Jane Turner
Volunteer Moderator
that's combined assets though so the % would change, not the combined value - here is mine for example
Anti-Botting Agreement
- Thread starter Asamith
- Start date
Deleted member 192138
D
Carrier bank is not included in CMDR assets on the Inara Credits and Assets graph. Otherwise I'm short by 38 billion.
no
What they said ^^
This is my PC account after i transferred credits from my carrier bank to the commander bank
Might look fishy, but it's only misleading simply because how Inara is tracking the carrier bank... actually Not tracking it
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Jane Turner
Volunteer Moderator
ok [post above edited]
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Oh it isn't. But some people would like to pretend it is, if their goal is to undermine the initiative.
Actually no, that is a complete red herring on two counts.
1. FD are very clear that modes are here to stay, so any suggestions leading down this particular frequently mentioned dead-end rabbit hole are incredibly unhelpful.
2. More relevantly still, someone capable of programming a sophisticated bot script is more than capable of achieving a connection with just the transaction server and filtering almost everything else, meaning that no one can instance with the account unless they choose otherwise. Sort of like being in Australia, only worseWe have reason to believe that this is already happening.
So flogging this particular dead horse is not a direct A-BA groups will support.
Those arguments are a bit weird tbh:
1: Nobody said the goal was to remove solo play? Simply make the game mode about PvP mode (powerplay) a competitive one through open only, it is an opt in/ opt out system that overrules the normal bounty system overall and it creates a balance issue were combat pilots cannot interact with haulers and provides them with the ability to affect powerplay at 0 risks on their part.
2: considering it "a dead horse argument" because you disagree with the point is completely disrespectful, espescially coming from a volunteer moderator, you should be impartial about it, its a poor show.
But regarding your bot programmers having those "skills", I strongly disagree in the sense that most would not bother. Every major MMO in history had swarms of botters with varying skill caps, putting it open only would definitely help the community flag at least some of them.
Not everyone that knows how to code knows about networking, its my irl job (albeit they claim they do) =)
Edit: correcting a word for point clarity
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The biggest problem with the open-only argument when it comes to BGS and PowerPlay is not that we disagree with it... is that FDev has repeatedly said they won't do it, as well as showed no interest in changing their mind.
Every time it comes into the discussion, FDev takes the approach of ignoring it to death.
So... if we want this initiative to be successful, and if we're going to request things from FDev, we're at least going to request something that there's a chance they take seriously. Bringing up open only to BGS/PP is one way to doom this project, because it might as well be a blacklisted request in FDev's mind.
That being said, there still are ways to make Open Only BGS a useless feature, since if you fiddle with it enough, you can essentially avoid instancing with anybody else, and make it play out like solo play.
And there is also the fact that a lot of people do disagree with it. So, as for open only in PP/BGS being a discussion worth trying... yes, it is. But not here, we're just trying to deal with bots, not rework gamemodes.
The consensus seems to be that strictly open-only won't happen, but are there ways to turn it into some sort of overwatch mode regardless? This would probably mean doing the extremely counter-intuitive step of banning suspected cheaters from solo so they can ruin the game for other people in open (or get their game ruined if they're not cheaters and hate open) assuming they don't just work around the peer to peer system.
Also it's worth bringing up that as a somewhat nuclear option other games with peer to peer networking have essentially developed their own cheat detection (which also violates any TOS), however due to the MMO model of ED this wouldn't be viable beyond less-obvious pvp cheaters even if everyone was forced into open.
I know this is essentially backseat moderating Frontier's game but from what I've heard it seems they're pretty lenient with bans and don't really like to talk about it - other games mass ban cheaters in waves in a more public way because people observing cheaters getting caught is a good deterrent and morale booster for people who usually just observe the cheating but not the punishment. Also more obviously it's usually just banning users of a single hack you can figure out reliable detection methods for.
This ^^
IF some people will try to turn this initiative into some sort of leverage to force open only something (anything) - then FD might simply ignore or simply blacklist anything related with this initiative.
Which will definitely work in the favor of botters.
FD ignore Powerplay because they are scared witless of it, to them its a bowl of flaming pain spaghetti topped with agony meatballs. Its a feature that highlights the weaknesses of the whole game while amplifying nothing positive.
While I agree the BGS should stay as it is, Powerplay in whole or in part needs Open mainly to tell it apart from what it is now, a failed offshoot of the BGS. The least cataclysmic option is weighting Open more than Solo, since FD want to reward risk. FD themselves really want this, simply as its the easiest option to do.
In any case, Open only is really a weak anti 5C measure. On paper it works if you are in the correct instance- the same with botting. Like I said earlier making gameloops actually require split second skills is the key. If you can't automate it then you are on the right track.
Forcing BGS and PP to be Open only would not be the best way to give people the ability to track bots and some commanders, me included, wouldn't want that at all.
It should be possible to flag all shiops that pass through a system regardless of which mode or platfpom they are on.
This would allow comanders to keep their actions secret or remain safe from situations where skill or disability would otherwise bar them from participating but still enable them to be tracked, if somewhat vaguely.
Full disclosure. I usually play in open, but there are times when groups or Solo are more convenient. I don't see why I should have to wait for ages in a small pop system for a pad while some forgetful commander spends time making coffee or goes to the loo. There are other scenarios which includes "Black Ops".
It's just that ATM the "Black Ops" are a bit too black.
o7
It should be possible to flag all shiops that pass through a system regardless of which mode or platfpom they are on.
This would allow comanders to keep their actions secret or remain safe from situations where skill or disability would otherwise bar them from participating but still enable them to be tracked, if somewhat vaguely.
Full disclosure. I usually play in open, but there are times when groups or Solo are more convenient. I don't see why I should have to wait for ages in a small pop system for a pad while some forgetful commander spends time making coffee or goes to the loo. There are other scenarios which includes "Black Ops".
It's just that ATM the "Black Ops" are a bit too black.
o7
I actually don't think it's a good idea to simply trust the judgement of those promoting this initiative and they seem really unwilling to provide any real proof of botting or even the data that would indicate an attack through bots.
![PepelatziGravetzappa[ICU]](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/116/116681.jpg?1553527146){kind=avatar}
But this does not require proof, it is an act of goodwill of all pilots, neither now nor in the future not create such a threat. And if you do not agree to support it now, then you are the violator, unfortunately.
it is an admission that we do not want to be botters or cheaters and are deliberately talking about it. Or do you not admit it for yourself and want to say that you want to become a botter or a cheater?
and it doesn't stop you from playing any role in this game! You can be good, bad, whatever, but not a botter or a cheater.
Jane Turner
Volunteer Moderator
As I said a few posts back the only way players can perform that control function is to enforce PowerPlay or BGS actions only in open or incentivise them in that mode.
Responding as has been done by the MOD that you can control everything even from INARA is really absurd and shows how superficially the issue is addressed.
We all know that Inara is a third party site not affiliated with Frontier?
We know we're using the work of some guys for free to save face at Frontier when the developers themselves don't put this data directly into the game and do nothing to make these BOTs holed up in group and mod only?
Responding as has been done by the MOD that you can control everything even from INARA is really absurd and shows how superficially the issue is addressed.
We all know that Inara is a third party site not affiliated with Frontier?
We know we're using the work of some guys for free to save face at Frontier when the developers themselves don't put this data directly into the game and do nothing to make these BOTs holed up in group and mod only?
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