Advice on flight techniques when attacking an Elite NPC Anaconda from a Python

[bicarbon8]

I've the following Python:

Spoiler

http://www.edshipyard.com/new/#/L=C...U207217PyH6W6Ks3-UoPcWlhXcmffgmffkmgC1IM22UI1

and was looking for some bounty hunting in a Haz Res to break up the monotony of ferrying passengers. Was able to hold my own just fine on smaller ships ranked Competent and Expert, but I decided to see how the ship performed with it's G5 Dirty Drives (I don't have any experimentals on it yet as I only used Remote Engineering). I know the ship isn't designed to go up against an Anaconda, but I've had a lot of success in my Viper Mk III going up against Anacondas and being able to stick right behind them so I couldn't be shot.

Viper build:

Spoiler

http://www.edshipyard.com/new/#/L=B...tVF7MqHU92q6o6rldAuAxGYZSKmAFUeNvcaR-gaPHkaPq

Well, in the Python, I found that the Anaconda was able to pitch around faster than I was able to vertically or horizontally move so I wasn't able to stay right behind it. So, in such cases, what approach should I take against the Anaconda (my approach last night was to run away with 75% hull remaining) to stay out of its line of fire when in a ship that doesn't have the speed to run circles around it?

as a side note, I was quite surprised to find that, while running away, engaging Silent Running and FA off with evasive maneuvers didn't help me avoid any of the Seeker missiles the Anaconda started firing at me. Surely, that should've made it such that Seekers couldn't lock on, no?

 

[Jake Savage]

If your close, when the anaconda pitches, then boost and thrust up or down in order to stay in position.
When boosting and thrusting then all the power goes to the thrusters instead of the main engines.

 

[AzraelDirge]

I've the following Python:

Spoiler

http://www.edshipyard.com/new/#/L=C...U207217PyH6W6Ks3-UoPcWlhXcmffgmffkmgC1IM22UI1

and was looking for some bounty hunting in a Haz Res to break up the monotony of ferrying passengers. Was able to hold my own just fine on smaller ships ranked Competent and Expert, but I decided to see how the ship performed with it's G5 Dirty Drives (I don't have any experimentals on it yet as I only used Remote Engineering). I know the ship isn't designed to go up against an Anaconda, but I've had a lot of success in my Viper Mk III going up against Anacondas and being able to stick right behind them so I couldn't be shot.

Viper build:

Spoiler

http://www.edshipyard.com/new/#/L=B...tVF7MqHU92q6o6rldAuAxGYZSKmAFUeNvcaR-gaPHkaPq

Well, in the Python, I found that the Anaconda was able to pitch around faster than I was able to vertically or horizontally move so I wasn't able to stay right behind it. So, in such cases, what approach should I take against the Anaconda (my approach last night was to run away with 75% hull remaining) to stay out of its line of fire when in a ship that doesn't have the speed to run circles around it?

as a side note, I was quite surprised to find that, while running away, engaging Silent Running and FA off with evasive maneuvers didn't help me avoid any of the Seeker missiles the Anaconda started firing at me. Surely, that should've made it such that Seekers couldn't lock on, no?

If those are really the entire builds you're using, I see your problem immediately. You have severly undersized shields and almost no firepower no both, a horribly useless power dist on the viper, no banks or boosters on the python, and your engineering is haphazard at best, and actively harming you at worst. You need to build your ships for combat if you want to win fights. Going out in a trader you slapped guns on will not work.

 

[Bortas]

Just shoot it until it explodes... simple

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

indeed, the conda has a high hull resistance, so you need some piercing evil Large ones.

Those 2M burst lasers gonna do not much damage at all.
use the med ones for plasmas, they are beast, have a long range before drop off compared to lasers and high piercing value. And those plasmas should easily hit a conda.

 

[Redomus]

Imo the python while lovely lacks a little in manouvering which has made me lose a little love for my favourite overall ship.

Best advice I can give is, learn to switch your pips up, full sys pips when hes face tanking you or taking fire. Become one with flight assist off, you have to use the good pitch rate of the python to your advantage, because the yaw is non existent. Normally to slip past the nose of a ship you should be able to FA off, down thrust with boost while pitching up (ideally you want to switch to full engine pips while you do this for best results) - then turn flight assist back on when you have him lined up above/below his hull and reset your throttle and then use pips as you need them.

Thats the easy part, if you can mix it in with some reverse turning with up/down thrust when it attempts to get behind you this will help mitigate your module damage, because the python is a nice barn sized target from above/below, but head on its got a very slim profile.

The aim is to whittle it down while taking fewer hits by dodging the main weapons and tanking when needed. Also focus his powerplant as a sub target. Anaconda plants are very exposed and easy to get a kill via the PP before the hull ticks to zero most of the time.

If you know the mechanics of some of the ships you are up against, such as if they are good at yaw/pitch etc, you can use this against them by rotating on your boost turns to cause them problems getting a firing solution on you, so if its bad at yaw - rotate your ship so its perpendicular (relative +/-90 degree offset) to his before making your manouvre, you will hit the side of him but it doesnt matter as long as you are trying to mitigate the forward firepower of the ship. Fortunately the conda PP hangs low so its nice and easy to hit even from the side.

2M burst is fine, they will wear the shield down. 3 multis in the large for ease of use and module/hull cracking - I am becoming partial to long range fixed cannons these days, but gimballed multis will do fine. Positioning is more important than the weapons, once you get that down you can figure out what you like to frag things with.

 

[Aashenfox]

The Python is one of the highest DPS ships in the game and its defense is no joke either.

Winning in a python is to accept that you are not maneuverable enough to avoid large amounts of incoming fire, therefore, rule number one in pve python fighting is...Chaff. Use it on cooldown (as soon as it is up again, hit it).This will reduce your incoming damage by more than 50%. The next thing is good shields. You want the biggest BIWEAVE (thermal resist) you can get on there. The python uses its shields well, you can have a 400mj shield that is back up from completely down in 30 seconds flat. In the utility slots, apart form the chaff, you also want point defense (at least one), as most anacondas carry missiles which they will spam at you as soon as your shields are down (and you will be fighting shields up, shields down, no matter, that's the beauty of the hybrid Python).

If you want easy mode, you want an overcharged Multicannon in every slot, one large with corrosive, 2 large with Incediary, and both mediums Corrosive. Using these weapons allows you to run and fight with your pips at 4-1-1, which will ensure that your shields are as resistant as they can be and back up in no time. 1 pip to weapons is enough to fire all the MCs as much as you need.

Obviously a hybrid needs a lot of armor, so you need AT MINIMUM Military Bulkheads (Heavy Duty), or ideally Reactive (Thermal Resist), and then to fill up on HRPs. If you are going to a RES, you do not need anything except hull and module protection, leave the DC, leave the Disco Scanner, leave ALL the cargo racks, don't bother with shield cells, just FILL the ship with (heavy duty) HRPs, saving two slots for MRPs, ideally one size 4 and one size 2.

And this is how it works (I use PAs and rails, but all MCs is just as effective if not more so, in PvE)...note my shields go up and down constantly, yet still I only lose 4% hull...

Spoiler

[video=youtube;Yf_zmehepJ4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yf_zmehepJ4[/video]

 

[[VR] scipio_77]

After the change in pitch speed, I think the Python moved from "very good" to mediocre in combat, and is now dependent on decent engineering to be a truly capable ship in combat.

That said, NPCs are doable with most decent ships with some practice, including elite 'Condas. I'm guessing the trick you need to master is proper pip management. Full pips to engines when manouvering to keep yourself in behind and in the blindspots of the 'Conda. Full pips to shield if you are about to take a full barrage. Boosting, using trusters and doing FA on/off tricks is also something you should learn.

Obviously your ship should be well fitted, the bigger ships underperform extremely with poor modules.

 

[[VR] scipio_77]

The Python is one of the highest DPS ships in the game and its defense is no joke either.

Winning in a python is to accept that you are not maneuverable enough to avoid large amounts of incoming fire, therefore, rule number one in pve python fighting is...Chaff. Use it on cooldown (as soon as it is up again, hit it).This will reduce your incoming damage by more than 50%. The next thing is good shields. You want the biggest BIWEAVE (thermal resist) you can get on there. The python uses its shields well, you can have a 400mj shield that is back up from completely down in 30 seconds flat. In the utility slots, apart form the chaff, you also want point defense (at least one), as most anacondas carry missiles which they will spam at you as soon as your shields are down (and you will be fighting shields up, shields down, no matter, that's the beauty of the hybrid Python).

If you want easy mode, you want an overcharged Multicannon in every slot, one large with corrosive, 2 large with Incediary, and both mediums Corrosive. Using these weapons allows you to run and fight with your pips at 4-1-1, which will ensure that your shields are as resistant as they can be and back up in no time. 1 pip to weapons is enough to fire all the MCs as much as you need.

Obviously a hybrid needs a lot of armor, so you need AT MINIMUM Military Bulkheads (Heavy Duty), or ideally Reactive (Thermal Resist), and then to fill up on HRPs. If you are going to a RES, you do not need anything except hull and module protection, leave the DC, leave the Disco Scanner, leave ALL the cargo racks, don't bother with shield cells, just FILL the ship with HRPs, savins two slots for MRPs, ideally one size 4 and one size 2.

And this is how it works (I use PAs and rails, but all MCs is just as effective if not more so, in PvE)...note my shields go up and down constantly, yet still I only lose 4% hull...

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yf_zmehepJ4

I think this is a good post, but I disagree a bit on the MC thing. Sure, it will allow you to run 4-1-1, but that isn't necessarily optimal. Using pip management actively when flying will allow you to run a more balanced loadout. Sure, it's nice to not have to touch the pips much, but it's a bad habit to learn.

 

[bicarbon8]

If those are really the entire builds you're using, I see your problem immediately. You have severly undersized shields and almost no firepower no both, a horribly useless power dist on the viper, no banks or boosters on the python, and your engineering is haphazard at best, and actively harming you at worst. You need to build your ships for combat if you want to win fights. Going out in a trader you slapped guns on will not work.

hi, I think you've misunderstood... the Viper does very well in these situations. I don't mind a long fight, as long as I've a chance of winning. Also, the Python is equipped for passengers and I was only taking a quick break as a distraction. It does very well in NPC combat in most situations, but against an elite anaconda I found that my normal tactics of hanging behind them wasn't working.

 

[Aashenfox]

I think this is a good post, but I disagree a bit on the MC thing. Sure, it will allow you to run 4-1-1, but that isn't necessarily optimal. Using pip management actively when flying will allow you to run a more balanced loadout. Sure, it's nice to not have to touch the pips much, but it's a bad habit to learn.

I completely agree, but there is no way this guy is doing good pip management (perhaps it's unfair to judge from the builds). I think good pip management should come after understanding loadouts and enemy tactics, but yeh, you're 100% right, no doubt, well pointed out.

 

[bicarbon8]

Imo the python while lovely lacks a little in manouvering which has made me lose a little love for my favourite overall ship.

Best advice I can give is, learn to switch your pips up, full sys pips when hes face tanking you or taking fire. Become one with flight assist off, you have to use the good pitch rate of the python to your advantage, because the yaw is non existent. Normally to slip past the nose of a ship you should be able to FA off, down thrust with boost while pitching up (ideally you want to switch to full engine pips while you do this for best results) - then turn flight assist back on when you have him lined up above/below his hull and reset your throttle and then use pips as you need them.

Thats the easy part, if you can mix it in with some reverse turning with up/down thrust when it attempts to get behind you this will help mitigate your module damage, because the python is a nice barn sized target from above/below, but head on its got a very slim profile.

The aim is to whittle it down while taking fewer hits by dodging the main weapons and tanking when needed. Also focus his powerplant as a sub target. Anaconda plants are very exposed and easy to get a kill via the PP before the hull ticks to zero most of the time.

If you know the mechanics of some of the ships you are up against, such as if they are good at yaw/pitch etc, you can use this against them by rotating on your boost turns to cause them problems getting a firing solution on you, so if its bad at yaw - rotate your ship so its perpendicular (relative +/-90 degree offset) to his before making your manouvre, you will hit the side of him but it doesnt matter as long as you are trying to mitigate the forward firepower of the ship. Fortunately the conda PP hangs low so its nice and easy to hit even from the side.

2M burst is fine, they will wear the shield down. 3 multis in the large for ease of use and module/hull cracking - I am becoming partial to long range fixed cannons these days, but gimballed multis will do fine. Positioning is more important than the weapons, once you get that down you can figure out what you like to frag things with.

thanks for the detailed response! this is exactly the kind of information I was looking for.

I completely agree, but there is no way this guy is doing good pip management (perhaps it's unfair to judge from the builds). I think good pip management should come after understanding loadouts and enemy tactics, but yeh, you're 100% right, no doubt, well pointed out.

I don't manage my pips for systems well enough, but I do move between 3-4 on engines and 3-4 on weapons as needed during the fight.

 

[bicarbon8]

I think this is a good post, but I disagree a bit on the MC thing. Sure, it will allow you to run 4-1-1, but that isn't necessarily optimal. Using pip management actively when flying will allow you to run a more balanced loadout. Sure, it's nice to not have to touch the pips much, but it's a bad habit to learn.

thanks for the help scipio_77, what would be more balanced on the Weapons, in your opinion? Something like Plasma or Rails or were you thinking more along the lines of beams?

 

[Redomus]

I don't manage my pips for systems well enough, but I do move between 3-4 on engines and 3-4 on weapons as needed during the fight.

Its an important one to use, sometimes its worth sacrificing all out shooting for a moment while you drift into place. 4 pips in system gives you a flat +60% incoming damage reduction (while shields are up). I didn't know that when I first started. Its probably the most important thing in a medium/large ship to use when facing enemy salvos.

 

[d8veh]

Let's make it simple. That Python is not a combat build. If you want to go and carry a load of passengers, do not waste your time fighting Anacondas that are equipped for combat. If you get interdicted, just run away. They can't do you any harm like that. Any battles will be long and you'll get nothing for it, so what's the point? If you want to do some shooting, get rid of all those passenger cabins and equip your ship properly for combat. It'll work quite well as a shield tank with 6A engineered shields, boosters and SCBs. You have no chance with a 3C biweave shield and no boosters.

 

[Aashenfox]

thanks for the detailed response! this is exactly the kind of information I was looking for.



I don't manage my pips for systems well enough, but I do move between 3-4 on engines and 3-4 on weapons as needed during the fight.

That's good, but I think that while you're learning flight techniques and tactics, you will be better served by keeping max pips to shields. If you are feeling confident, then by all means try a pair of focused PAs as a primary damage dealer.

I have become lazy, I try to find pip configuratoins that I can leave in place as long as possible without having to fiddle, but when pvp happens, you got no choice, so as the other poster said, it's a very good habit to get into, just make sure that when the chaff is down and their weapons are facing you, 4 pips to SYS. If the weapons aren't bearing down on you, recharge engines or weaps, then go back to sys when those are charged.

 

[c00ky1970]

Although you may hate me for saying it, but you could also fit efficient turreted beams in the smaller slots, this keep DPS on target if it does go out of sight. So although alot lower than fixed beams, they keep the traget bathed in damage whilst you trundle about.

Then have the 3 large as MC with 1 corrosive (my understanding is that corrosive doesn't stack, so as long as 1 MC has it and the rest benefit.

Dirty Drives 3 from Felicity Farseer does help a lot in improving your manoeuvrability and isnt as hard to get as Palin's DD5.

Using FA Off when you do turn and then re-engaging FA when target is in sight also helps keep the python nimble enough to re-acquire targets.

 

[Hellakitty]

Just shoot it until it explodes... simple

I concur.

Shoot it until it explodes, then shoot the explosion just to be sure.

 

[bicarbon8]

The Python is one of the highest DPS ships in the game and its defense is no joke either.

Winning in a python is to accept that you are not maneuverable enough to avoid large amounts of incoming fire, therefore, rule number one in pve python fighting is...Chaff. Use it on cooldown (as soon as it is up again, hit it).This will reduce your incoming damage by more than 50%. The next thing is good shields. You want the biggest BIWEAVE (thermal resist) you can get on there. The python uses its shields well, you can have a 400mj shield that is back up from completely down in 30 seconds flat. In the utility slots, apart form the chaff, you also want point defense (at least one), as most anacondas carry missiles which they will spam at you as soon as your shields are down (and you will be fighting shields up, shields down, no matter, that's the beauty of the hybrid Python).

If you want easy mode, you want an overcharged Multicannon in every slot, one large with corrosive, 2 large with Incediary, and both mediums Corrosive. Using these weapons allows you to run and fight with your pips at 4-1-1, which will ensure that your shields are as resistant as they can be and back up in no time. 1 pip to weapons is enough to fire all the MCs as much as you need.

Obviously a hybrid needs a lot of armor, so you need AT MINIMUM Military Bulkheads (Heavy Duty), or ideally Reactive (Thermal Resist), and then to fill up on HRPs. If you are going to a RES, you do not need anything except hull and module protection, leave the DC, leave the Disco Scanner, leave ALL the cargo racks, don't bother with shield cells, just FILL the ship with (heavy duty) HRPs, saving two slots for MRPs, ideally one size 4 and one size 2.

And this is how it works (I use PAs and rails, but all MCs is just as effective if not more so, in PvE)...note my shields go up and down constantly, yet still I only lose 4% hull...

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yf_zmehepJ4

thanks for the details Aashenfox! You're right about the need for point defense. I could've probably also used a HRP in place of my smaller passenger cabin as the increase from one 5D HRP with engineering is quite good.

I don't want easy mode with this; the challenge is what makes it fun and is why I tend to use that Viper Mk III in bounty hunting for most things. Also, I have a Type-10 with the multicannon setup you've described and, you're right, it is pretty easy taking down even Elite Anacondas in that.

I didn't want to go with Military Bulkheads as I've engineered my Lightweight Bulkheads to G5 which adds hull integrity without the weight.

 

[bicarbon8]

I concur.

Shoot it until it explodes, then shoot the explosion just to be sure.

I think this was the mantra the Anaconda was following [haha]