Bulkhead and core modifications

[4brkfast]

There are a few suggestions pertaining to this and I'll try to sort them all out in a concise and readable way.

This is about modifying the core or bulkhead of the ship itself.

For example, maybe a long range modification would include trading space for a bigger fsd slot by giving up other internal space.

Trading optional internal spaces for larger, smaller, trading for larger or smaller core modules as well is the base idea

Included would be some combat modifications too. Trading a size 4 hardpoint and internal to modify the bulkhead to receive a 'Spinal mount' modification. Like the A10 jet, the ship would be fitted around a large, maybe size 5 gun of some kind. Trade offs would be obvious in heat and losing internal and other hard point spots, weight etc.

Although the spinal mount could be applied to smaller ships scaled appropriately.

This suggestion is not refined, I haven't thought over the options but I think it would be a cool addition to further push for unique ships of many kinds.

Thanks for reading

 

[Deleted member 115407]

Hmm... I'm not feeling it, OP.

Let's see what some other folks have to say though.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

The same thing. The game doesn't need more engineering - it needs less of it. Also I don't think butchering the module system would do any good. It barely works as it is and adding even more power to the status quo won't help. Next thing we hear is "NPCs are too easy!" and the vicious cycle goes on and on.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

For example, maybe a long range modification would include trading space for a bigger fsd slot by giving up other internal space.

One of the problems with this is that the steps between some of the modules are pretty substantial.

Going up an FSD size approximately doubles range, for instance. (G5 long range, for contrast, gives you a bit over 50% extra). It would be difficult to see what you could give up to make that balanced, on most ships - especially on a long-range exploration ship where most of the other modules will be undersized for their slots anyway.

Conversely with Sensors or Life Support being able to reduce the slot size would actually be an advantage.

Externals changes would require a new hull model anyway for each possible variation - so they might as well do those as a separate ship.

 

[Burke]

Whatever you did that would help other ships would just push the anaconda further ahead. That wouldnt be good.

 

[Sylow]

It barely works as it is and adding even more power to the status quo won't help. Next thing we hear is "NPCs are too easy!" and the vicious cycle goes on and on.

Ah. Don't worry there. Look at the recent changes of CZs. NPCs by now have some engineering. Far from what we players can pack, but at least some. And immediately we had plenty of complaints that NPCs now are too hard to kill there. I still think that FD should give all NPCs engineered outfits on par to what we players by now field.

Within hours we'd have rivers of tears everywhere. And perhaps, just perhaps, then there'd be a chance to nerf much of the engineered stuff, to get things back into scale. Too bad that this will never happen.

Outside of that, i agree: there's already enough engineering and power creep going around. We don't need even more. And especially i'd be very careful on the idea of allowing players to tool around on their optional internals.

As an exercise for everybody who doesn't know why i think so: go to one of the ship builder tools we have online. Add a big HRP. Check the hull strength. Now replace that one HRP, with as many smaller HRPs till they add to the same grade. See how much hull strength the ship now has. Bonus points: now play with the engineering feature. See what happens on a ship with one fully enginered big HRP, compared to many fully engineered small HRPs.

So really, about anything which would allow me to modify internals would also allow me to squeeze a pile more of survivability out of my ships. But while of course many people would love to have hard to destroy ships, keep in mind that everybody (and in theory also all NPCs) would be able to use that feature. So before asking for anything like this, also ponder if you'd really enjoy fighting NPCs which have several times the hull strength they currently have.

 

[4brkfast]

Without engineering this game wouldn't be half what it is. Without engineering you don't have unique or specialized ships. You don't have long range jumpers or high ballistic velocity weaponry. Without the engineering which everybody seems to hate so much, why bother playing? How does adding content make it worse? Don't you want more? More ships? More modules and weapons? More varieties and options? Seems like a no brainer to me.

Do any of you guys even like the game? By these responses it seems no to me.

I stand by this suggestion and others as it will add more content and improve the customization of the various vessel archetypes. Which to me is one of the biggest motivations; the next ship you want to build.

I would only hope a developer reads this as this fits the m.o. of the game. And with luck the viewpoint of biased, negative or narrow minded, unimaginative folk wont influence those that have made this game into what it is and what makes it fun.

 

[Sylow]

Matter of taste. I very much enjoy the game. Else I sure wouldn't be playing it any more. But for me the game actually was better before engineering came around. Ships had more distinct profiles, a bigger variety of ships actually was useful than it is now. A good pilot in a smaller ship still had a fighting chance, as there was no blunt +700% shields nonsense.

In contrast, engineers are terrible. When they were implemented, they were a pure catastrophy. A lot of fixing was done to by now make them bearable, but still not fun. Making them actually fun would require the whole system to be reworked from ground up, instead of some adjustments here and there. But alas, they are bearable, which is fine enough. What's still left is the massive power creep, and i still wish this to be cut down. I mean, even +10% or +15% on firepower and defense would be huge. But no, we have to have +70% on weapons pure damage and +700% on effective shield strength, along with massive improvements of agility, more frequent boost, higher weapon recharge (resulting in even more firepower upgrade), etc.

Before engineering, people had to pick and select what to use. Heat and power limitations actually forced you to specialize. There was no "max to every aspect", as you can do now. Which actually means that there was -more- variety at those times. I'd so much prefer now, if you would have to decide when engineering: You could engineer for like +30% firepower. Or for +30% defenses. Or you could try a mix of +10% firepower, +15% agility, +5% defense. Or anything in between, depending on your personal taste and preferences. But that's not what we have. Most of my ships are just upgraded to the limit, no pick and choose, no careful calculation. Unlike in old times, this is just not necessary any more.

Instead we have pure power creep. And yes, i still play the game despite engineers. There's good new things there. I personally like the new FSS. I really like the new core mining. (I have more than enough credits, i really don't need to earn any more. Would somebody have told me half a year ago, that i'd spend most of my time mining in ED now and having fun while doing it, i would've declared him to be insane. Now, since Xmas, i did just that. ) But mostly i play because i find the base game to be fun. I so much enjoy just flying the spaceships here. They are well done and fun. But the engineering system is one of the things i despise. I engineer my ships as the advantages are just too big to ignore, but i don't enjoy the system.