Adam, can we please have a poll on probes?

Ian Skippy

Ian Skippy
askavir said:
Yeah that's the thing with democracy, it's only good and valid when you get the result you want. When you don't, it was rigged, hacked by russians, dog ate the votes, fake news influenced the result, etc.

I get you, I don't like democracy either, democracy is just majority fascism, but unfortunately all the other systems are even worse.
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Come on, man. It is perfectly reasonably to say that when a vote is made, you should be told what it is exactly you are voting for. I am getting pretty tired of these non-polls being abused.

FD: "So, do you think it is okay to have some cosmetics in the store to fund the game without going p2p? You say yes? Okay, I guess that means that it should all be in the store and you cant earn it in game, suckers!"
CIG:"Hey guys, do you think it is fine if we increase the scope a bit, and use the additional funding we'll get from you to honor the 2014 release date? Yes? Well now we're gonna do whatever whenever we want, suckers!"
FD:"Sup folks, do you want transfer to be instant and free, or maybe with a bit of delay or cost? The latter? Hahaha, it'll now take ten minutes plus a million credits just to drag your corvette to the next system, suckers!"

It shouldn't be "are you in favor of [x] or would you rather have the mystery box?" A poll that doesnt unambiguously and clearly describes the two options is no poll, just an excuse to do what you wanted to do in the first place.

askavir said:
That was the original intention yes, but now with infinite probes, the probe lobbing minigame became devoid of any purpose because you will always 100% guaranteed be able to map the entire planet every single time
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Yeah, and if you make them non-infinite you are still guaranteed 100% success every single time, you just add a small grinding period in between planets. Come on dude, really. You used to be reasonably but these are just weak fallacies. The difference is between rewarding skill with credits, or punishing lack of it with more grinding. The former sounds much more palatable to the average person.
 

bitstorm

bitstorm
askavir said:
That was the original intention yes, but now with infinite probes, the probe lobbing minigame became devoid of any purpose because you will always 100% guaranteed be able to map the entire planet every single time, the probing minigame became just a pointless time wall, and might as well just fire a probe / activate some scanner /etc to get the planet mapped and be able to proceed to whatever comes next.

As it stands now, the probes minigame is like a penalty shootout game... with infinite shots until you score. Better to just take the cup and move on to the other things.
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Have you tried it?

The probe mechanirm is a discovery mechanic for revealing items of intererst on planetaray surfaces isn't it? So you can fly down and see things.

It was never supposed to be a mechanism where you could reach a fail state where you were unable to map a planet, exploration has never been about that.
 

Roberto

R
Meh. Compared to, for instance, mats that are magically bound to your body (unless that's been changed?), unlimited probes doesn't seem that unrealistic. I can imagine them being small, (comparatively) simple devices that are 3D-printed on the fly from unremarkable minerals (collected by your ship whenever you land) or auto-scooped cosmic dust or whatever.
 

Nagual

Nagual
Since the vast majority of players don't post on the forums, any poll isn't going to represent the whole community regardless of the outcome.
 

askavir

askavir
sleutelbos said:
I think it is fair to say that for many people, gameplay with a skill-element matters more than speed. So what is 'pointless gimmick' to you is 'actual gameplay' to others.
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Any minigame where "losing" is 100% impossible, is indeed a pointless gimmick and any skill element is completely moot in these conditions (for me, obviously). Like a lockpicking minigame with unbreakable lockpicks and without noise or guards. Might as well just have the door open.
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
askavir said:
Any minigame where "losing" is 100% impossible, is indeed a pointless gimmick and any skill element is completely moot in these conditions (for me, obviously). Like a lockpicking minigame with unbreakable lockpicks and without noise or guards. Might as well just have the door open.
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It was impossible to lose before, if you are going with it, because 'running out of probes' is not exactly losing. And that's kinda my point - if there was no synthesis of probes for example and you would have to travel back to systems, then it might be seen as loss, but if there are easy to get mats for them, it just pads time with procedure which might not be everybody's bag. And weighting all situation there mapping planets already will be quite time consuming process, so it will feel like padding even for me who enjoys long loops of ED (that's why I actually vouched for resuable probes).

For skill there's always been efficiency bonus, which means you will get to pay more. Also I suspect that someone will have to git gud with shooting probes if he/she will want to do it as soon as possible and avoid giving up.
 
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StuartGT

StuartGT
I'd like a poll about unlimited probes, after a poll about open only powerplay considering the latter had much more support :D

edit: damn typos :(
 
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Frank Craft

F
bitstorm said:
Jesus Christ.

TRY THE THING FIRST BEFORE YOU START COMPLAINING,

How the chuff do you know how it plays unless youy've actually tried it?


Hey Adam please can we have a vote on something nobody has even tried yet.

Because that's a good idea, it definitely won't cause more arguing based on "imaginings".

And it would be awesome to have a poll that people could point to showing the majority of the set of idiots who make decisions on a feature they haven't tried, voted for one option or another.

Hey look the majority voted for infinite. Yeah but no-one had even tried it at that time. [wacko]
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Sounds just like the sheer and utter dumb stupidity that informed the Brexit vote.
 

Ian Skippy

Ian Skippy
askavir said:
Any minigame where "losing" is 100% impossible, is indeed a pointless gimmick and any skill element is completely moot in these conditions (for me, obviously). Like a lockpicking minigame with unbreakable lockpicks and without noise or guards. Might as well just have the door open.
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You mean like how exploration itself is 100% safe, cannot be "lost" and is therefor a pointless gimmick? Or do you feel that in this case it is fine, because you enjoy it? Right, that is how people feel about actual gameplay being added. Might be pointless to you, but it is fun to others.
 

Codger

Codger
This is getting ridiculous. However, it does show what a great job FD has done, if this is the main thing people are arguing about.

No poll, please.
 

askavir

askavir
sleutelbos said:
You mean like how exploration itself is 100% safe, cannot be "lost" and is therefor a pointless gimmick? Or do you feel that in this case it is fine, because you enjoy it? Right, that is how people feel about actual gameplay being added. Might be pointless to you, but it is fun to others.
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Putting it like that, everything in the game is 100% safe, it's not like you don't have ample time to decide "my shields are down and hull is getting lower, time exit the CZ and hop to the station 40 seconds next door to repair" isn't it?

SInce I recall seeing several threads "please save the exploration data on ship destruction", I would believe exploration can still somehow be "lost"...
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
Also it is actually interesting to have constant "battle" between consistency and fun and gameplay in ED, but I really doubt that this change is a hill anybody wants to die upon.
 

Ian Skippy

Ian Skippy
askavir said:
Putting it like that, everything in the game is 100% safe, it's not like you don't have ample time to decide "my shields are down and hull is getting lower, time exit the CZ and hop to the station 40 seconds next door to repair" isn't it?

SInce I recall seeing several threads "please save the exploration data on ship destruction", I would believe exploration can still somehow be "lost"...
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Okay, you could also miss the planet with every single, infinitely available, probe until the end of time. In theory. Can we now stop this nonsense? Pretty much noone dies in exploration. I am elite in it, and have never done so sober. I've never lost, or even come close, to losing a ship. I cannot name a single game in my library that is easier than exploration in Elite, and that includes kid-mode in Wacky Wheels. Everyone knows it, regardless of whether one likes it that way or not. So it is clearly not the 'easiness' that you dislike. Heck, even if it were, your solution of making them non-infinite does nothing about it, it is still the same mini-game with the same difficulty.

So just drop this charade and simply say:"I dont like the concept of infinite probes." At least that would be true, a perfectly fine opinion and it wouldn't be tainted with this comical load of nonsensical 'arguments'.
 

VR SenseiMatty

VR SenseiMatty
If people that want to synthesize them accept "the grind" why wouldn't you let them do it??

I'm fine with collecting a couple of common materials to farm 1000 probes... You still have your unlimited... so what's your point actually to vote against the option to have a choice in-game?

Anyway... to all people considering it's a grind... here few screens of my current situation, considering ADAM said multiple times that in the original vision probes required common material.

42 RELOAD

FPeaD5A.png



65 REFILL

A4gFBhB.png




50 REPAIRS

Qws0mbg.png
 
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