Any compensation incoming for non-exploiters?

[[PS4] Lorenzo Waringos]

They are toothless though. That's been known for a long, long time.

Which is weird because they moderate this forum quite ruthlessly (not a criticism) yet don’t carry that over into one of the games that the forum is here for.

 

[Cmdr Nemo]

Hello fellow commanders. The instantly replenishing LTD subsurface deposits mining frenzy is just the cherry on top of the general mining rewards fiasco (compared to other activities).
FDev trying hard to patch it, is a clear testament that its is NOT intended gameplay, and taking advantage of non-intended gameplay for personal benefit is the DEFINITION of exploiting.

So, as a loyal player with over 5500 hrs of non-exploitative gameplay and with hundreds of game extras purchased, I think I am entitled to ask a simple question to the developers:
Is there any compensation incoming to the people who chose to forfeit a tremendous in-game advantage and didn't exploit?
Or even, is there any penalty incoming to the ones who did exploit, and for example, earned themselves in a few days the luxury of buying and sustaining an FC for life?

I would really like to see FDev here not following the real life example that rewards exploiting and penalizes good ethos.
Thanks for your time.

How does one determine a player who utilizes exploits and one who just grinds. Though I'm in the process of switching from ED to SC. When I play ED, I invest up to 6 hours a day, and six days a week, thus simply grinding gets me a lot of cr's. Someone who doesn't play nearly as long can utilize exploits. The figures would show that we both have considerable cr's though one utilized exploits and the other not.

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

I suppose there is an up to it but what i dont get is why ppl still clog on this game especially in open considering the current fighter exploit.

I’m assuming people will eventually decide they have all the money in the world and just start playing normally,I just hope people don’t start demanding something to spend their vast wealth on because we’re not all trillions rich.

 

[Thepirateorc]

17 pages and we're still going.

I'm going to repeat myself and other people here.

The issue is entirely FD's fault and could have been avoided but it is too late now. You'd hope that lessons can be learned.

If I suddenly discover some procedure in the game today that allows me to generate 100m an hour by creating a set of circumstances that were never meant to really be part of the game, they should be get on it instantly.

What I mean by that is, acknowledge it instantly and publicly. Label it instantly. Is it a bug or an exploit? If they decide it is an exploit, they can state it as such and issue the warning that steps will be taken to recover any credits and assists gained in the period that the exploit was being used. Even if they are unable to fix the issue for months, they have laid the marker down to stay away and no one can complain later that they didn't know. In the case that some were doing it before FD discovered it, then I guess you have to let those people be but note that the axe has fallen now, you won't be punished for the activity before the statement but you surely will be for continuing after the statement.

As it is now, a huge number of people (apparently) have been using this method to gain money and it's now a complex mess. FD obviously didn't want the egg to be possible because thy have tried fixing it but without grabbing the nettle from the start, they now have no real right to start punishing players at this late stage. Draw a line under this one but act quicker next time to take control of it. Don't let it spiral into a situation where people think you're toothless because you're so reliant on the cash made from FC cosmetics.

I hope frontier do take action against those who have used this exploit, regardless if they didn't fix it properly that doesn't mean its ok to continue to exploit it.

 

[galahad2069]

I hope frontier do take action against those who have used this exploit, regardless if they didn't fix it properly that doesn't mean its ok to continue to exploit it.

Hey CMDR, have you ever seen Jameson's crashed Cobra? Wonderful place, and you can even find lots of juicy encoded materials there... you'll have relog a couple of times though, but dw, it's fdev approved gameplay.

 

[[PS4] Lorenzo Waringos]

I hope frontier do take action against those who have used this exploit, regardless if they didn't fix it properly that doesn't mean its ok to continue to exploit it.

But that is really the point I was making, to date FD have not named it an exploit, have not forbidden anyone to do it. If there is no law that has been broken, it's a pretty savage state of affairs to find yourself in court being fined.

 

[Morbad]

Being able to make the SSD's respawn by retreating 25+ kms from the rock is not any more absurd than sitting near Jameson's crashed Cobra, relogging and being able to fill your material storage to the rim with unobtanium level encoded thingies by rescanning all 4 data points without moving an inch.

I find this equally absurd, and am far from convinced it's Frontier's intent that these sites be used in this way. Indeed, I'm quite confident that if you could get an honest answer out of them, Braben and the original devs would reject the idea that relogging was intended to be a gameplay mechanism. The only difference between this behavior and the SSD respawn is that Frontier has expressed a more recent desire to limit the latter, apparently because they find it more disruptive.

Personally, I have at least the same sort of distaste for relogging to refresh resources as you do for healing beams or premium ammo, but I also see a clear lack of in-character context and intent to the former. I have made arguments for the latter not being very believable, even considering the rest of what's possible in Elite, but they don't overtly break the forth wall.

Those that exploited is on their consciences and not mine.

How a cheat feels about cheating doesn't change anything about the effects they have on the rest of the game, which is the only thing of relevance.

Dunno, carriers are actually pretty cool and they are behind grind wall of quite a lot of evenings spent mining. Interestingly they are pretty much the only thing that I could imagine being bought with real money credits.

Carriers have significant and unique utility and could be a hint of a worrying trend of credits becoming relevant again before credit supply issues have been addressed.

I was much less concerned with any exploit related to the acquisition of credits when credits meant relatively little and the potential upside from abuses to generate them was limited. Progression was a joke and many credit reward mechanisms were absurd, but doing anything could quickly max out one's ability to influence the BGS or other shared aspects of the game, so no one was really much better off for it. FCs have changed that.

Is it a bug or an exploit?

Being able to rapidly regenerate the contents of SSDs definitely appears to be unintended, making it a bug, and undesirable, making indulging in it a bug exploit rather than emergent content.

The payouts provided by LTDs and overlapping hotspots may be grossly imbalanced, but that doesn't automatically indicate it's unintentional or even undesirable.

But that is really the point I was making, to date FD have not named it an exploit, have not forbidden anyone to do it. If there is no law that has been broken, it's a pretty savage state of affairs to find yourself in court being fined.

If it's not working as intended and it's being used to generate and advantage, that's what a bug exploit is, by definition. A bug exploit is also a subset of cheat, because not everyone can be expected to abuse it, thus making the advantage it provides unequal and unfair. Cheating is against the written rules of the game. Players have all the information they need to divine that the SSD thing is an exploit and that abusing it is a theoretically punishable offense (Frontier's history on punishing such abuses being as spotty as it is, especially recently, is hardly a deterrent, however).

This is a far more clear cut scenario than many real-world legal systems, where instead of a few pages of mostly straightforward and common sense prohibitions, there are hundreds of thousands of pages of arcane legalese and obscure legal precedents, as well as the absurd situation where ignorance of the unknowable is not a valid defense.

 

[Vetinari]

Blaze your own trail....try not to get bothered by actions of other people, just play your own game.

I gave up mining after couple of VO cores got me a FDL, if people wanna shortcut gameplay and then complain theres nothing to do (or no reason to do it) thats up to them. If people want no challenge thats up to them.

theres more than enough in this game to keep me playing and thats all I need

P.S. I dont want any bonus, thats the point, I want it to be as hard as possible.

 

[Thepirateorc]

Hey CMDR, have you ever seen Jameson's crashed Cobra? Wonderful place, and you can even find lots of juicy encoded materials there... you'll have relog a couple of times though, but dw, it's fdev approved gameplay.

Right, but this fighter ssd isn't, whats your point?

 

[Thepirateorc]

But that is really the point I was making, to date FD have not named it an exploit, have not forbidden anyone to do it. If there is no law that has been broken, it's a pretty savage state of affairs to find yourself in court being fined.

Yes but it is a unintended way of making large sums of ltds by doing very little. If i remember correctly money was taken from those who did the fertiliser exploit, why should this be any different?

 

[Tyler-Rid]

No-one is getting any 'compensation' and no-one is getting 'punished'.

Nothing to see here, other than a company failing to maintain the integrity of it's own game.

 

[Florenus]

Yes but it is a unintended way of making large sums of ltds by doing very little. If i remember correctly money was taken from those who did the fertiliser exploit, why should this be any different?

Maybe it shouldn't be any different, but it's way (waaaaaaay) too late now.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Which is weird because they moderate this forum quite ruthlessly (not a criticism) yet don’t carry that over into one of the games that the forum is here for.

If I presume it's intentional it makes sense. Do whatever they want with the game based on what drives profit then control the narrative where they can to support those decisions. Alternative viewpoints get marginalized to smaller forums and Discords and can easily be shot down when they rise to the surface, usually through the cultivated apathy of the player base.

Essentially...

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

Why would you even care?
It makes no difference to your gameplay.
Never ceases to amaze me just how pedantic some people in this game are.

I beg to differ when I see a system map cluttered or get rammed by a Cutter-flying noob in the mailslot. Also, non-exploiters have no chance of getting a carrier because it was priced so.

Plus, I know it isn't considered a valid argument, but this game, that was about a long, evolving narrative (both personal and story/lore-wise) got butchered into a mining fleet carrier grindfest that is devoid any immersion. This was 80% of all community discussion in recent memory... A glorified mobile game.

 

[Frenotx]

Hello fellow commanders. The instantly replenishing LTD subsurface deposits mining frenzy is just the cherry on top of the general mining rewards fiasco (compared to other activities).
FDev trying hard to patch it, is a clear testament that its is NOT intended gameplay, and taking advantage of non-intended gameplay for personal benefit is the DEFINITION of exploiting.

So, as a loyal player with over 5500 hrs of non-exploitative gameplay and with hundreds of game extras purchased, I think I am entitled to ask a simple question to the developers:
Is there any compensation incoming to the people who chose to forfeit a tremendous in-game advantage and didn't exploit?
Or even, is there any penalty incoming to the ones who did exploit, and for example, earned themselves in a few days the luxury of buying and sustaining an FC for life?

I would really like to see FDev here not following the real life example that rewards exploiting and penalizes good ethos.
Thanks for your time.

So all of the people that choose not to exploit to get game-breaking amounts of income, are given game-breaking accounts of income as compensation? Seems a bit pointless to me, and like it would just exacerbate an already-large problem.

 

[Haradrim]

Remember, it's easy to say credits don't matter when you've been playing for a long time and/or took advantage of "issue" related credits.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

Remember, it's easy to say credits don't matter when you've been playing for a long time and/or took advantage of "issue" related credits.

Transration: If you're rich, you don't care. If you've been playing for fun, tough luck.

 

[Sup3rfluiD]

I beg to differ when I see a system map cluttered or get rammed by a Cutter-flying noob in the mailslot. Also, non-exploiters have no chance of getting a carrier because it was priced so.

Plus, I know it isn't considered a valid argument, but this game, that was about a long, evolving narrative (both personal and story/lore-wise) got butchered into a mining fleet carrier grindfest that is devoid any immersion. This was 80% of all community discussion in recent memory... A glorified mobile game.

I sort of agree , the system clutter is a bit meh.
As far as getting rammed by garbage tier pilots in cutters, thats been happening for ever and isnt going to change any time soon.
For the exploit itself, if you dont like it - dont do it.
I dont have the funds for a FC either and grinding on mining isnt something im willing to do to change this, I'd rather be broke but happy.
I'll just keep shooting the circle.

 

[gorankar]

Yes but it is a unintended way of making large sums of ltds by doing very little. If i remember correctly money was taken from those who did the fertiliser exploit, why should this be any different?

The SLF method is faster than mapped SSD mining, but not so much faster that it really changes outcomes. 300-500M an hour vs. 400-800M an hour.
So should Fdev take only half? Those people would have still been mining during that time if SLF mining was not available. They could have made half or so as much in the same time.
People keep acting like this is some holy grail method that is the only way to make hundreds of millions an hour mining. It's not. And Fdevs proposed fix seems to be aimed at the market and not the acquisition of LTD. Which does make more sense in that context. They are nerfing LTD mining profits all the way around, not just the Egg worshipers.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Just... what do you do with all that money? Swim in it like Scrooge McDuck?