the way it is.

You paid for graphics? I paid for a game, sorry maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Childish reactions like yours are the reason that dev's stay silent.

Playing the White Knight will not bring back the graphics we PAID for.

Guys, calling people childish or White Knights is going to get you moderated. And Han, just because someone has a different opinion from you does not mean they are white knighting. People are allowed to have different opinions. That is why we have discussions.

Keep it friendly people, otherwise spankings will be handed out.

 

[Cymek]

You think its been downgraded now, wait until it's released on the Nintendo console and you steer and fight via punching at the screen with the controllers.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Just to keep people focused on the topic.

It has been shown many times that the graphics have changed.

Many (most?) people involved in these discussions state that its for the worse.

Devs have stated its an ongoing process of changes, performance enhancements, etc.

OP posits (without proof and against what devs have stated) that this is because of the xbox.

If you wish to keep discussing this, go ahead, just keep it friendly and and discuss the posts, not the posters... although not sure if there is anything left to be said that hasn't been said. So ill be keeping an eye on things, and if it gets circular or any more name calling, ill be locking the thread.

 

[nexxo]

Actually, accusing FD of being liars in writing is libel. Slander is oral.

No need for the thanks, glad to be of assistance.

The UK High Court has ruled in 2009 that defamation on internet bulletin boards is akin to slander rather than libel. Mr Justice Eady stated that posts on bulletin boards "are rather like contributions to a casual conversation (the analogy sometimes being drawn with people chatting in a bar) which people simply note before moving on; they are often uninhibited, casual and ill thought out...Those who participate know this and expect a certain amount of repartee or 'give and take'."

You're welcome anyway (it's only polite).

 

[nexxo]

But FD still says that all this is caused by "bugs" and this I can't believe. They should be frank with us.

That's all fine, but you're still talking about your belief, not facts. Other people believe different and bring some rationale and facts to support that belief. What rationale and facts do you bring?

 

[AnnuverScotinExile]

The UK High Court has ruled in 2009 that defamation on internet bulletin boards is akin to slander rather than libel. Mr Justice Eady stated that posts on bulletin boards "are rather like contributions to a casual conversation (the analogy sometimes being drawn with people chatting in a bar) which people simply note before moving on; they are often uninhibited, casual and ill thought out...Those who participate know this and expect a certain amount of repartee or 'give and take'."

You're welcome anyway (it's only polite).

Why thank you so much.

It sure sounds like a dumb ruling to me, however. The point about libel vs slander is surely that in libel there is a record, rather than having to rely on potentially contradictory witnesses memories (unless the oral statement has been recorded, of course, in which case it is more like libel), and that in libel because of the medium, it can be disseminated to many, many other people, with no control. With slander the people exposed to it are necessarily limited.

 

[DustyArne]

This debate is still top thread on the forums?

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Why thank you so much.

It sure sounds like a dumb ruling to me, however. The point about libel vs slander is surely that in libel there is a record, rather than having to rely on potentially contradictory witnesses memories (unless the oral statement has been recorded, of course, in which case it is more like libel), and that in libel because of the medium, it can be disseminated to many, many other people, with no control. With slander the people exposed to it are necessarily limited.

And let's keep it on topic please (says the master of derailing topics *looks guilty*), otherwise thread lockage

 

[babelfisch]

Did FD ever respond to this other than saying it's all due to a mysterious "bug" which they fail to fix for about half a year now? Or do they just keep lying to us?

Just wondering...

From the other thread:

Sigh... yes they did respond to graphic downgrades. No it is not because of XBOX. Where did they lie to you?

IF they downgraded graphics for XBOX, why did they fix metallic rings? Rocky rings are not fixed yet indicating that this is a bug rather than a downgrade.
IF the changes in graphics are related to XBOX, why did they introduce dynamic lightning for cockpits in 1.2 and improved LOD for planets in 1.3/1.4? Following your logic they upgraded graphics for XBOX.

IF they downgraded graphics on purpose it is much more likely that they did this because of the 5000 threads about poor performance and some additional bugs.

BTW There already is a thread about this topic...

 

[DidierDrbois]

IF they downgraded graphics on purpose it is much more likely that they did this because of the 5000 threads about poor performance and some additional bugs.

There you go.

 

[Muss]

It doesn't make obvious sense but it appears they did. Maybe there were development integration reasons.
Anyway I am glad because it means I can happily run it on my laptop.

The whole point of pc is you can adjust stuff to suite your machine.

 

[Don_Von_Hulio]

i cri evrytyme

https://sfx.thelazy.net/games/screenshot/10550/

 

[Bran Tse Mallory]

Playing the White Knight will not bring back the graphics we PAID for. The devs answer on this matter reads like some cheap marketing bla-bla. Fact is they keep lying to us for reasons unknown. Can't help it but that's the way it is.

In the games industry we have to deal with you're kind every day...

Let me give you an example.

If I had a team make the most amazing 3D scene ever to grace the screen of a PC on our workstations you would drop to the floor and praise us as living gods...

Then you'd want it on you're run of the mill, rather poor performing desktop PC, you'll resent that as you may have spent a huge amount of money on you're desktop games computer.

Sadly though you're computer is only running 1 Titan X, it only has 32GB RAM and 1 poxy i7 CPU - Hardly comparable to the workstation we made the scene on... Looks like we will have to optimise the scene to get it to run on you're poor excuse for a gaming PC.

The moral of this story: Paranoia should be treated by a Dr.