AOE/California sector Thargoid Choice project.

[Mas s_1nhibited]

DO YOU WANT TO PLAY YOUR WAY?

About the AOE the Allied Order of Exemplars:

We are a small, specialist and casual group of very experienced xbox (recently expanded to PC) players that have been living and working the California sector since the placement of the PMF the Allied order of Exemplars in california sector BV-Y C7. Our Roleplay ideology is based around concepts of altruism, liberty and transhumanism. We restict ourselves to lawful gameplay, we have a hidden and outspoken history of opposition to the Club, The Thargoid war and Aegis. We do not gank, and we are accepting of other playstyles including AX and piracy though we do not do AX ourselves. This is why we are a small group and are happy to keep it that way. We have helped forge agreements with the groups living in the Pleiades and therefore have a certain amount of goodwill and protection from them and our Alliance Allies.

The Choice project

What is the Choice project?

We are attempting to gather as much information and voices as we can, that sympathise with with the thargoid race. We are looking for any and all groups with interest to contact us either by our discord discussion channel or have their say via this thread. Media outlets can contact us via existing embassies within the Alioth Council - this is to avoid bias issues.

In particular we are looking for input from any players that:
1. Accept that the initial Pleiades, Aegis and Sirius expansions into the witchhead have escalated the conflict and directly caused loss of "human" life
2. Are concerned about the lack of consequential gameplay presented to this minority group.

This represents a broad part of the community and that is our hope.
We cant do anything in game to change the current scenario via gameplay - and even we could we accept that this is a minority community.
A revival of pro-goid agendas will present gameplay for both sides of the divide.

Our question is: Is this a minority community because the gameplay is forcing everyone to play the AX way? And how can we change that? What would you like to see?

Why link it to the California nebula:

Only recently has the California sector been invaded by Thargoids despite the presence of meta-alloys in the region. The first incursion was focused solely on California Freeport after Sirius pushed assets into the sector. Now we are faced with a full scale invasion as a direct result of Salvation's actions in Cornsair something which we(AOE) cannot do a single thing about.

The presence of a Thargoid Barnacle in a warehouse within Mic Turner Base (odyssey) and the perceived lack of attackable assets within current thargoid capabilities. Could mean the area could stand as a beacon of hope for those seeking eventual communication and coexistence in both lore and the Community. This of course is beyond our control and is subject to future narratives.

Our location as the only PMF gifted with a location in this part of - up until recently - peaceful Thargoid space implies we not only have the prerogative but also the visual profile to begin a discussion on sympathetic issues without great fear of reprisal due to distance, limited assets and firm major faction allies that are highly active within the AX community. Any group or commander that wishes to remain anonymous can contact us, join our discord (link below) under an anonymous nick if you wish and we will pass on their views or ideas as far up the chain as we can.

The nebula has been a forgotten part of the galaxy for many years in development terms. We have suffered a string of difficult and bugged CGs with no clear end result, have had a broken 1 faction BGS system, missions are limited, the passenger route that we maintained for the players is now broken, expansions are locked both by distance and hardlock - The sector reeks of deficiency of potential. The california sector is a simile to the lack of meaningful interaction we can do with thargoids that doesn't involve shooting them.

We are aware that for some Major Faction politics is an important part of the game. The California sector started as an Alliance NPC colonisation and we promote friendly relations with the Kumo council and have welcomed them into the sector as a valid way to fix the BGS and provide colour and resources to the region. We do not wish this project to be bogged down in faction politics.

We have requested California BV-Y C7 be a no fire AX zone publicly and privately within the relevant AX groups. This cannot be enforced of course (and will likely be opposed by rogue AX factions), but is part of an ongoing experiment into the nature of the incursions we are experiencing in our home system.

 

[Julian McCoy]

As the leader of one of the longest-serving pro-Thargoid player groups, you have my wholehearted support on this!
Through tireless campaigning, I've learned one thing - If we want pro-Thargoid content, then we're going to have to unite and make our voices heard together.

We might be a minority, but that doesn't mean we don't matter. If we can get some sort of friendly or even just more non-hostile Thargoid gameplay alongside the existing (and likely planned expansions of) AX gameplay, then everybody can have their preferred content and their own 'personal narrative', without negatively impacting others.

I've done everything from participating in the earliest research days of the Unknown Artefacts surrounding Merope, to feeding Interceptors meta-alloys, to actively assisting Thargoids in AX conflict zones against both player and NPC ships. It's time we got some actual, concrete mechanics instead of being relegated to a small niche group that's continuously forced to think and act outside the box to accommodate our preferred playstyle. The existing mechanics and behaviours are so subtle that most can't even tell they exist, unless they're explicitly told what to look for and what to assess for changes based on their actions.

I definitely hope something comes of this, and I look forward to participating!

 

[Greyskin87]

I only recently got in contact with AOE and your movement, but it’s one of the most interesting things I’ve seen so far (plus, the members and the community you’re gathering are merry and fun).

I truly hope there will be a follow-up for this playstyle! I’ll eagerly look forward for the next endeavors

o7
CMDR Greyskin87

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

I only recently got in contact with AOE and your movement, but it’s one of the most interesting things I’ve seen so far (plus, the members and the community you’re gathering are merry and fun).

I truly hope there will be a follow-up for this playstyle! I’ll eagerly look forward for the next endeavors

o7
CMDR Greyskin87

Thankyou but i dont think we represent the whole playstyle, there are many things we wont do that others in the goid camp do, and often do better. I have many friends that started in the goid camp but left, including squadron members. We are also meeting pvp-aax along the way, seeing Drew Wagar leave the community was also a shock to me..

I have my own opinions on goids, but im trying to play moderator and host.

I do think its very important to reeniforce the idea that this isnt a thread on strategy, or a mission. Whether one playstyle is better, even Salvation VS tanner because there are sympathisers royally confused and supporting all sides of the conflict for social and gameplay reasons.

As soon as we try to direct action, we alienate someone. Its a game its in everyone's best interest that we all have fun.

Direct suggestions to the developers would be welcomed in this thread.. just im gonna try to stay neutral.

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

lets have AX get involved in this too - at least on this thread - reviving the progoid community need not just be for pro-goids.

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

anonymous statement:

(OOC disclaimer: this post is made in-character, with a few meta-game references; grievances directed at developers are based on external appearances, and I accept the possibility that these grievances might be necessary for the integrity of the story; that being said, no offense to them; Elite is great, but it can be better)

If you've ever done AX combat at all, chances are you might have met me at some point. I've had SPEAR, ATR, and every concievable squadron police force called on me more times than I can count. I've eaten some expensive rebuys and bailouts, but they were more than covered by the rebuys, AX bonds and time I've cost others. (in short I hunt AX-equipped pilots to protect Thargoids). I've tried being a friendly sport with people at first. People, in return, have bullied me for my choice of ship, for my choice in lore, for my tactics, have slandered me with overblown rumors. And yet, despite all of that, I persist.

Humans are the villains in this story, with every conflict being traceable back to a human being the instigator, and the way the mass-media and the community portrays Thargoids is criminally reductive. At first glance, even the development and narrative teams seem to be guilty of this bias (I might be wrong but that's just how it looks from my angle), where Thargoids are nothing more than a Hollywoodian enemy for the "heroes" to shoot at.

The story choices we're given, on the surface, seem to be just choosing between "shoot Thargoids" and "nuke Thargoids". The rewards for helping defeat Thargoids are experimental weaponry and mountains of money. The rewards for anything remotely positive regarding Thargoids is a severely underpowered missile replica and a decal... a ship. sticker. That was already in the game. The way the story is decided by the majority as well as what content gets added in response based strictly on "popular demand" is flawed, because this will always result in the more morally dubious or overall unsatisfactory choices.

In spite of this, in spite of all of this, I yet persist, forever helping the Thargoids, forever siding with a bunch of uncommunicative NPC's who might never get to show me gratitude in return, due to player and developer neglect. Why? There is no why, as far as others are concerned. This struggle and end-goal is one of the things that make me happy and satisfied in the game, despite appearances of "saltiness". In the end, I fully support your movement, and will help as much as I am able to. And I want every person who is or has fought Thargoids to watch their back.

end of message

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

Anonymous Statement

Thargoids have never struck me as a peaceful race given they'll blast humans for carrying guardian technology. But then again maybe if we found they were open to peace and communication then it'd be much more preferable to them burning our stations every few months.

As a prolific Thargoid exterminator, I say we're certainly not a peaceful race. But in my first interaction with the Thargoids, I wasn't the one who opened fire first. I would be open to peace if the Thargoids showed any inkling they are too, but based on what we see in game, they're on the war path. I think our relations with the Thargoids will always be limited by how Fdev choose to present them, but I'd certainly prefer peaceful cooperation with them if given the choice.

I think the reason so many of us partake in AX combat is because there is no alternative, I don't mean no alternative as in we're forced to, I mean it's the only proper interaction with goids available to us.

Message end

Anonymous Statement

Kinda a missed opportunity in my mind that our first interaction with another space traveling species is exclusively combat and destructive for both parties. The Thargoids have superior qualities, just as well as we do. They have regenerative qualities which could be interesting takes on medicines and suits, possibly better life support, etc. They seem to be able to travel through which space differently than us, perhaps farther. They look to have tremendous planetary excavation skills which could be useful to us. This is mostly stuff from observations I've made of the game so far. Currently, we just shoot them :/.
We met an semi-intelligent being in our galaxy and all we get to do is shoot them currently
It's just, personally disappointing.

Message End

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

AX conflict zones seem to hold the most issues for both sides. What improvements could be made?

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

Anonymous Statement

points for improving AXCZ's and Thargoid behavior:

- Diversify the behaviour of the Thargoid ships. Aggro should no longer be default for scouts and when inside AX conflict zones.

- An aggroed Thargoid should also not have aggro towards player ships that didn't shoot it, and this includes Thargoid ships inside the AXCZ, since their ships have no way of telling whether you've signed up for the CZ until you shoot them.

-I expressly do not wish for direct, in-ship feedback of our reputation with the Goids going up, because that would not make sense, in-lore. Thargoid ships can't interface with ours yet, so they can't give us a +rep for being good boys, and the ship isn't supposed to be able to know if a Thargoid should be shown as green on the radar with the tech we currently have: However, I believe that there should be a game-internal invisible meter for our reputation with the Thargoids, which should go up when killing or routing anyone who is signed up for the AX side, as well as killing ships that Thargoids are aggroed against, the latter of which could be implemented with an invisible bounty system (the only way I know of to increase rep with a particular faction through murder outside of a CZ). This reputation meter should be reflected in each Thargoid ship's behaviour. Thargoids determine your reputation either automatically and immediately, in CZ's, or after scanning you in a non-urgent context (NHSS or hyperdiction).

I will now describe how I think their behaviour should change depending on the reputation meter:

-Neutral rep is the current Thargoid behavior

-unfriendly will make neutral Thargoids in the instance more trigger-sensitive towards you. As soon as you are scanned, the Thargoid will release an EMP, and they will immediately be aggressive if you carry Thargoid or Guardian cargo, (demanding response -> hostile respone) and will go into "demanding mode" if you're carrying Meta-Alloys (begging response -> demanding response)

-hostile will cause aggro on sight or post-scan plus immediately calling reinforcements depending on the player's combat skill rank. (e.g. Hydra for Elite commander);

-cordial will cause Scouts to no longer be aggro on sight;

-friendly makes Interceptors forgive first minor transgressions, such as bumping or stray bullets, with a yellow light and specific sound to indicate a warning. ALSO, research limpets no longer aggro Thargoids and do not count as an aggression;

-ally makes Interceptors have a chance to drop "clean" Thargoid goods, including hearts, after they've scanned you, with increased chances when giving them Meta-Alloys. ALSO, Thargoids will attack non-allied and non-Thargoid ships that you are currently being attacked by.; Obviously, dropping cargo to Thargoids that they want to pick up increases rep, proportionally to how much they want it minus how angry they are that you have it on you. Meta Alloys are the best in that regard. In conclusion to the reputation segment, increasing your rep with Thargoids can be generalized to "increasing proportionally with how much they like what you're doing for them"

end of message

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

ok moving on: Over the coming days ill be canvassing the community for ideas regarding "Pacifist Thargoid Interactions", ill try to restrict my posts to one a day henceforth so people can have a chance to input on this.

If you are uncomfortable talking about this topic on the forums, you can dm me and ill post it up verbatim as long as your statement doesn't break Frontier TOS.

 

[Coehoorn]

Good luck.

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

First off sorry for the wait.. that said we have a few ideas for discussion.

New Passive interactions

Most of the people i have talked to on discord have expressed a wish to have more passive interactions with Thargoids within the game however many are so indifferent to the possibility of this happening we have found that it has been hard to get as many ideas rolling as i hoped. That said, we have a few to present here:

1. Thargoid de-escalation/deterrent module: This device would be useful to all players within the game; Upon activation it will send a subsonic signal much like an emp and change the player's status to friendly for a period of time. This will allow further interactions with the Thargoid ships including visual reconnaissance, research limpets, collection of nearby materials, meta-alloy feeding. It could also be used by pilots for escape and First strike setup.

2. Cipher interactions: With the popularity of cipher puzzles within the game there are many opportunities for community involvement in decoding Thargoid comms. There are a number of ways this could be implemented; Xeno scanners, simple scan display fragments, guardian science facilities, new "probe" interactions, Harmonic modulation within the sound sources, Encoded into thargoid light displays. With a little work and imagination its possible to involve the community in a meaningful way.

3. Kernel Mode Discovery scanner: An additional mode or module allowing the discovery scanner to highlight specific points of interest for hunters and scientists. This could involve threat and composition analysis of NHSS and potential points of interest within a star system that specifically relates to Thargoids.

4. XENO EWS: This system will allow pilots to detect incoming Thargoid signatures either to assist within AX zones or Scientific activities.

5. Pro-goid community goals: There is strong feeling within the community that community goals regarding Thargoids should include those players that want a non-aggressive stance within the Game. Up until this point CGs have either been heavily biased in terms of module rewards or presented in such a way that AX is inevitable, this is also a general criticism of the way the narrative has been presented as "Every choice could be a violent one". The inclusion of AEGIS in any way is a deterrent to peace campaigners; whom often have been developing years of "personal narrative" of resistance to "the Club". The disenfranchised pro-goid community want a single choice cg.

 

[Julian McCoy]

With the recent (and still currently active) CG for Alba Tesreau working alongside Ram Tah, it seems like we are indeed somewhat being listened to! I hope we get more CGs of this nature in the future so that we have something to do alongside preaching on the forums/system chat/local chat, but this is a very positive first step in recognising our community/playstyle/viewpoint whatever you want to call it.

It was a real breath of fresh air to be able to tell people, 'the exact NPC we were hoping to see has made an appearance and has a job for us, let's get moving!' instead of 'oh it's just another anti-Thargoid CG that we're all forbidden from participating in, take another break this week guys...'

Major kudos to FDev for finally giving the pro-Thargoid/not-AX-oriented community a CG of our own, and especially for doing it in the exact way/with the exact NPC we wanted them to!

 

[Mas s_1nhibited]

Though to be honest I would prefer them take the time to develop a legitimate character or two that can stand for both non-AX parties. Such as a Fargod representative, and an independent science body that may be above AEGIS links.

 

[Julian McCoy]

Though to be honest I would prefer them take the time to develop a legitimate character or two that can stand for both non-AX parties. Such as a Fargod representative, and an independent science body that may be above AEGIS links.

I think they're now trying to do that with Tesreau, as she's distancing herself from AEGIS enough to be independent.

Now we know more about what Salvation's weapon, we know it has a frequency, okay if something has a frequency you can jam it, thoughts on anti-Salvation stuff in future?