Are there any plans for allowing SRV in multicrew?

[Godsailsaqueen]

Putting new stuff in multicrew wont bring money.

I agree and understand, but turning multi-crew (or any other mechanic really) into a stable, complete experience would make the game more successful, maybe. To how many gamers did I confess my real interest for elite, and how many "dunno, it feels a bit shallow to me..." did I receive. I feel a complete set of multi-crew capabilities could have been a nice display - now it's just "oh, and, you know, another player can man turrets in 3rd person... if that's his thing...". I don't think it would bring money at all - if horizons was not a season.

edit : see answer below, more comprehensible

 

[Friedenreich Xante]

Putting new stuff in multicrew wont bring money.

Neither will 2.4, in fine, but new funtions make the game more attractive, or will at least Trigger some positive Reviews that may attract new customers.

 

[Jason Lightning]

i think having more hanger space should come to play when we have more differant types of SRV.

also, if we get hangers with printable SRVs, i would also like an SRV hanger that cant print, but has a much lower mass.
so i could put one on my racer ships with not to much downsides.
if i would smack on a hanger on my icourier, it goes from 830ms to 670ms

That's likely because you either have weapons/shields, a heavy A-rated FSD, and/or not enough lightweight engineering. To have maximum speed and a SRV hangar you need to make some compromises to stay at minimum mass, that or more engineering to lose weight or have a better optimal mass to multiplier roll.

 

[Kelfaur]

Neither will 2.4, in fine, but new funtions make the game more attractive, or will at least Trigger some positive Reviews that may attract new customers.

My thoughts exactly. I play with a few others and we love the multicrew function with our Anacondas and Cutters, being gunners and using the fighters. Sometimes it's just nice to go along for the ride, but the implementation just feels like it really isn't reaching it's potential. I was on a planet surface last night gathering materials for the engineers and a friend said it's a pitty I can't jump in your other SRV and help you collect stuff, as an example.

 

[Furnace]

Myself and my wingman play a lot in multicrew, mostly combat. Is there any indication on whether they will expand the multicrew functionality to allow things such as taking out SRVs in a multicrewed ship and perhaps allowing a crewman to pilot your ship whilst you're in a fighter?

Not a word so far from Devs. :|

I think even bigger flaw at the moment is not being able to change your ship / access outfitting menu when in multi-crew. Forcing you to end a multi-crew session and re-invite your crew back just for the sake of adding a cargo rack for example is not something you should be doing!

I do not think Frontier wanted multi-crew to function this way. I just hope they sort out whatever is causing unwanted behavior with SRV's and the above mentioned.

 

[Terry Bruge-Hiplo]

Then they first need to make the SRV hanger print new ones like the SLF hanger does..

Don't remember the sauce, but I recall Sandy mentioning liking that idea during a live stream a while back...?

Multicrew SRVs would be great.

 

[Arconedas]

I would definately like to see multicrew SRVs (2 SRVs on planet at the same time). Also it would not be a bad idea to allow multicrew synthesis on a ship. Someone has already grinded the needed resources anyway and i doubt it would be very 'unbalancing', even if the other player would just drop by and do the required synthesis (using his own materials) and leave.

 

[GilliganTX]

I've been trying to get my little brother into the game. He loves astronomy and physics and sci fi stuff.


I bought him the horizon's expansion while it was on steam-sale, and he jumped onto the bridge of an anaconda I had loaded out specifically for multi-crew (Including, as I had assumed it would be functional, 2 SRV's). He said he was REALLY interested in going down to a planet and driving around with the SRV.

We were very dismayed to find out this wasn't possible in multi-crew.


After a few frustrating minutes of trying to invite him to a wing (unsuccessfully) so we could try something else, he got bored and we played ESO for a few hours instead.

 

[Mengy]

My guess is that FD genuinely don't know how to do it. To us it might seem simple but i genuinely believe that their are reasons FD cannot find a way to make this work.

This is probably partly true. Frontier coded themselves into a corner with multicrew and the SLF/SRV mechanics. In multicrew the players never actually leave the bridge, as the SLF is controlled via telepresence. Getting an SLF destroyed simply means you wait in your chair on the bridge for a new one to get constructed and then re-launch again. SRV's are different though, they are not telepresence but the commander physically leaves the ship to drive them, and if the SRV blows up then the commander goes with it, re-spawning back in the ship if possible or meeting the rebuy screen if the ship is already gone. Multicrew is incapable of handling this as it currently is coded, all players are in the ship full time and only risk death if the ship is destroyed. A player in multicrew can not leave their seats, and thus they can not enter the SRV to drive it, let alone pop back and forth if an SRV is destroyed.

I'm sure it's possible to change the code to allow multicrew SRV capability, but it wouldn't be easy to implement given how they've designed all of these mechanics as separate unconnected features. If the various features had been designed with more consistency it would have been easier, now it's a difficult hurdle to overcome unfortunately.

My personal opinion is we won't see multicrew SRV's until space legs is a thing, years from now at the earliest.

 

[SentineI]

Myself and my wingman play a lot in multicrew, mostly combat. Is there any indication on whether they will expand the multicrew functionality to allow things such as taking out SRVs in a multicrewed ship and perhaps allowing a crewman to pilot your ship whilst you're in a fighter?

I'm under the impression that they wanted to do it, but technical issues prevented them. I think it is something to do with how flying the ship & piloting the SRV are implemented; most probably the player IS the ship, so when they 'enter' the SRV (really become the SRV) their ship is replaced by a simple NPC ship (with it's own logic). That means a multicrew player cannot stay inside the player's ship, because it (effectively) ceases to exist, as far as the game engine is concerned.

Whether they can solve those issue, or are willing to invest in the effort required to, remains to be seen... I guess they will need to solve it eventually (*), but maybe not for another season or two. (* For Space Legs; in the original Kickstarter, David Braben talked about wanting to allow other players to steal your ship while you were docked at a space station.)

 

[Eros]

I spoke to the Sandro at the bar at Lavecon, and ChrisH you are basically right. It all boils down to how the game issues ownership of the objects, the commander is in essence his/her ship and when moving to the SRV the ship is still owned by you but is an asset that doesn't have to be at the same location (hence not dying when your ship is blown up on surface while still out in your SRV). It is a coding corner, though was described as, not at all insurmountable but would require some non-trivial changes under the hood.

In multi-crew, you can have two fighters out, piloted by the human crew. These have a maximum range which I believe is defined by the island volume. Correct me if i am wrong but basically if a fighter pilot trys to leave the island, it is deemed as out of range and the fighter is destroyed in order to keep the player from creating a new instance (since remember, it is a requirement that all crew are in the same instance)... remember as helm of a multi-crew ship, YOU HAVE TO REMAIN HELM

Multi-crew fighters - The rules
1) Helm remains helm at all times
1a) To upgrade this, we have to be able to go AI crew member for helm control
2) Fighters do not carry cargo, and do not have cargo scoops - no cargo objects ownership issues
3) Finite range in order to remain on same network instance and not create network shenanigans
4) Pew pew pew!
5) Can call to dock and have the bay opened.

Now the same would be true for SRVs on surface, except, they have to deal with slightly different circumstances.

1) An SRV has a range of what ever fuel it has, do we want to only be able to explore say... 20km of surface around a ship? No we want a multi-crew SRV to be equal to a normal one.
2) An SRV has cargo, and can pick up materials... whos materials are they? whos cargo is it?... We want the functionality to be identical, so ownership of goods has to be the helm... but wait... all network markers etc would say its the crew members?
3) Synthesis... see point 1 and 2
4) An SRV under multi-crew MUST be able to drive away from the host ship, and be able to come back to it, IE, helm and crew must always be in the same instance or guarantee to get back in the same instance
5) All members of the crew WANT to be able to drive an SRV
6a) If all members of the crew can drive an SRV and one of them is destroyed... the crew member would now be alone in orbit if the ship is dismissed?
6b) If all members of the crew are out in SRVs and one quits, does the SRV explode?
6c) If all members of the crew are out in SRVs and one wants return to the ship, can they? and once the SRV is returned, what can they/do they do?
7) Points 6) go away if helm always remains on board, breaking point 5) unless other rules are in place.


overall it is just more complicated in terms of cause affect and outcome, and as was said to me, "We know what the issues are, because we are silent, doesn't mean things are not being worked on, but more often than not, some of the more fundamental changes have to take longer to ensure we do not accidentally break other things in the process." So yeah, honestly, i read that as, it is what it is for now, they would like to change it, but if it was to be changed, it would be part of a big QOL fix so, not super soon.

 

[GilliganTX]

I can accept helm is locked to helm (break rule 5) if crew members can SRV-roam by SLF rules.

All cargo/mats belong to to the helm.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

Putting new stuff in multicrew wont bring money.

Duly +1'd

 

[SentineI]

Putting new stuff in multicrew wont bring money.

Sure it will, if FDev want the game to be successful in the longer term:

FDev has a limited market to sell the game too (esp. now that it's released for all current consoles), so they will sell a lot initially & then that drops away. New features may temporarily boost sales, but it's a case of diminishing returns. Eventually FDev will have to expend huge amounts of PR effort to gain a handful of new sales from people who aren't so enthused by the idea of flying a spaceship.

What FDev needs to do is get existing customers to spend more money. Either through cosmetic extras from their shop, or from buying the next season/dlc for the game. But if FDev has alienated their existing players by repeatedly releasing rubbish features (and then never fixing/improving them), it's unlikely those existing players will spend any more money.

So at some point FDev will need to start chasing their existing player base more than trying to get new players. And that means they need existing players to be happy. Which means they need to spend some time & effort (& money) on fixing existing features (like say MultiCrew or, dare I say it, PowerPlay). Which they already have done to an extent, e.g. 2.0's features have been gradually fixed & improved in 2.1 & 2.2 (and even a little in 2.3)

 

[GilliganTX]

Sure it will, if FDev want the game to be successful in the longer term:

FDev has a limited market to sell the game too (esp. now that it's released for all current consoles), so they will sell a lot initially & then that drops away. New features may temporarily boost sales, but it's a case of diminishing returns. Eventually FDev will have to expend huge amounts of PR effort to gain a handful of new sales from people who aren't so enthused by the idea of flying a spaceship.

What FDev needs to do is get existing customers to spend more money. Either through cosmetic extras from their shop, or from buying the next season/dlc for the game. But if FDev has alienated their existing players by repeatedly releasing rubbish features (and then never fixing/improving them), it's unlikely those existing players will spend any more money.

So at some point FDev will need to start chasing their existing player base more than trying to get new players. And that means they need existing players to be happy. Which means they need to spend some time & effort (& money) on fixing existing features (like say MultiCrew or, dare I say it, PowerPlay). Which they already have done to an extent, e.g. 2.0's features have been gradually fixed & improved in 2.1 & 2.2 (and even a little in 2.3)

After this past week of trying and failing to enjoy multi-crew, I can't say it's a feature I'm going to suggest to anyone when talking about the game.




Literally everything I wanted to do with multi-crew isn't an option.

Have my wife on board, playing with me, get to command her to "Plot a course for the [Sol] system, prepare for warp.... Engage."

Can't be done.


Have my wife on board, running the gunner spot, and wing up with my good friend to go enjoy a Haz Rez.

Can't be done.



Take my little brother, who really wants to enjoy this game, and really wanted to mess around on a planet surface, down to a planet surface in my anaconda, two SRV's ready to go and explore.

Can't be done.


Hell, I even just tried inviting my friend (mentioned above) on board to see what someone with some game experience could do in the chair.

He kept getting booted from the spot after about 15 seconds.



What is even the point of multi-crew? What can you do with it? Seems completely [COMPLETELY] useless. I am very disappointed.

 

[SentineI]

What is even the point of multi-crew?

Cynically: To tick an extra box when comparing ED's features against Star Citizens. (Never mind the experience is/will-be entirely different, as you point out.)

Less cynically: It sounded like a good idea on paper, so they committed to it... But later, when they came to actually implement it, they realised it would have all sorts of limitations due to the way Elite Dangerous works, and had to make the best of it. We can only hope they gradually improve it, rather than stopping development of it (like PowerPlay, CQC/Arena, etc) because people stopped playing it.

On the plus side, Multi Crew caused them to develop procedurally-generated faces for NPCs (and the associated revamping of the mission system) which are great improvements.

 

[Drelthar]

Yeah, I really hope they figure out a way round the problem.

I think mainly, it's because it wasn't originally implemented in the way the SLF's were. Those were clearly implemented with multicrew in mind (well, with the way they were going to have to do multicrew, anyway, I'm sure they dreamed about SRV multicrew when making hte SRV originally, but they probably hadn't done enough testing to know all the technical details about the instance which requires SLF's to stay withing X meters of the mother ship for instance)

So, yep, let's hope they figure out how to handle it, it seems partly technical, partly design really.

 

[SentineI]

We got some kind of reply on this issue (even if not much of one):

2. Adding two SRVs for Multicrew is certainly something that has been requested by the community previously and it's been passed on to the dev teams. While I wouldn't imagine its implementation to come in the immediate future, it's certainly a nice idea and something that the dev team are aware of for consideration among other great community suggestions and requests.

source: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...d-the-forums?p=5717378&viewfull=1#post5717378

 

[Mengy]

We got some kind of reply on this issue (even if not much of one):

source: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...d-the-forums?p=5717378&viewfull=1#post5717378

Yep, so great idea, they'd love to do it, no ETA's, and no guarantees!

 

[Drelthar]

Yep, so great idea, they'd love to do it, no ETA's, and no guarantees!

Is your "Where is the love" Avatar getting old and faded due to lack of love?
I